2023 Packers Defense Expectations?

[BF004]

Not a good look when one of your few veterans, supposed team leaders. Goes online and gets into with fans and basically says he isn’t gunna gut it out to help his team, but his individual image is more important.

I’d prefer guys who would run through a brick wall for their teammates and have the mental fortitude to block out outside noise.

[Pugger]

I suppose we can place blame on the players for not being lined up right but I find it very concerning that they are still confused this late in the season. That falls in the laps of the DC and the position coaches IMO.

[Pugger]

As I said before, no pitchfork,s yet. Should he remain after January, pitchforks.

I'm in the crowd of "as long as he's gone before next season, I'm good. This is a year to see what we have, not like a new DC would get us to the Super Bowl.

With that said, I don't really understand MLF's answer. Communication issues and players not knowing what coverage they should be in IS a coaching issue.

Ya, I didn't get that either and honestly I think he didn't buy what he was saying too as he prefaced it right after saying it.

What Matt said sounds like coach speak to me. And I can understand why he won't throw his DC under the bus to the media. But I would love to be a fly on the wall to hear what he is saying to everyone behind closed doors.

[Pugger]

Also, be glad that we don't have a head coach that publicly calls out his assistant coaches. If he did so, it would make it that much harder to find a replacement for Joe Barry.

I think it’s going to be hard to find anyone anyways. You have a HC with two straight seasons in which he missed the playoffs and likely losing seasons.

We have a president on his way out and new regimes means new coaches and GMs.

On top of that you have a bunch of defensive players that are underperforming and showing awful effort in tackling, pass rush, and coverage.

Eh, if Love good, looking more and more likely, I have a feeling LaFleur gunna be around for a while.

I can’t think of someone who wouldn’t take an offer for this reasons. Maybe like a Belichick? Maybe Evero feels snubbed from last time.

Someone like Al Harris or Jim Leonhard. You go from making like maybe 250-400k a year and someone offers you a $10m guaranteed contract, you are gunna hesitate too much. Packers do have a great reputation.

Yes, NFL coaching positions don't grow on trees so I doubt we'll have a problem finding a replacement should MLF finally can Barry. I know everyone is enamored with Leonard but I wonder why he turned down the job the last time. That makes me pause, frankly. Harris could be lured to return to GB if we offer him the DC job.

[LombardiTime]

Also, be glad that we don't have a head coach that publicly calls out his assistant coaches. If he did so, it would make it that much harder to find a replacement for Joe Barry.

I think it’s going to be hard to find anyone anyways. You have a HC with two straight seasons in which he missed the playoffs and likely losing seasons.

We have a president on his way out and new regimes means new coaches and GMs.

On top of that you have a bunch of defensive players that are underperforming and showing awful effort in tackling, pass rush, and coverage.

Eh, if Love good, looking more and more likely, I have a feeling LaFleur gunna be around for a while.

I can’t think of someone who wouldn’t take an offer for this reasons. Maybe like a Belichick? Maybe Evero feels snubbed from last time.

Someone like Al Harris or Jim Leonhard. You go from making like maybe 250-400k a year and someone offers you a $10m guaranteed contract, you are gunna hesitate too much. Packers do have a great reputation.

If, if, if MLF decides to fire Joe Barry after the season, I question how attractive the Packer DC job really is.

This would be MLF's third DC in 5 years. MLF's boss Murphy is out after the 2024 season. If the Pack finishes up below .500 again this season and doesn't get back to the playoffs in 2024, is MLF's job all that secure?

Is this a one-year turnaround on defense?

Also, what is the state of the relationship between Gutey & MLF?

Gute is on record that he had high expectations for the defense this year. Does Gute overrate his talent, or is the coaching/scheme almost exclusively to blame?

I would love to FINALLY get an energetic, innovative Defensive Coordinator to Green Bay, but I have nightmares of Brandon Staley.

[Pckfn23]

https://www.packersnews.com/videos/spor ... 966050007/

X’s and O’s with LeRoy Butler: Breaking down the defensive errors against Tampa
LeRoy Butler breaks down mistakes in zone coverage on three plays and shows how misalignments, missed assignments and poor recognition were problems.

[Pckfn23]

Only the Cardinals are worse in giving up TDs/FGs/1Ds per drive...

[TheSkeptic]

i think you can the guy midseason if their is someone on staff that you think could do better.

I do not think that guy is on the roster.

We hired him, we brought him back. Honor the commitment then move on.

We all knew exactly what we were getting with the guy. He is who he has always been.

Barry made a commitment also. How about him honoring his commitment so far this year? A commitment to install a system that could win. Playing soft coverage, whether it is a soft zone or soft man coverage is stupid when you have a good pass rush, which the Packers do have.

The other thing that by itself is enough to fire Barry is not giving LVN and ENAGBARE more snaps. They are making things happen, in sacks and even more in tackles for a loss. Preston has 3 TFL. LVN in 1/2 the snaps has 7. Enagbare in 1/2 the snaps has 6. Will those young guys make more mistake - of course. But they will also make big plays and get better. Preston is not going to get better, in fact it looks to me like he is just going through the motions now. I also have a problem with Cox only getting 4 snaps so far this season. We know that Cox is a project but he is an athletic freak and he needs to get more than 4 so far this season.

