Packers Huddle

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 10:56**

NCF wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 10:54
This is pretty much where I am sitting. OBJ is not going to fix this offense. Neither is any other WR they can add this season. This is where we are and it's really not that far off (but it is definitely ugly when it is off).

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 11:09**

Yoop wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 10:48
and your answer is run the ball, that is one dimensional football, and wont be sustainable, Lafluer and Rodgers both know that even if you don't want to admit it.

What we are doing NOW is one-dimensional football, i.e. Rodgers passing the ball more than he should and only to the guys he "trusts" (Lazard or Cobb), and then saying "well golly gee, tape shows Doubs and Watson were open, I gotta throw to them more!" on the McAfee show... and then never doing it!!

So yes, actually, "run the ball" will in fact open up a new dimension by the guys on our offense who are actually special players, namely Jones, Dillon, even Hill when he gets back. It would also invite the TEs to get more involved, who are inexplicably not being used much despite having lots of talent and rapport with Rodgers and would help the run.

also, reposted for emphasis:

Labrev wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 10:15
It's like you have a Ferrari and a Lambo in your garage (Jones and Dillon) yet you are hung up on the fact that your Scooter situation isn't good enough to get you where you want when you want. Um, hello?? Take your Ferrari/Lambo.

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 11:26**

Labrev wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 11:09

Yoop wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 10:48
and your answer is run the ball, that is one dimensional football, and wont be sustainable, Lafluer and Rodgers both know that even if you don't want to admit it.
What we are doing NOW is one-dimensional football, i.e. Rodgers passing the ball more than he should and only to the guys he "trusts" (Lazard or Cobb), and then saying "well golly gee, tape shows Doubs and Watson were open, I gotta throw to them more!" on the McAfee show... and then never doing it!!

So yes, actually, "run the ball" will in fact open up a new dimension by the guys on our offense who are actually special players, namely Jones, Dillon, even Hill when he gets back.

also, reposted for emphasis:
Labrev wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 10:15
It's like you have a Ferrari and a Lambo in your garage (Jones and Dillon) yet you are hung up on the fact that your Scooter situation isn't good enough to get you where you want when you want. Um, hello?? Take your Ferrari/Lambo.

I admit, Doub caught 3 for 5, and should see more targets, however again, when we see the all22 it will probably show over the top support close enough to jump his route, same wit Cobb, and defenders don't need to double up on anyone else we have.

we have started very slow the last 2 years, not playing the starters in PS to me is the main cause of that, we had 3 rookie receivers that need to contribute, why wait till the start of the season for Rodgers to become familiar with them, doesn't make sense at all.

I'll repeat, your analogy has a shelf life if ya can't pass the ball.

I have to agree to a extent with NCF's post, bringing a receiver in now may be a bit late, we should have done better then the oft injured Watkins in the off season.

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 11:40**

Acrobat wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 08:50

Drj820 wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 08:44
Rodgers for DJ Moore and every first round pick they have for the next decade
I'm down.

He’s making about as much as Davante, no way.

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 11:49**

Davante and "Push-Gate" has reached the next level. I do hope the guy is ok. Apparently there are other views (though I haven't seen them), that make this look worse for Adams (though I've read both ways). Sidelines after the game are said to be nuts. Surprised stuff like this doesn't happen more. Collisions at least. Curious to hear the opinion of those who work them.

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 12:13**

paco wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 11:49
Davante and "Push-Gate" has reached the next level. I do hope the guy is ok. Apparently there are other views (though I haven't seen them), that make this look worse for Adams (though I've read both ways). Sidelines after the game are said to be nuts. Surprised stuff like this doesn't happen more. Collisions at least. Curious to hear the opinion of those who work them.

Maybe he shouldn't have been blocking the tunnel. Sorry, I don't feel for the guy. As a photographer, your job is to take pictures and stay out of the way. It's not like he didn't see him coming. He didn't move. He made no motion like he was going to move. Does not excuse the push, but, file a police report? Way to get banned from the stadium.

It's like the moron who was tackled on the field the other day filing a police report. Really? Your breaking the law and filing a police report? So, you will be pleading guilty in your case, right?

Edit: After seeing another angle, the guy wasn't even looking or blocking the tunnel. But come on man. File a police report? How about accepting an apology?

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 12:27**

Raptorman wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 12:13

paco wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 11:49
Davante and "Push-Gate" has reached the next level. I do hope the guy is ok. Apparently there are other views (though I haven't seen them), that make this look worse for Adams (though I've read both ways). Sidelines after the game are said to be nuts. Surprised stuff like this doesn't happen more. Collisions at least. Curious to hear the opinion of those who work them.

Maybe he shouldn't have been blocking the tunnel. Sorry, I don't feel for the guy. As a photographer, your job is to take pictures and stay out of the way. It's not like he didn't see him coming. He didn't move. He made no motion like he was going to move. Does not excuse the push, but, file a police report? Way to get banned from the stadium.

