From Lambeau to Lombardi, Holmgren, McCarthy and LaFleur and from Starr to Favre, Rodgers and now Jordan Love we’re talking Super Bowl Champion Green Bay Packers football. This Packers Forum is the place to talk NFL football and everything Packers. So, pull up a keyboard, make yourself at home and let’s talk some Packers football.
The Steelers showed last season what happens when you don't have a good back up. And the Eagles the year before showed what happens when you do.
Rodgers has been injured and off the boil the past few years and we've had zero impact from our QB2.
Also, in terms of immediate impact, I was hoping for a developmental OT like Josh Jones or maybe Ezra Cleveland last night. They may have taken a year to hit the field so the outlook for 2020 wouldn't have been much different than taking the developmental QB.
Rounds 2 and 3 were always going to be the 'weapon' rounds anyway for me.
You know I’m following this theory and agree...agree that we should have given the same 4th round pick we gave for Love to nick Foles, still had our 30 overall, and had a great backup we can all feel confident in.
We couldn't have afforded Foles contract. Love is peanuts for 5 years. And Foles wouldn't have come to be a backup. He's likely starting in Chicago. And Foles isn't the same player he was with the Eagles.
We need a good backup. Foles ain't it.
And Foles' also isn't a potential franchise QB. Love is.
No but we could afford Rosen. Rosen for a 4th and the same cap hit. Buys us two years of backup play and then we could decide after that.
This was dumb. Trading with Miami was smart. We just traded the wrong thing.
You know I’m following this theory and agree...agree that we should have given the same 4th round pick we gave for Love to nick Foles, still had our 30 overall, and had a great backup we can all feel confident in.
We couldn't have afforded Foles contract. Love is peanuts for 5 years. And Foles wouldn't have come to be a backup. He's likely starting in Chicago. And Foles isn't the same player he was with the Eagles.
We need a good backup. Foles ain't it.
And Foles' also isn't a potential franchise QB. Love is.
The guy that threw 17 Ints last year in the mountain west. Yes, so much better backup than sb campion nick Foles Im sure. He just must be be TrustGutey (Trademark)
I know you're upset about the Packers' pick but Foles wasn't the answer for the Packers backup QB job. The smart move is to use that spot on a good rookie with upside. Time will tell if that's what Love is.
The guy that threw 17 Ints last year in the mountain west. Yes, so much better backup than sb campion nick Foles Im sure. He just must be be TrustGutey (Trademark)
Well, we'll see your boy Foles twice this year. I don't expect to be impressed. That is, if he even beats out Trubisky.
You know I’m following this theory and agree...agree that we should have given the same 4th round pick we gave for Love to nick Foles, still had our 30 overall, and had a great backup we can all feel confident in.
We couldn't have afforded Foles contract. Love is peanuts for 5 years. And Foles wouldn't have come to be a backup. He's likely starting in Chicago. And Foles isn't the same player he was with the Eagles.
We need a good backup. Foles ain't it.
And Foles' also isn't a potential franchise QB. Love is.
No but we could afford Rosen. Rosen for a 4th and the same cap hit. Buys us two years of backup play and then we could decide after that.
This was dumb. Trading with Miami was smart. We just traded the wrong thing.
The fact two QB-needy teams have had Rosen on their team for a full year, after investing considerable draft capital on him, and both times decided to get rid of him at a loss, suggests he's not the answer.
The fact two QB-needy teams have had Rosen on their team for a full year, after investing considerable draft capital on him, and both times decided to get rid of him at a loss, suggests he's not the answer.
It's just not smart from cap management perspective aswell.
You want a rookie qb to sit a max of 1 year. This way you get play out of them for 5 years before they have a ridiculous cap hit.
If we go from Rodgers to Love after 4 or 5 years we get no time to stock up and invest in other positions.
Not necessarily.
When Rodgers was extended in his 4th year (8 games into his 1st year starting), his extension was just above average for starting QB's. That's the $$ he was making '09-'11.
That's the trick, the masterstoke Ted pulled off. If a young QB sits long enough that he's already in range of extension by the time he's a starter, he can be extended relatively cheap before he earns a cap busting deal.
That's a fine line to walk, tho. Ted managed to pull it off (with a lot of luck going his way) but the circumstances are very different this time 'round. Rodgers is still viewed as very capable and has openly committed to playing out this contract and then some. If Rodgers improves in the MLF system and effectively adjusts to his "old man QB" status, Love may never see any meaningful playing time before a decision on a second contract must be made.
It's just not smart from cap management perspective aswell.
You want a rookie qb to sit a max of 1 year. This way you get play out of them for 5 years before they have a ridiculous cap hit.
If we go from Rodgers to Love after 4 or 5 years we get no time to stock up and invest in other positions.
