General Packers News 2020

[lupedafiasco]

No Blake they under value slow terrible ilbs. I can't believe the Giants paid him that much..who knows maybe he will be a little better in a 4-3.

This team definitely undervalues LBs. Blake is terrible or slow either. Hes average on both fronts. I think if he gets paired with a LB who can be that sideline to sideline defender he would look better as an attacking LB. He wasnt given that luxury here. Both TT and Gutey clearly dont value the position. I think mainly because both want physical freaks with their high picks and those type of backers go early.

[Scott4Pack]

The problem with giving a 2nd level LB free reign and limited gap responsibility upfront is that the LB is almost never going to get TFLs and most tackles are going to be 2+ yards downfield. If they responsibility is mop up duty, they can't commit too soon or it is a huge gain. This is regardless of who the LB is, especially in a system where there is only 1 2nd level LB.

Yeah i like your last point about in a system with only one ILB. I guess that is why almost every other team for the history of football has had 2 lol. Ideally you would send one through gaps and to blow stuff up, while the other is almost a safety up close to the LOS, roaming and causing havoc.

No matter how you think of Marty (my opinion of him declined through the year), one cant deny he was asked to do ALOT. so much, that even though he didnt do it great, not many could do better. Will be interesting to see how he looks in New York.

asked to do to much????? to me he was asked to do to little, I could train a german shepard to stand pat in the center of the hashes and attack anyone that went past the los with a ball in there hand well maybe I couldn't train one with my advancing years and declining patience but maybe you could

Haha said it best after he left, which was something to the affect he was asked to play like a robot, I think once you start stripping away at a players instincts thats the result you end up with, it's a form of tentivness that just naturally sets in, imho thats what we seen with a few players, and Martinez was one of em.

lots of teams lack a quality ILB2 and use a hybrid safety instead, it's either that or watch as QB's pick your under belly apart.

I don't mean to chip away at your point, but do you really think that HaHa is being totally honest about his appraisal of Pettine? I don't. HaHa is a likable guy and all. But he has shown ZERO for instincts in his career. So, he didn't get the opportunities that he wanted. And we're going to think that he's fairly assessing the situation?

I don't think so. Sorry.
:-)

[Yoop]

No Blake they under value slow terrible ilbs. I can't believe the Giants paid him that much..who knows maybe he will be a little better in a 4-3.

This team definitely undervalues LBs. Blake is terrible or slow either. Hes average on both fronts. I think if he gets paired with a LB who can be that sideline to sideline defender he would look better as an attacking LB. He wasnt given that luxury here. Both TT and Gutey clearly dont value the position. I think mainly because both want physical freaks with their high picks and those type of backers go early.

well physical freaks is what the position demands these days, for years we've mulled along with mostly 2 dn run plugging ILB's, it got so bad that we moved Burnett into the ILB 2 (coverage position), another year we had to move our best pass rusher there in Mathews, for the last decade our best combo was Hawk and Burnett, so to say we need two ILB's to man that position goes against whats worked best in that time frame.

stopping the run helps if your bigger and stronger, but it's never been the only way, just look at all the smallish ILB's drafted top 20, or the success other 3 safety schemes have had, to think a box SS can't do well transitioning to coverage ILB also goes against that success, simply based on the jags we've had to use trying to do it doesn't mean we and others havn't had success in the past, why take a mid to late round ILB to try when we have the oppertunity to pick a much more gifted athlete, your taking a chance with any pick, but imho your odds go up a lot taking the 2nd round safety and using him as we did Burnett, look how many ILB's we've rotated through and most didn't even play up to a roster number, there a waste of time and resources.

you keep complaining about Randall, when actually he was never as bad as you claim, any GM has to take the best DB available, specially if the guy is edge capable and they need a CB, thats common sense stuff, some positions over lap, CB and safety is one, just like now SS and ILB is doing, ya don't get a choice, if the ideal situation is not possible then you have to adjust and take a player that can at least improve the position, your really stubborn over something you know dang well happens elsewhere in the league, and not just here.

[BF004]

Michael Thomas is the other.

