Topic Split: Gruden Resigns

[Scott4Pack]

I'm not sure what you are saying there. But listen, once any employer or the gov't decides it's okay to mine any of our personal thoughts and conversations from years ago, then everything is on the table. It only depends upon how motivated the employer or gov't is in finding dirt. I'm thinking 98% of us have uttered things that we would regret today if they were held against us.

I used to work at a place that did some of this a few years ago. EVERY person who worked there was fearful of the next day there.

NFL needs to grow up a bit and make clear expectations AHEAD of time, not ten years after something happened.

I think you're right about the fear, but they aren't "mining" for anything by searching work emails. I think everyone knows that work emails are fair game. If they were emails sent from Gruden's Yahoo account to Bruce Allen's hotmail account, I'd be like "woah! That's shady" and agree with you.

But Gruden's ESPN account to Allen's NFL account? Absolutely fair game for content monitoring and consequences.

I hear what you are saying and agree to an extent. But the matter in this specific case was Gruden emails from how many YEARS ago? And when he was with a different team? And what POLICY did the NFL have about this subject matter at THAT time?

Employers must lay out specific policy about important matters in order to set expectations. (Parents too.) Otherwise, they really have no business taking drastic action against the individuals. And just because expectations have been more clear in recent years doesn't make this any better. The NFL sent Gruden packing for a matter where they did not lay out expectations/consequences. That is wrong.

[Yoop]

I'm not sure what you are saying there. But listen, once any employer or the gov't decides it's okay to mine any of our personal thoughts and conversations from years ago, then everything is on the table. It only depends upon how motivated the employer or gov't is in finding dirt. I'm thinking 98% of us have uttered things that we would regret today if they were held against us.

I used to work at a place that did some of this a few years ago. EVERY person who worked there was fearful of the next day there.

NFL needs to grow up a bit and make clear expectations AHEAD of time, not ten years after something happened.

I think you're right about the fear, but they aren't "mining" for anything by searching work emails. I think everyone knows that work emails are fair game. If they were emails sent from Gruden's Yahoo account to Bruce Allen's hotmail account, I'd be like "woah! That's shady" and agree with you.

But Gruden's ESPN account to Allen's NFL account? Absolutely fair game for content monitoring and consequences.

I hear what you are saying and agree to an extent. But the matter in this specific case was Gruden emails from how many YEARS ago? And when he was with a different team? And what POLICY did the NFL have about this subject matter at THAT time?

Employers must lay out specific policy about important matters in order to set expectations. (Parents too.) Otherwise, they really have no business taking drastic action against the individuals. And just because expectations have been more clear in recent years doesn't make this any better. The NFL sent Gruden packing for a matter where they did not lay out expectations/consequences. That is wrong.

the NFL investigated WFT for sexual harassment, Grudens emails where exposed, Brian Davis didn't want the fall out Grudens racist remarks could cause with the team, the NFL didn't fire Gruden, Davis did, or would have if Jon didn't resign.

[YoHoChecko]

The emails occurred throughout a seven year period of time from 2010 to 2017. 2017 isn’t that long ago.

And like [mention]Yoop[/mention] said, there was a legitimate official investigation into genuinely abhorrent work circumstances that brought them to light, not coming through a random meta data dump looking for trouble

[Scott4Pack]

I think you're right about the fear, but they aren't "mining" for anything by searching work emails. I think everyone knows that work emails are fair game. If they were emails sent from Gruden's Yahoo account to Bruce Allen's hotmail account, I'd be like "woah! That's shady" and agree with you.

But Gruden's ESPN account to Allen's NFL account? Absolutely fair game for content monitoring and consequences.

I hear what you are saying and agree to an extent. But the matter in this specific case was Gruden emails from how many YEARS ago? And when he was with a different team? And what POLICY did the NFL have about this subject matter at THAT time?

Employers must lay out specific policy about important matters in order to set expectations. (Parents too.) Otherwise, they really have no business taking drastic action against the individuals. And just because expectations have been more clear in recent years doesn't make this any better. The NFL sent Gruden packing for a matter where they did not lay out expectations/consequences. That is wrong.

the NFL investigated WFT for sexual harassment, Grudens emails where exposed, Brian Davis didn't want the fall out Grudens racist remarks could cause with the team, the NFL didn't fire Gruden, Davis did, or would have if Jon didn't resign.

Yeah. I hear you. I won’t disagree with those details. But I’m still going to stand on what I wrote. How far would you want your employer or government to dig back into your past, when they actually didn’t establish a standard of behavior. That is THE question that I put out there. I don’t say that Gruden didn’t do something bad. Or the WFT organization either. I’m looking at the bigger question, because the vast majority of us have written emails or done phone calls, texts, etc that had damning or careless messages. How much of a bucket of worms do we want people in authority to have free reign over us?

I’m old enough to know that the “cause” changes from time to time. What they use to justify dissing Gruden today will be a different cause tomorrow. And every one of us can be picked off because of it. They only thing that’ll vary is how motivated the employer or government is in punishing us.