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well we sure as hell didn't replace Gary, not even close, we played like crap because Barry's schemes where crap, and finally Barry for some reason changed up his schemes, probably because his players where so frustrated and fed up they called a meeting with Lafluer and forced him to change
since the bye we've seen more spirited play from every position on the defense, major jump in play from Clark, Douglas, Amos, Alexander, and you think coaching did that?
Sooooo, I post about coaching vrs talent.
You accept my points that talent got worse; we are playing better on defense; and that the only thing that changed is coaching through the scheme.
You reiterated all my points and came to the same conclusion, and yet I "fed you a line of bull".
no the talent didn't get worse, the scheme they where playing was the problem, the coaching sucked, if it was one or two players that improved, yes then we could assume player decline, but this whole defense is playing better, so no don't come here attempting to twist around what I said, I didn't accept a word you said.
Okay, I got it now. Angry poster who just likes to disagree even if it means contradicting yourself within the same post.
It's all right, I got a good laugh out of your post.
alent or coaching? Always an argument over why a team is performing poorly. Mostly fans blame the talent. I am in the camp of coaching being more important. This is another example. I feel the Packers became less talented with the loss of Gary, but are now playing much better.
If coaching is more important, then just say coaching was the problem
then you go on to blame the loss of Gary for the team playing poorly, but Gary doesn't play in the secondary where for 12 weeks we saw player giving 12 yrd cushions, and huge open spaces where receivers ran free.
you and other want to protect Barry and blame the players, but players dont automatically get better unless changes in schemes happen.
it's my opinion that the players forced those changes to take place, and I doubt Barry would have changed a damn thing if they hadn't forced him to.
Last edited by Yoop on 06 Jan 2023 14:52, edited 1 time in total.
You accept my points that talent got worse; we are playing better on defense; and that the only thing that changed is coaching through the scheme.
You reiterated all my points and came to the same conclusion, and yet I "fed you a line of bull".
no the talent didn't get worse, the scheme they where playing was the problem, the coaching sucked, if it was one or two players that improved, yes then we could assume player decline, but this whole defense is playing better, so no don't come here attempting to twist around what I said, I didn't accept a word you said.
Okay, I got it now. Angry poster who just likes to disagree even if it means contradicting yourself within the same post.
It's all right, I got a good laugh out of your post.
and I get a hoot out of foolish naive fans like you who buy into this coach speak where all he's doing is covering his ass, again I didn't contradict a damn thing
I was very optimistic the Pack's D would finish in the top 10 in scoring defense in 2022 when I started this thread.
I was cautiously optimistic it might finish in the top 5.
At 21.9 points per game, the Packers finished 18th. 18th.
In response to this latest defensive disappointment, at the very least, Joe Barry should be gone.
But truthfully, as I have previously asserted, the entire approach to playing defense in Green Bay -- from scheme, to the type of players being acquired, etc. needs to be re-evaluated.
From top to bottom.
Sadly, I don't trust Gutey or MLF or MLF's defensive coordinator to get this done.
People are going to &%$@ on Quay but he has the type of attitude that we have been missing in GB for a long time. Happy to see him get ejected for going after a non player for the 2nd time this season. We want guys who do that every once in a while rather than losers who wax poetic or hang their heads in their towels.
I also want to know what that Lions trainer was doing to make both Quay and Wyatt angry with him. Sounds like he did something to have it coming!
People are going to &%$@ on Quay but he has the type of attitude that we have been missing in GB for a long time. Happy to see him get ejected for going after a non player for the 2nd time this season. We want guys who do that every once in a while rather than losers who wax poetic or hang their heads in their towels.
I also want to know what that Lions trainer was doing to make both Quay and Wyatt angry with him. Sounds like he did something to have it coming!
We need more guys who shove non-players and get ejected? I can't even respond to such a ridiculous comment.
People are going to &%$@ on Quay but he has the type of attitude that we have been missing in GB for a long time. Happy to see him get ejected for going after a non player for the 2nd time this season. We want guys who do that every once in a while rather than losers who wax poetic or hang their heads in their towels.