Adams also did this with a long stretch of Brent Hundley at QB.

[Yoop]

Yeah i like your last point about in a system with only one ILB. I guess that is why almost every other team for the history of football has had 2 lol. Ideally you would send one through gaps and to blow stuff up, while the other is almost a safety up close to the LOS, roaming and causing havoc.

No matter how you think of Marty (my opinion of him declined through the year), one cant deny he was asked to do ALOT. so much, that even though he didnt do it great, not many could do better. Will be interesting to see how he looks in New York.

asked to do to much????? to me he was asked to do to little, I could train a german shepard to stand pat in the center of the hashes and attack anyone that went past the los with a ball in there hand well maybe I couldn't train one with my advancing years and declining patience but maybe you could

Haha said it best after he left, which was something to the affect he was asked to play like a robot, I think once you start stripping away at a players instincts thats the result you end up with, it's a form of tentivness that just naturally sets in, imho thats what we seen with a few players, and Martinez was one of em.

lots of teams lack a quality ILB2 and use a hybrid safety instead, it's either that or watch as QB's pick your under belly apart.

I don't mean to chip away at your point, but do you really think that HaHa is being totally honest about his appraisal of Pettine? I don't. HaHa is a likable guy and all. But he has shown ZERO for instincts in his career. So, he didn't get the opportunities that he wanted. And we're going to think that he's fairly assessing the situation?

I don't think so. Sorry.
:-)

who knows, I think the last two years with Dix it could have some truth to it, our situation at CB was so bad a single high safety can't gamble, when both boundry positions are weak he has to sit in center field and wait to see which receiver has the upper hand, so I expect that is what he meant.

go back if you can and watch Dix his first two seasons, he was flying around and always in the picture, either making a tackle or there at the end of the play, and it was the same with Martinez his first two seasons.

I think a lot of players sorta quit on Capers, or not so much Capers, but over all decline of ability and talent which makes it hard to play your best, it was just more obvious with Dix.

[Drj820]

No Blake they under value slow terrible ilbs. I can't believe the Giants paid him that much..who knows maybe he will be a little better in a 4-3.

This team definitely undervalues LBs. Blake is terrible or slow either. Hes average on both fronts. I think if he gets paired with a LB who can be that sideline to sideline defender he would look better as an attacking LB. He wasnt given that luxury here. Both TT and Gutey clearly dont value the position. I think mainly because both want physical freaks with their high picks and those type of backers go early.

Blake is about to be in a perfect situation for himself. He got paid well, and they are about to draft isaiah simmons who is the perfect guy to play beside him.

Yoop, Haha is on his 4th team in a 6 year career for a reason.

[go pak go]

No Blake they under value slow terrible ilbs. I can't believe the Giants paid him that much..who knows maybe he will be a little better in a 4-3.

This team definitely undervalues LBs. Blake is terrible or slow either. Hes average on both fronts. I think if he gets paired with a LB who can be that sideline to sideline defender he would look better as an attacking LB. He wasnt given that luxury here. Both TT and Gutey clearly dont value the position. I think mainly because both want physical freaks with their high picks and those type of backers go early.

Blake is about to be in a perfect situation for himself. He got paid well, and they are about to draft isaiah simmons who is the perfect guy to play beside him.

Yoop, Haha is on his 4th team in a 6 year career for a reason.

Yeah. Because of Ladarius Gunter.

:redskins:

[BF004]

Isn’t like 4th team in like 18 months?

[TheGreenMan]

Was it because he genuinely was terrible or teams haven't been wanting to pay him? Serious question.

[Pckfn23]

Was it because he genuinely was terrible or teams haven't been wanting to pay him? Serious question.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/dallas-cowb ... -earnings/#

I would say the former more than the latter.

[Yoop]

Was it because he genuinely was terrible or teams haven't been wanting to pay him? Serious question.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/dallas-cowb ... -earnings/#

I would say the former more than the latter.