It's like the moron who was tackled on the field the other day filing a police report. Really? Your breaking the law and filing a police report? So, you will be pleading guilty in your case, right?

Edit: After seeing another angle, the guy wasn't even looking or blocking the tunnel. But come on man. File a police report? How about accepting an apology?

???? What was he doing that was illegal?

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 12:47**

Raptorman wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 12:13

paco wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 11:49
Davante and "Push-Gate" has reached the next level. I do hope the guy is ok. Apparently there are other views (though I haven't seen them), that make this look worse for Adams (though I've read both ways). Sidelines after the game are said to be nuts. Surprised stuff like this doesn't happen more. Collisions at least. Curious to hear the opinion of those who work them.

Maybe he shouldn't have been blocking the tunnel. Sorry, I don't feel for the guy. As a photographer, your job is to take pictures and stay out of the way. It's not like he didn't see him coming. He didn't move. He made no motion like he was going to move. Does not excuse the push, but, file a police report? Way to get banned from the stadium.

It's like the moron who was tackled on the field the other day filing a police report. Really? Your breaking the law and filing a police report? So, you will be pleading guilty in your case, right?

Edit: After seeing another angle, the guy wasn't even looking or blocking the tunnel. But come on man. File a police report? How about accepting an apology?

The police report was filed prior to the public apology, by the sounds of it. If he was injured, the police probably got involved immediately and collected his statement, so he most likely never had a chance to pull out his phone and check Twitter for Davante's apology, especially if he sustained an injury.

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 13:00**

In retrospect, I should reconsider my stance about not giving Rodgers any good WRs, not because it's wrong but because it implies we should continue doing things the same but with bad receivers rather than what we need to do: change what we are doing fundamentally.

This is on LaFleur for continuing to indulge the Rodgers-McCarthy style of offense which can't be run with what we have, rather than totally redesigning it to what he had in Tennessee or the Saints' model of transitioning to a run-heavy offense like they did with Kamara and (then) Ingram, which we actually could run and do really well with.

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 13:57**

Labrev wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 13:00
In retrospect, I should reconsider my stance about not giving Rodgers any good WRs, not because it's wrong but because it implies we should continue doing things the same but with bad receivers rather than what we need to do: change what we are doing fundamentally.

This is on LaFleur for continuing to indulge the Rodgers-McCarthy style of offense which can't be run with what we have, rather than totally redesigning it to what he had in Tennessee or the Saints' model of transitioning to a run-heavy offense like they did with Kamara and (then) Ingram, which we actually could run and do really well with.

if ya got a great gun, why use cheap bullets?

we needed to do more then hoping mid round draft picks will become feature type receivers, why wait till the best one is gone before attempting to replace him, my point is Watson may become great, but I doubt if it's this year, Doubs is on pace to possibly get a K, or very possibly hit a rookie wall by the time the PO's start.

I'am all for dividing 25 to 30 touches between Jones and Dillon (run and pass) to do that with consistency we have to be able to pass though, and just blaming Rodgers or Lafluer for what we've seen is what fans tend to do.

I don't like what I've seen any more then you, but the answer isn't to run the ball all the time, I have to believe if Lafluer isn't having Rodgers throwing short up tempo passes it actually is because our receivers havn't put anything on film that convinces Matt we'd have success doing it, or Rodgers is changing up the called plays, which he says he hasn't been doing, so who do we believe?

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 14:04**

Yet we have been successful throwing short passes for YAC... We were top 3 in explosive plays before this week and had the top YAC in the league.

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 14:39**

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 14:04
Yet we have been successful throwing short passes for YAC... We were top 3 in explosive plays before this week and had the top YAC in the league.

then why do we have so much trouble sustaining drives, these stats are deceiving 23, look at the lac of production in the second half of games, hey I like those stack sets on the boundary as much as any one, but defenders are wise to that stuff and are gearing up to defeat those blocks and the plays go no where, sometimes stats don't align with personal observation, and imo thats true with these.

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 14:42**

Amari Rodgers can go bye-bye, but the more critical problems are in LaFleur's and A-Rod's heads. LaFleur needs to take ownership of the offense, and Aaron needs to get his head out of his own ass.

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 14:44**

Honestly somewhat surprised Amari is still employed.

OBJ is a great returner.

Early February +10 = early November. Lock him up now.

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 14:56**

Yoop wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 13:57
if ya got a great gun, why use cheap bullets?

I'am all for dividing 25 to 30 touches between Jones and Dillon (run and pass) to do that with consistency we have to be able to pass though, and just blaming Rodgers or Lafluer for what we've seen is what fans tend to do.

I don't like what I've seen any more then you, but the answer isn't to run the ball all the time

You are still misunderstanding the whole idea. Of course we can't run the ball "all" the time, of course we have to be able to pass, yet we need to significantly increase the number of touches (not just carries but receptions) both RBs get if we want to help out the passing game.