I also want to know what that Lions trainer was doing to make both Quay and Wyatt angry with him. Sounds like he did something to have it coming!
ya if theres anything this team is short of, it's stupidity , Quay had no business being where he was, and doing what he did.
People are going to &%$@ on Quay but he has the type of attitude that we have been missing in GB for a long time. Happy to see him get ejected for going after a non player for the 2nd time this season. We want guys who do that every once in a while rather than losers who wax poetic or hang their heads in their towels.
I also want to know what that Lions trainer was doing to make both Quay and Wyatt angry with him. Sounds like he did something to have it coming!
There’s playing tough and being an enforcer on the field…and then there’s shoving a 170 lb trainer trying to gain access to his injured player.
You’re so hell bent on this “thug” mentality thing, you’ve lost sight of what it actually means.
The D is not the problem, it never was, at least not this season. The D won most of that 4 game winning streak and it played well enough to win vs the Lions. If the O had played all 17 games as well as the D played all 17, the Packers would be 12-5 and in the playoffs. Maybe better than 12-5*
* based upon the stat that matters most, final score of all 17 games
The D is not the problem, it never was, at least not this season. The D won most of that 4 game winning streak and it played well enough to win vs the Lions. If the O had played all 17 games as well as the D played all 17, the Packers would be 12-5 and in the playoffs. Maybe better than 12-5*
* based upon the stat that matters most, final score of all 17 games
We’ve kinda been saying what you just said for the past several years now. :-)
Come on down and try some of our delicious green chili! Best in the world!
The D is not the problem, it never was, at least not this season. The D won most of that 4 game winning streak and it played well enough to win vs the Lions. If the O had played all 17 games as well as the D played all 17, the Packers would be 12-5 and in the playoffs. Maybe better than 12-5*
* based upon the stat that matters most, final score of all 17 games
so who's fault is that, Rodgers of course, in reality the OL sucked off and on all year, the receivers where young, dropped passes, ran wrong routes, the RB's where dinged up off and on, point is all that stuff would have happed to any QB in Rodgers place
to say the defense wasn't the problem is your way of taking focus off the real issues, this Defense with all it's highly drafted players finished about 20th in the league, and required a near player revolt for it's DC to pull his head out of his ass to adjust, when it was doing so well to end the 2021 season, but just go and blame Rodgers, it seems to pacify you.
Barry's Defense made a comback with me. Before the last winning streak I was like: Barry, but then they started playing decent without Gary and you cannot blame them vs. Lions: 20 is under 3 TD's which is the gold standard for a decent defense. So maybe I'd give Barry another season, depends if he has his players behind him.
But boy would I love to substitute Missy LaFleur with a guy like Mike Zimmer oder Dan Campell oder any hard nose dominant coach available, even more subtle ones like Tony Dungy.
Barry's Defense made a comback with me. Before the last winning streak I was like: Barry, but then they started playing decent without Gary and you cannot blame them vs. Lions: 20 is under 3 TD's which is the gold standard for a decent defense. So maybe I'd give Barry another season, depends if he has his players behind him.
But boy would I love to substitute Missy LaFleur with a guy like Mike Zimmer oder Dan Campell oder any hard nose dominant coach available, even more subtle ones like Tony Dungy.
imho Panzer, Barry's players basically quit on him and where the driving force for the 4 game streak leading up to last nights game, and your right, giving up just 20 points should have amounted to a win for us, specially going up against a defense worse then ours has been lately.
the OL again is inconsistent, couldn't open up run lanes, couldn't protect the QB, receiver dropped some passes, Rodgers threw a few errant passes, a little better blocking and the last part may have played out differently, basically we couldn't get much to work offensively, imo because the OL didn't get the job done, again.
.imho Panzer, Barry's players basically quit on him and where the driving force for the 4 game streak leading up to last nights game, and your right, giving up just 20 points should have amounted to a win for us, specially going up against a defense worse then ours has been lately.
I feel like this is the same chorus we have been singing now for several years. Same song, different verse.
Come on down and try some of our delicious green chili! Best in the world!