I do to, once he started taking plays off, or at least he gave that impression it had to sour GM's around the league, and though Wash and Chicago gave him a shot because they needed a player, they cut him a year later, so his attitude or poor play was still holding him back, now the Cowboys on what should be a slap in the face type contract, he has to prove himself or he'll be looking for a new team again, to bad because I thought he looked pretty good his first two seasons.

whats funny now to me, is that most here wanted Shazier over Dix that draft, and Shazier is another under sized ILB, not much bigger then these safety's GPG had in his mock to man up the ILB 2 spot, kinda ironical to say the least, I remember spouting Shazier is to small ( I liked Malloy more)

now I know Shazier was hurt badly, but size wasn't the reason, and he was excellent prior to the injury

[TheGreenMan]

Was it because he genuinely was terrible or teams haven't been wanting to pay him? Serious question.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/dallas-cowb ... -earnings/#

I would say the former more than the latter.

Yeah.

I do to, once he started taking plays off, or at least he gave that impression it had to sour GM's around the league, and though Wash and Chicago gave him a shot because they needed a player, they cut him a year later, so his attitude or poor play was still holding him back, now the Cowboys on what should be a slap in the face type contract, he has to prove himself or he'll be looking for a new team again, to bad because I thought he looked pretty good his first two seasons.

whats funny now to me, is that most here wanted Shazier over Dix that draft, and Shazier is another under sized ILB, not much bigger then these safety's GPG had in his mock to man up the ILB 2 spot, kinda ironical to say the least, I remember spouting Shazier is to small ( I liked Malloy more)

now I know Shazier was hurt badly, but size wasn't the reason, and he was excellent prior to the injury

It's incredible how far he has fallen. At first he looked like everything we needed in the secondary. I think once the guy got hit a few times that was pretty much all she wrote.

[Drj820]

i mean everywhere he has gone he has been a starter, and he continues to land starting jobs...he just isnt anywhere near living up to his draft status. But he is good enough to remain employed, just not good enough for a team to want to pay him when it comes time. The league average for a starting safety is 5million, he is getting 4million. So I wouldnt say hes horrible, but he isnt even average. Just a below average starter in the league that keeps having to do prove it deal, because he hasnt proved it to anyone yet.

[Yoop]

Was it because he genuinely was terrible or teams haven't been wanting to pay him? Serious question.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/dallas-cowb ... -earnings/#

I would say the former more than the latter.

Yeah.

I do to, once he started taking plays off, or at least he gave that impression it had to sour GM's around the league, and though Wash and Chicago gave him a shot because they needed a player, they cut him a year later, so his attitude or poor play was still holding him back, now the Cowboys on what should be a slap in the face type contract, he has to prove himself or he'll be looking for a new team again, to bad because I thought he looked pretty good his first two seasons.

whats funny now to me, is that most here wanted Shazier over Dix that draft, and Shazier is another under sized ILB, not much bigger then these safety's GPG had in his mock to man up the ILB 2 spot, kinda ironical to say the least, I remember spouting Shazier is to small ( I liked Malloy more)

now I know Shazier was hurt badly, but size wasn't the reason, and he was excellent prior to the injury

It's incredible how far he has fallen. At first he looked like everything we needed in the secondary. I think once the guy got hit a few times that was pretty much all she wrote.

maybe, I think he played not to get hurt more so towards the end of his 3rd and his 4th with us, possibly that carried over with Wash and Chicago, however he was usually 2nd or 3rd on the defense with tackles, so who's to say.

He's had no major injury's after 6 seasons, he can probably play another 5 seasons at this rate, and always start some where, just not here

[Drj820]

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/dallas-cowb ... -earnings/#

I would say the former more than the latter.

Yeah.

I do to, once he started taking plays off, or at least he gave that impression it had to sour GM's around the league, and though Wash and Chicago gave him a shot because they needed a player, they cut him a year later, so his attitude or poor play was still holding him back, now the Cowboys on what should be a slap in the face type contract, he has to prove himself or he'll be looking for a new team again, to bad because I thought he looked pretty good his first two seasons.

whats funny now to me, is that most here wanted Shazier over Dix that draft, and Shazier is another under sized ILB, not much bigger then these safety's GPG had in his mock to man up the ILB 2 spot, kinda ironical to say the least, I remember spouting Shazier is to small ( I liked Malloy more)

now I know Shazier was hurt badly, but size wasn't the reason, and he was excellent prior to the injury

It's incredible how far he has fallen. At first he looked like everything we needed in the secondary. I think once the guy got hit a few times that was pretty much all she wrote.

maybe, I think he played not to get hurt more so towards the end of his 3rd and his 4th with us, possibly that carried over with Wash and Chicago, however he was usually 2nd or 3rd on the defense with tackles, so who's to say.

