Packers Huddle

APB wrote: ↑

28 Dec 2021 14:50

If Jonathan Taylor is a serious candidate for MVP, then shouldn’t Cooper Kupp also be in that conversation?

Jonathan Taylor
297 rush 1626 yds 336 rec yds 19 total TD

Cooper Kupp
132 rec 1734 yds 14 TD

So one touches the ball twice as often, has 250 more yards, and 5 more TDs....

I dunno, seems like we picked the right non-QB with Taylor

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

28 Dec 2021 20:02

APB wrote: ↑

28 Dec 2021 14:50

If Jonathan Taylor is a serious candidate for MVP, then shouldn’t Cooper Kupp also be in that conversation?

Jonathan Taylor
297 rush 1626 yds 336 rec yds 19 total TD

Cooper Kupp
132 rec 1734 yds 14 TD

So one touches the ball twice as often, has 250 more yards, and 5 more TDs....

I dunno, seems like we picked the right non-QB with Taylor

Twice as often but with nearly the same production. You’re big into the adjusted stats. Something tells me there is something to be said about Kupp’s production efficiency when he gets his hands on the ball. My guess is if you add Kupp’s touches with randomized touches from his offensive mates to equal Taylor’s touches, Kupp’s value significantly exceeds that of Taylor.

And I simply suggested he, too, should be in the conversation.

APB wrote: ↑

28 Dec 2021 22:50

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

28 Dec 2021 20:02

APB wrote: ↑

28 Dec 2021 14:50

If Jonathan Taylor is a serious candidate for MVP, then shouldn’t Cooper Kupp also be in that conversation?

Jonathan Taylor
297 rush 1626 yds 336 rec yds 19 total TD

Cooper Kupp
132 rec 1734 yds 14 TD

So one touches the ball twice as often, has 250 more yards, and 5 more TDs....

I dunno, seems like we picked the right non-QB with Taylor

Twice as often but with nearly the same production. You’re big into the adjusted stats. Something tells me there is something to be said about Kupp’s production efficiency when he gets his hands on the ball. My guess is if you add Kupp’s touches with randomized touches from his offensive mates to equal Taylor’s touches, Kupp’s value significantly exceeds that of Taylor.

And I simply suggested he, too, should be in the conversation.

TOP advantage goes to the RB, both Kupp and Taylor crank out big chunk plays, less so for Taylor, Running burns more clock making his production a two fold advantage, which imo makes him more team value.

there going to give this to Rodgers imo

For the record, I don't dispute Kupp is down the list when casting a vote for MVP. I just thought he warranted consideration.

Side note: I do find [mention]YoHoChecko[/mention]'s response interesting considering he was a strong advocate for Tyreek Hill being considered MVP a few years back - 2016 as I recall? If memory serves, his argument was based upon Hill's exploits as a ST'er and non-starting WR.

At least I believe that was Yoho. I could be mistaken.

Yoop wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2021 07:49

APB wrote: ↑

28 Dec 2021 22:50

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

28 Dec 2021 20:02

So one touches the ball twice as often, has 250 more yards, and 5 more TDs....

I dunno, seems like we picked the right non-QB with Taylor

Twice as often but with nearly the same production. You’re big into the adjusted stats. Something tells me there is something to be said about Kupp’s production efficiency when he gets his hands on the ball. My guess is if you add Kupp’s touches with randomized touches from his offensive mates to equal Taylor’s touches, Kupp’s value significantly exceeds that of Taylor.

And I simply suggested he, too, should be in the conversation.

TOP advantage goes to the RB, both Kupp and Taylor crank out big chunk plays, less so for Taylor, Running burns more clock making his production a two fold advantage, which imo makes him more team value.

there going to give this to Rodgers imo

I kinda hope not because I can't think of any player who won the regular season MVP that went on to win the SB.

APB wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2021 08:25

For the record, I don't dispute Kupp is down the list when casting a vote for MVP. I just thought he warranted consideration.

Side note: I do find @YoHoChecko's response interesting considering he was a strong advocate for Tyreek Hill being considered MVP a few years back - 2016 as I recall? If memory serves, his argument was based upon Hill's exploits as a ST'er and non-starting WR.

At least I believe that was Yoho. I could be mistaken.

Could be...

I can't claim consistency of views across years. Nor do I particularly remember. Nor am I really sure if I believed that deeply or just wanted to make a case and conversation for it and went overboard on the forum.

I'm just a guy. Sitting in front of his computer. Asking you to debate with me.

Pugger wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2021 08:27

Yoop wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2021 07:49

APB wrote: ↑

28 Dec 2021 22:50

Twice as often but with nearly the same production. You’re big into the adjusted stats. Something tells me there is something to be said about Kupp’s production efficiency when he gets his hands on the ball. My guess is if you add Kupp’s touches with randomized touches from his offensive mates to equal Taylor’s touches, Kupp’s value significantly exceeds that of Taylor.

And I simply suggested he, too, should be in the conversation.