Not necessarily.
When Rodgers was extended in his 4th year (8 games into his 1st year starting), his extension was just above average for starting QB's. That's the $$ he was making '09-'11.
That's the trick, the masterstoke Ted pulled off. If a young QB sits long enough that he's already in range of extension by the time he's a starter, he can be extended relatively cheap before he earns a cap busting deal.
That's a fine line to walk, tho. Ted managed to pull it off (with a lot of luck going his way) but the circumstances are very different this time 'round. Rodgers is still viewed as very capable and has openly committed to playing out this contract and then some. If Rodgers improves in the MLF system and effectively adjusts to his "old man QB" status, Love may never see any meaningful playing time before a decision on a second contract must be made.
It's just not smart from cap management perspective aswell.
You want a rookie qb to sit a max of 1 year. This way you get play out of them for 5 years before they have a ridiculous cap hit.
If we go from Rodgers to Love after 4 or 5 years we get no time to stock up and invest in other positions.
Not necessarily.
When Rodgers was extended in his 4th year (8 games into his 1st year starting), his extension was just above average for starting QB's. That's the $$ he was making '09-'11.
That's the trick, the masterstoke Ted pulled off. If a young QB sits long enough that he's already in range of extension by the time he's a starter, he can be extended relatively cheap before he earns a cap busting deal.
This is now the best case scenario gameplan for the Packers. We've already seen this formula work out and it got us a Superbowl. I much prefer this approach than the boom/bust "all-in with rookie QB window". The Bears tried it and failed miserably. Rams tried it, got close, and failed. Now both teams set back for some time.
Last edited by British on 24 Apr 2020 08:25, edited 1 time in total.
Love may never see any meaningful playing time before a decision on a second contract must be made.
See, I don't agree. 5th-year option must be exercised after Year 3. In a perfect world Rodgers is still winning SB's, but if you still think Love is the successor, the option is a no-brainer. Going into Year 4, Rodgers will turn 40. At some point father time is coming for him. Still, you technically have two years before a decision "has to be made".
The guy that threw 17 Ints last year in the mountain west. Yes, so much better backup than sb campion nick Foles Im sure. He just must be be TrustGutey (Trademark)
Well, we'll see your boy Foles twice this year. I don't expect to be impressed. That is, if he even beats out Trubisky.
Foles is my boy, and I do worry a little more about the bears bc he is on their team.
It's just not smart from cap management perspective aswell.
You want a rookie qb to sit a max of 1 year. This way you get play out of them for 5 years before they have a ridiculous cap hit.
If we go from Rodgers to Love after 4 or 5 years we get no time to stock up and invest in other positions.
Not necessarily.
When Rodgers was extended in his 4th year (8 games into his 1st year starting), his extension was just above average for starting QB's. That's the $$ he was making '09-'11.
That's the trick, the masterstoke Ted pulled off. If a young QB sits long enough that he's already in range of extension by the time he's a starter, he can be extended relatively cheap before he earns a cap busting deal.
That's a fine line to walk, tho. Ted managed to pull it off (with a lot of luck going his way) but the circumstances are very different this time 'round. Rodgers is still viewed as very capable and has openly committed to playing out this contract and then some. If Rodgers improves in the MLF system and effectively adjusts to his "old man QB" status, Love may never see any meaningful playing time before a decision on a second contract must be made.
So be it. Then we've got a quality young QB2 and a trade piece down the line ala Jimmy G.
The guy that threw 17 Ints last year in the mountain west. Yes, so much better backup than sb campion nick Foles Im sure. He just must be be TrustGutey (Trademark)
Well, we'll see your boy Foles twice this year. I don't expect to be impressed. That is, if he even beats out Trubisky.
Foles is my boy, and I do worry a little more about the bears bc he is on their team.
Foles is your boy? How could Nick Foles be anyone's boy? Sorry, just a weird guy to hitch your wagon to!
The one negative thing that I can appreciate the most out of this pick is, "We didn't get better for NOW on this pick." There's no arguing about that. We picked a guy who is going to sit and learn, barring any unforeseen injuries to QB1.
And pile that onto round 1 of last year too. Yes, Gary was only going to be a rotational player his first year. Settled. Done.
I'm looking how things look in a couple more years. If Gary and/or Love start and play well, this'll be settled for good. And if either or both don't play well, then we can gripe about it for a long time. It won't matter because Guty will be gone then too.
Ready for round 2. :-)
I can argue it. Our QB2 situation will probably be better than it has in years. That's better. People have been complaining for years that the Packers haven't gotten a quality backup. Jordan Love will not cost that much. There is a rookie pay scale now. Love will cost us around $12M for 4 years. That is around average for the top half of QB2's in the league.