He's had no major injury's after 6 seasons, he can probably play another 5 seasons at this rate, and always start some where, just not here

Yeah I think he and Blake Martinez both share that quality...At their quality of play, Blake would not have made 10m per if their wasnt good evidence that he was going to be available every week. He simply would probably not be worth waiting on to get healthy at a price tag like that. But alot of things can be forgiven when you can slot players into a spot, and be pretty confident that every week they will fill that spot. I think that helped Blake a few extra million dollars this year, and it helped the Cowboys feel like they dont have to worry about one of the Safety spots this year. Same for the bears last year. At his skill, if he was banged up every year..he probably doesnt start on a team. But if you can pencil somebody in, at least you can gameplan around what you know your gonna get.

[BF004]

Still weird that about 18 months ago with MM was his head coach, he was traded away, now he’s resigning with that same head coach in a new city.

I know Mac didnt have roster authority, but i felt like he surely commanded enough respect and gravity where if he said we are not trading HaHa, I need him, he wouldn’t have been traded. But he didn’t and let him be traded away. Crazy they are reuniting so soon.

[Yoop]

Still weird that about 18 months ago with MM was his head coach, he was traded away, now he’s resigning with that same head coach in a new city.

I know Mac didnt have roster authority, but i felt like he surely commanded enough respect and gravity where if he said we are not trading HaHa, I need him, he wouldn’t have been traded. But he didn’t and let him be traded away. Crazy they are reuniting so soon.

I think it had more to do with Guty, if we could see the quit in HHCD (playing not to get hurt) then no doubt the coaches and Guty could, so while Capers and McCarthy where willing to put up with the guy taking plays off, Guty wouldn't, and it wasn't just Dix, if where honest we saw it with Mathews, Perry, hell half the squad, we read a few articles that suggest players had quit on Capers, and our own eye test caused us to question it at times as well too, did me anyway.

same sorta thing happened to McCarthy his last season, players get fed up just like any other dis gruntled employee when the boss isn't doing his job right, look how long people here complained about Capers, same with McCarthy, now I don't think either was the main problem, still players and fans don't care so much WHO is to blame, they just want the problem solved, replacing coaches is often the easier way to get players back on board, and I think it's worked.

[BF004]

Is this going to be the new thing on copy/paste? Players quit on Capers?

Seen that already like a half dozen times through a few threads.


Not debating against that, I don't want to be misconstrued, 1000% evident HaHa did late in the season. I wouldn't say with any level of certainty he quit on Capers, or the team, or was just worried about the next contract. But sure he quit for whatever reason.


Any which way, and for any which reason. I find it funny. I am sure, in both cases, if McCarthy said, NO, do not trade him, he wouldn't have been. Likewise here if he told Jerry flat out, NO, don't sign him, he wouldn't have been signed. Interesting scenario.

[Drj820]

There is an interview with Haha in the locker room right after Dom was fired that he defends Dom. He talks about how its hard for any defense to get continuity with so many different people coming in and out of the building. It seemed to have some ammo more aimed at the front office than anyone on the coaching staff.

I am not sure its weird that he returned to MM 18 months after he left. Dallas has cap issues, and if you can fill a starting job with someone like Haha for 4 million dollars per year, while not having to commit to him long term...thats a good deal for the team. Like i was saying, its not like Haha is horrible. He is just a below average starter. But he is still starter caliber, always available, and pretty cheap. It might have just been a good deal for the Jones's.

[Pckfn23]

Yikes, I follow Peter Bukowski on Twitter and am realizing he doesn't know a lot about the game of Football.