TOP advantage goes to the RB, both Kupp and Taylor crank out big chunk plays, less so for Taylor, Running burns more clock making his production a two fold advantage, which imo makes him more team value.

there going to give this to Rodgers imo

I kinda hope not because I can't think of any player who won the regular season MVP that went on to win the SB.

good point Pugger, the only couple that come to mind are Kurt Warner, and possibly Joe Montana

after looking it up there where a bunch, Warner though was the last one to do it, if Rodgers wins it and we win the SB it would be another achievement with Favre and Starr.

The regular-season MVP winning the Super Bowl used to be commonplace. Before Warner did it, Terrell Davis did it in 1998, Brett Favre in 1996, Steve Young in 1994, Emmitt Smith in 1993, Joe Montana in 1989, Lawrence Taylor in 1986, Mark Moseley in 1982, Terry Bradshaw in 1978 and Bart Starr in 1966.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2 ... ince-1999/

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2021 08:43

I'm just a guy. Sitting in front of his computer. Asking you to debate with me.

There's a movie quote in there somewhere. Damned if I remember from where, tho...

APB wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2021 10:42

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2021 08:43

I'm just a guy. Sitting in front of his computer. Asking you to debate with me.

There's a movie quote in there somewhere. Damned if I remember from where, tho...

Me too (just a guy sitting in front of a computer or cell phone display). Can't recall any movie quote.

APB wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2021 10:42

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2021 08:43

I'm just a guy. Sitting in front of his computer. Asking you to debate with me.

There's a movie quote in there somewhere. Damned if I remember from where, tho...

It's Notting Hill. Hugh Grant. "Just a guy standing in front of a girl asking her to love me" to Julia Roberts, I believe. I'm a sucker for RomComs and of the right age to be well-versed in the late 90s/early aughts variety of them

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2021 10:57

APB wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2021 10:42

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2021 08:43

I'm just a guy. Sitting in front of his computer. Asking you to debate with me.

There's a movie quote in there somewhere. Damned if I remember from where, tho...

It's Notting Hill. Hugh Grant. "Just a guy standing in front of a girl asking her to love me" to Julia Roberts, I believe. I'm a sucker for RomComs and of the right age to be well-versed in the late 90s/early aughts variety of them

That's it! I knew it sounded familiar. One of my wife's all-time favorite movies. Funny enough that I've willingly watched it with her plenty, tho.

I don't want Rodgers to win the MVP for the sole reason that no player has won the MVP and Super Bowl since Kurt Warner.

I feel like a WR has to be TO/Moss-level unstoppable to warrant considerable MVP votes.

In truth, Moss really should have won it in the Pats' 16-0 year over Brady. Moss was the glue.

Labrev wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2021 11:18

I feel like a WR has to be TO/Moss-level unstoppable to warrant considerable MVP votes.

In truth, Moss really should have won it in the Pats' 16-0 year over Brady. Moss was the glue.

Outside of touchdowns, who had/is having the better year? Mind you, Kupp still has another game to go to match Moss's 16 games for accurate comparison.

Moss 2007
Kupp 2021

Moss - first year at pats, types of plays he was making were unbelievable. Just plucking Brady's sky high bombs out of the air.

I don't think they can steal it from Rodgers now.

MLF could also possibly get COTY.

For the purposes of just this season Gute should be considered for exec of the year. Stokes, free agent pick ups but ultimately getting Rodgers back to the team.

Davante should be all pro with Rodgers - I don't think anyone else will make it.

Hopefully the MVP-Super Bowl curse ends this year.

Acrobat wrote: ↑

03 Jan 2022 06:14

Hopefully the MVP-Super Bowl curse ends this year.

Unless Brady gets it; and there is a damn good chance of that.

A loss to the Jets would have hit him a lot, but big comeback win in the face of the AB drama just gunna help his odds. He is have a statistically impressive season and a 12-4 record is definitely nothing to sneeze at. And I could still see a few voters giving Brady a nod if tight because of the covid stuff.

BF004 wrote: ↑

03 Jan 2022 08:47

Acrobat wrote: ↑

03 Jan 2022 06:14

Hopefully the MVP-Super Bowl curse ends this year.

Unless Brady gets it; and there is a damn good chance of that.

A loss to the Jets would have hit him a lot, but big comeback win in the face of the AB drama just gunna help his odds. He is have a statistically impressive season and a 12-4 record is definitely nothing to sneeze at. And I could still see a few voters giving Brady a nod if tight because of the covid stuff.

Brady's stats are indeed impressive but they have been bolstered by volume, not efficiency, at least when compared to Rodgers. Brady has the most attempts of any QB this year by quite a margin - roughly 170 more than Rodgers - yet production is similar. Rodgers beats him across the board in every meaningful efficiency stat and has the KC game as a marker of just how valuable he is to this offense. Rodgers also hasn't laid any eggs on primetime national TV. His lone egg during week one has long since been forgotten. Brady's recent shutout loss to NO is a huge, ugly stain on his resume.

Yeah, MVP QBs don't get shutout; I said it when it happened, I stand by it. They especially don't get shut out in a crucial division game late in the season with playoff seeding and scenarios on the line. Brady already lost the MVP. If he wins it, I won't recognize it as official.