Wyatt vs Brooks is another problem. In stats they are very similar, but Wyatt has twice as many snaps.

[Pugger]

I think it’s going to be hard to find anyone anyways. You have a HC with two straight seasons in which he missed the playoffs and likely losing seasons.

We have a president on his way out and new regimes means new coaches and GMs.

On top of that you have a bunch of defensive players that are underperforming and showing awful effort in tackling, pass rush, and coverage.

Eh, if Love good, looking more and more likely, I have a feeling LaFleur gunna be around for a while.

I can’t think of someone who wouldn’t take an offer for this reasons. Maybe like a Belichick? Maybe Evero feels snubbed from last time.

Someone like Al Harris or Jim Leonhard. You go from making like maybe 250-400k a year and someone offers you a $10m guaranteed contract, you are gunna hesitate too much. Packers do have a great reputation.

I’ve seen a lot of Twitter chatter hyping Al Harris as next DC.

Love me some Al Harris but I’m not sold on him making the jump all the way to DC so soon in his coaching career. I think his hiring would be a mistake.

It isn't as soon as you think. His first coaching gig was with the Dolphins as a coaching intern in 2012. He was with the Chiefs as their secondary coach in 2013-2018. In 2020 MM hired him to coach his DBs in Dallas.

[Pugger]

Always felt that the DC brings the plan, and his assistants tune that plan, in that sense I want a cord prospect that knows a lot of coaches around the league, who has earned the respect of all those coaches, and can entice them to come and work for him, Harris may be to young to have those connections.

in order to find such a guy we'll have to give him carte blanc with the assistants, that means no more forced holdovers like Montgomery.

I'd rather a DC with some NFL experience, Saleh is my top prospect, but I'am certainly open to others, Belichick, Bill will get another HC gig, he's to good not to.

we need to add some positional talent on defense, wouldn't matter who the DC is we have to have better talent in the secondary, can't depend on pass rush to keep bailing out a weak secondary

I have a hard time seeing Belichick taking a DC job after being such a successful HC for so long.

[Pckfn23]

[Yoop]

Always felt that the DC brings the plan, and his assistants tune that plan, in that sense I want a cord prospect that knows a lot of coaches around the league, who has earned the respect of all those coaches, and can entice them to come and work for him, Harris may be to young to have those connections.

in order to find such a guy we'll have to give him carte blanc with the assistants, that means no more forced holdovers like Montgomery.

I'd rather a DC with some NFL experience, Saleh is my top prospect, but I'am certainly open to others, Belichick, Bill will get another HC gig, he's to good not to.

we need to add some positional talent on defense, wouldn't matter who the DC is we have to have better talent in the secondary, can't depend on pass rush to keep bailing out a weak secondary

I have a hard time seeing Belichick taking a DC job after being such a successful HC for so long.

agree, but that might take a year for Bill to find a home he wants, in the mean time, and what I hope for is a consultant job for a year with us, even ask his help in picking out our next DC

[BF004]

I think it’s going to be hard to find anyone anyways. You have a HC with two straight seasons in which he missed the playoffs and likely losing seasons.

We have a president on his way out and new regimes means new coaches and GMs.

On top of that you have a bunch of defensive players that are underperforming and showing awful effort in tackling, pass rush, and coverage.

Eh, if Love good, looking more and more likely, I have a feeling LaFleur gunna be around for a while.

I can’t think of someone who wouldn’t take an offer for this reasons. Maybe like a Belichick? Maybe Evero feels snubbed from last time.

Someone like Al Harris or Jim Leonhard. You go from making like maybe 250-400k a year and someone offers you a $10m guaranteed contract, you are gunna hesitate too much. Packers do have a great reputation.

If, if, if MLF decides to fire Joe Barry after the season, I question how attractive the Packer DC job really is.

You guys are making it seem like we are competing against Pittsburgh, SF and Buffalo for D-Coordinators.

Do you know who is looking for D-Coordinators? Bad teams in bad situations. We are competing against Carolina and the Chargers and maybe Washington and Arizona.

We have an offensive minded HC, you'll get to run the ship here and call plays. Damn sure looking like we have a QB, we have a competent HC, as limited as he may be, and we have a history of being loyal to a fault to our coordinators. And we have a reputation of investing heavily on D, and on paper, looks talented currently.

This very well may be the most sought after DC job this offseason.

[Pckfn23]

Eh, if Love good, looking more and more likely, I have a feeling LaFleur gunna be around for a while.

I can’t think of someone who wouldn’t take an offer for this reasons. Maybe like a Belichick? Maybe Evero feels snubbed from last time.

Someone like Al Harris or Jim Leonhard. You go from making like maybe 250-400k a year and someone offers you a $10m guaranteed contract, you are gunna hesitate too much. Packers do have a great reputation.

If, if, if MLF decides to fire Joe Barry after the season, I question how attractive the Packer DC job really is.

You guys are making it seem like we are competing against Pittsburgh, SF and Buffalo for D-Coordinators.