.imho Panzer, Barry's players basically quit on him and where the driving force for the 4 game streak leading up to last nights game, and your right, giving up just 20 points should have amounted to a win for us, specially going up against a defense worse then ours has been lately.
I feel like this is the same chorus we have been singing now for several years. Same song, different verse.
can you be more explicit? as to the defense, we where trending up last season, and where completely stymied to start this season and that was long before losing our best edge pass rusher Gary
concerning offense we lost the only impactful receiver we had the last 5 or 6 seasons, the offensive line had hang over injury's for 2 seasons, the reason nothing changed, in fact got worse hinged on those two things, I know it's popular around here to blame Rodgers, or the play calling, not defending either, but the two prior issues I spoke of makes Lafleur and Rodgers jobs much harder then before.
.imho Panzer, Barry's players basically quit on him and where the driving force for the 4 game streak leading up to last nights game, and your right, giving up just 20 points should have amounted to a win for us, specially going up against a defense worse then ours has been lately.
I feel like this is the same chorus we have been singing now for several years. Same song, different verse.
can you be more explicit? as to the defense, we where trending up last season, and where completely stymied to start this season and that was long before losing our best edge pass rusher Gary
concerning offense we lost the only impactful receiver we had the last 5 or 6 seasons, the offensive line had hang over injury's for 2 seasons, the reason nothing changed, in fact got worse hinged on those two things, I know it's popular around here to blame Rodgers, or the play calling, not defending either, but the two prior issues I spoke of makes Lafleur and Rodgers jobs much harder then before.
Yup. My comment wasn’t about the defense. It was 100% about the offense not fulfilling expectations, as in scoring enough.
:-)
Come on down and try some of our delicious green chili! Best in the world!
In 2021, the Packers finished tied for 10th in scoring defense at 21.3 ppg.
They added not 1 but 2 first round picks in Walker and Wyatt. Reed was brought in to replace Lancaster.
And, they regressed. Badly. To 18th overall in points allowed. They were also 26th against the run.
Cannot fathom how some fans think that the late season "surge" against the worst team in the NFL Bears, a Rams team playing without Stafford or Kupp and with Mayfield at QB, and a concussed Tua in Miami (who had the Dolphins on their way to scoring 40 points and gaining 600 yards at the time of his concussion) somehow makes the overall 2022 defensive play acceptable.
Being in the bottom half of the NFL should never be acceptable, but especially with all of the investment on the defense.
If Joe Barry is allowed back as the Defensive Coordinator it would be a travesty.
People are going to &%$@ on Quay but he has the type of attitude that we have been missing in GB for a long time. Happy to see him get ejected for going after a non player for the 2nd time this season. We want guys who do that every once in a while rather than losers who wax poetic or hang their heads in their towels.
I also want to know what that Lions trainer was doing to make both Quay and Wyatt angry with him. Sounds like he did something to have it coming!
There’s playing tough and being an enforcer on the field…and then there’s shoving a 170 lb trainer trying to gain access to his injured player.
You’re so hell bent on this “thug” mentality thing, you’ve lost sight of what it actually means.
Nope you guys are all wrong.
Would I rather Quay did this off the field or after the game so that he didn't get ejected? Sure. But this type of thing is a sign that he lacks the emotional control and forethought of the type of guy who would let the big moments get to him. He also is motivated to violence by revenge and perceived slights. He has a high time preference. That's exactly the type of mentality we are usually missing because we pick the lovable losers (or "Packers people") who tend to get shellshocked.
As The Seahawks GM said when he picked the LOB, he wants guys who would win in a street fight. Hard to win a street fight when you have the type of personality who never gets into street fights.
but Gary doesn't play in the secondary where for 12 weeks we saw player giving 12 yrd cushions, and huge open spaces where receivers ran free.
, Quay had no business being where he was, and doing what he did.
Barry, but then they started playing decent without Gary and you cannot blame them vs. Lions: 20 is under 3 TD's which is the gold standard for a decent defense. So maybe I'd give Barry another season, depends if he has his players behind him.