Cool. I can actually agree with you on that. I was just trying to appease some in the forum and validate them.
;-)
Come on down and try some of our delicious green chili! Best in the world!
SO incorrect. The cap implications also play a HUGE role in this, plus the fact that we $%@# TRADED UP!!!
The cap implications loomed for the Pats, too. Maybe not to the exact same extent, but they sure did. And the trade up and where they were drafted is, at this point, irrelevant. Should have been considered before the pick was made, but here we are now. No longer relevant.
Well, you're actually better off with a late 1st QB than a 2nd rd QB for this maneuver because of the extra year on the contract.
A team in the high 2nd would be wise to trade up into the late 1st to even with no competition for the player solely for that extra year and the flexibility it gives.
After sleeping on it, here's the thing. Everyone that says this pick is dumb is right, for now. Everyone that says this pick doesn't make sense and there is no logical path to success is right, for now. I have to give you that. I see paths to success that are not in the near term and you don't have to accept those. I have to give you that, as well. This is a long con by Gutey. You guys get to revel in this for the next few years. I choose to think we will come out on top in this one, in the end. Its not blind faith, its not homerism, its not trust Gutey at all costs, I just truly think this will work out. I will keep my optimism quiet, for now, as there is no use in trying to convince those that have their minds made up, but believe me, this thread will be bookmarked.
Well, we'll see your boy Foles twice this year. I don't expect to be impressed. That is, if he even beats out Trubisky.
Foles is my boy, and I do worry a little more about the bears bc he is on their team.
Foles is your boy? How could Nick Foles be anyone's boy? Sorry, just a weird guy to hitch your wagon to!
High character, teammates love him, super bowl champ, I repeat...super bowl champ. I think he’s a perfect backup, and someone you don’t feel doomed when he comes in to start. I think he got a raw deal for his rep signing with the dumpster fire that is the jags. I think the bears made an underrated move in grabbing him. Big upgrade from biscuit.
We don’t have to turn this isn’t a debate on Foles lol, but yes I like Foles, feel he will make the bears better, and would rather have him at our QB2 than Jordan love.
And have no recollection of people wanting Ted's head for drafting Rodgers.
Memory must be short, but I don't.
Are you kidding me?
Ted was absolutely hated for the pick (oh the "fond" memories of being called a TTard for not hating the pick). As much as people ragged on Ted about Harrell, it was even worse with Rodgers. Especially because he looked like absolute crap his first year and and only looked so so (for a backup..) his 2nd. Rodgers was penciled in by most as a colossal bust until the Dallas game in '07, tho he did outplay Favre in the '07 preseason (which few put stock in).
I thought he looked good in the '06 preseason, but few agreed with me. The offense didn't really do anything with him under center in '06 preseason, but he at least lost the deer in the headlights look he had in '05 and had quality ball placement.
What I see on game cutups. I have not read a single scouting report about Love yet, so this is all raw reaction based on the game cutups only:
+ Very quick release. Very very quick. A natural thrower
+ Plenty of arm strength, also on the move. Can legit sling it
+ Maintains a good base in the pocket, not heel-clicky nor needing to step into throws to get power into them. QB coach would appreciate that good footwork
+ Keeps eyes downfield when moving outta the pocket and under pressure. Not afraid to take a hit
+ Some very good checkdown decisions
+ Familiar with LaFleur's style of run-pass option
= Mostly a pocket passer, but not a statue. Pretty much young AR -level of running when plays break down. Athletic enough to escape some broken pockets
= Goes through progressions seemingly fast, but hard to tell. His WRs didn't look top-notch, didn't routinely get open. Game usually not too fast for him to process, but didn't seem to be fooling safeties with his eyes. Blatant issues vs zone coverage, however (see below)
= Not helped by talent around him. Center had sometimes shotgun accuracy on shotgun snaps. A whole lotta drops and covered receivers. WRs rounded off some routes, making the job of DBs easier. Some INTs on desperation passes in games that had gotten outta hand, their D must not have been good
- Got fooled twice by LBs dropping into coverage vs BYU. Some other INTs vs zone. Will need to be waaaaay more aware of and careful vs zone coverage. Some terrible decisions when locked onto the seemingly open-looking options. Needs to be coached outta him pronto. Watching some AR would do a world of good
- Had some plays with possible concentration issues. Weird misfires while usually accurate
Overall, I think there's some fine clay to mold here. Honestly, I was expecting him to look worse. Love definitely has an NFL arm, and a lot of his technique and game seemed refined. The issues vs zone coverage need to be ironed out fast. Put Love on a bad NFL team and force him to start immediately, that would've been a disaster. Let him learn for a couple of years... Well see, but I think this guy has a real high ceiling.
Sorry, just a weird guy to hitch your wagon to!