Do you know who is looking for D-Coordinators? Bad teams in bad situations. We are competing against Carolina and the Chargers and maybe Washington and Arizona.

We have an offensive minded HC, you'll get to run the ship here and call plays. Damn sure looking like we have a QB, we have a competent HC, as limited as he may be, and we have a history of being loyal to a fault to our coordinators. And we have a reputation of investing heavily on D, and on paper, looks talented currently.

This very well may be the most sought after DC job this offseason.

Ya, just no way in hell this DC job isn't attractive.

[williewasgreat]

i think you can the guy midseason if their is someone on staff that you think could do better.

I do not think that guy is on the roster.

We hired him, we brought him back. Honor the commitment then move on.

We all knew exactly what we were getting with the guy. He is who he has always been.

Barry made a commitment also. How about him honoring his commitment so far this year? A commitment to install a system that could win. Playing soft coverage, whether it is a soft zone or soft man coverage is stupid when you have a good pass rush, which the Packers do have.

The other thing that by itself is enough to fire Barry is not giving LVN and ENAGBARE more snaps. They are making things happen, in sacks and even more in tackles for a loss. Preston has 3 TFL. LVN in 1/2 the snaps has 7. Enagbare in 1/2 the snaps has 6. Will those young guys make more mistake - of course. But they will also make big plays and get better. Preston is not going to get better, in fact it looks to me like he is just going through the motions now. I also have a problem with Cox only getting 4 snaps so far this season. We know that Cox is a project but he is an athletic freak and he needs to get more than 4 so far this season.

Wyatt vs Brooks is another problem. In stats they are very similar, but Wyatt has twice as many snaps.

Preston Smith is far better against the run than either of these two are. Preston is also better when he has to drop into coverage.

[go pak go]

i think you can the guy midseason if their is someone on staff that you think could do better.

I do not think that guy is on the roster.

We hired him, we brought him back. Honor the commitment then move on.

We all knew exactly what we were getting with the guy. He is who he has always been.

Barry made a commitment also. How about him honoring his commitment so far this year? A commitment to install a system that could win. Playing soft coverage, whether it is a soft zone or soft man coverage is stupid when you have a good pass rush, which the Packers do have.

The other thing that by itself is enough to fire Barry is not giving LVN and ENAGBARE more snaps. They are making things happen, in sacks and even more in tackles for a loss. Preston has 3 TFL. LVN in 1/2 the snaps has 7. Enagbare in 1/2 the snaps has 6. Will those young guys make more mistake - of course. But they will also make big plays and get better. Preston is not going to get better, in fact it looks to me like he is just going through the motions now. I also have a problem with Cox only getting 4 snaps so far this season. We know that Cox is a project but he is an athletic freak and he needs to get more than 4 so far this season.

Wyatt vs Brooks is another problem. In stats they are very similar, but Wyatt has twice as many snaps.

Preston Smith is far better against the run than either of these two are. Preston is also better when he has to drop into coverage.

What reciever did he "survive the down" against this year? Didn't he have a pass break up in the EZ?

[BF004]

[Drj820]

Rasul leaves and defensive locker room implodes. Thanks Gute

[APB]

Eh, if Love good, looking more and more likely, I have a feeling LaFleur gunna be around for a while.

I can’t think of someone who wouldn’t take an offer for this reasons. Maybe like a Belichick? Maybe Evero feels snubbed from last time.

Someone like Al Harris or Jim Leonhard. You go from making like maybe 250-400k a year and someone offers you a $10m guaranteed contract, you are gunna hesitate too much. Packers do have a great reputation.

I’ve seen a lot of Twitter chatter hyping Al Harris as next DC.

Love me some Al Harris but I’m not sold on him making the jump all the way to DC so soon in his coaching career. I think his hiring would be a mistake.

It isn't as soon as you think. His first coaching gig was with the Dolphins as a coaching intern in 2012. He was with the Chiefs as their secondary coach in 2013-2018. In 2020 MM hired him to coach his DBs in Dallas.

When I say "soon in his coaching career" I'm not referencing a calendar. I mean he's never coordinated at any level. He's been a position coach and, specifically, it's the position he played. He's never ventured from that comfort zone. He hasn't even worked as defensive pass game coordinator.

Again, love Al Harris but he's not ready to be an NFL level DC. Get some time as pass game coordinator or go back to the college level and coordinate a defense, then we can talk.

[wallyuwl]

When I say "soon in his coaching career" I'm not referencing a calendar. I mean he's never coordinated at any level. He's been a position coach and, specifically, it's the position he played. He's never ventured from that comfort zone. He hasn't even worked as defensive pass game coordinator.

Again, love Al Harris but he's not ready to be an NFL level DC. Get some time as pass game coordinator or go back to the college level and coordinate a defense, then we can talk.

I donno. He might know more than meets the eye. Andy Reid was never a coordinator before getting the HC job in Philly, and look how that turned out. Jumping two rung on the coaching ladder isn't unheard of. I know nothing about if he is ready or not, just saying he shouldn't be discounted for the job based on his current/prior job titles.