The point is not to replace the pass with the run wholesale, it's to have the run become the vehicle through which the pass can flourish: use Jones as a receiver with Dillon in the backfield, involve TEs in the pass more, make the opposing D key in on the run and then beat them with Play Action[!] passes.

MLF is supposed to be a Kubiak disciple. Why are the TEs MIA? Why do we never see play-action passes -- the system's signature play? This looks more like the McCarthy offense than a Kubiak scheme.

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 15:02**

Yoop wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 14:39

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 14:04
Yet we have been successful throwing short passes for YAC... We were top 3 in explosive plays before this week and had the top YAC in the league.
then why do we have so much trouble sustaining drives, these stats are deceiving 23, look at the lac of production in the second half of games, hey I like those stack sets on the boundary as much as any one, but defenders are wise to that stuff and are gearing up to defeat those blocks and the plays go no where, sometimes stats don't align with personal observation, and imo thats true with these.

They aren't deceiving. They are real, see below. Why do we have trouble sustaining drives? Rodgers is obsessed with the long ball. He apparently said a week ago that we need to be more explosive at a time when we were the 3rd most explosive offense in the league. That probably could be taken to mean we need to go down the field more as we sure had been explosive up to that point. Then we tried to do that 6 times last Sunday morning and failed all 6 times. The most attempts without a completion in Rodgers' career.

Rodgers is 5th in YAC/Completion - https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... vanced.htm - Then look at the completed air yards. Yikes!

We do not lack production in the 2nd half of games. We lacked production in the 2nd half of the Bucs, Bears, and Giants games, but had great production in the 2nd half of the Patriots game. 207 yards passing. 111 yards rushing. 2 Touchdowns. 2 Field Goals.

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑
04 Oct 2022 10:47

The Green Bay Packers have created 35 total explosive plays – defined here as a completed pass of at least 20 yards or a run of at least 10 yards – through four weeks of the 2022 season. The Packers rank tied for second in the NFL in explosive plays, according to tracking from Marcus Mosher.

Explosive play creators
Aaron Jones, 13
Allen Lazard, 4
Romeo Doubs, 4
AJ Dillon, 4
Randall Cobb, 3
Sammy Watkins, 2
Robert Tonyan, 2
Christian Watson, 2
Tyler Davis, 1

Passes of 20+ yards (17 total)
Sammy Watkins, 55-yard catch
Randall Cobb, 40-yard catch
Allen Lazard, 32-yard catch
Allen Lazard, 26-yard catch
Christian Watson, 25-yard catch
Allen Lazard, 24-yard catch
Randall Cobb, 24-yard catch
Sammy Watkins, 24-yard catch
Tyler Davis, 23-yard catch
Robert Tonyan, 23-yard catch
Romeo Doubs, 23-yard catch
Aaron Jones, 22-yard catch
Allen Lazard, 22-yard catch
Romeo Doubs, 21-yard catch
Randall Cobb, 20-yard catch
Romeo Doubs, 20-yard catch
Robert Tonyan, 20-yard catch (TD)

Runs of 10+ yards (18)
Aaron Jones, 36-yard rush
Aaron Jones, 29-yard rush
Aaron Jones, 20-yard rush
Aaron Jones, 18-yard rush
Aaron Jones, 17-yard rush
Christian Watson, 15-yard rush (TD)
Aaron Jones, 15-yard rush (TD)
AJ Dillon, 14-yard rush
Aaron Jones, 14-yard rush
AJ Dillon, 13-yard rush
Aaron Jones, 12-yard rush
AJ Dillon, 11-yard rush
AJ Dillon, 11-yard rush
Romeo Doubs, 11-yard rush
Aaron Jones, 10-yard rush
Aaron Jones, 10-yard rush
Aaron Jones, 10-yard rush
Aaron Jones, 10-yard rush

Passes of 20+ yards by game
Week 1, at MIN: 4
Week 2, vs. CHI: 4
Week 3, at TB: 4
Week 4, vs. NE: 5

Runs of 20+ yards by game
Week 1, at MIN: 5
Week 2, vs. CHI: 5
Week 3, at TB: 1
Week 4, vs. NE: 7
https://packerswire.usatoday.com/2022/1 ... ce=twitter

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 15:18**

BF004 wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 14:44
Honestly somewhat surprised Amari is still employed.

OBJ is a great returner.

Early February +10 = early November. Lock him up now.

That would be Dec. just FYI.

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 15:52**

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 15:18

BF004 wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 14:44
Honestly somewhat surprised Amari is still employed.

OBJ is a great returner.

Early February +10 = early November. Lock him up now.
That would be Dec. just FYI.

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 16:23**

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑
11 Oct 2022 15:02
We do not lack production in the 2nd half of games. We lacked production in the 2nd half of the Bucs, Bears, and Giants games, but had great production in the 2nd half of the Patriots game. 207 yards passing. 111 yards rushing. 2 Touchdowns. 2 Field Goals.

and almost the entire Minny game, again, we have been inconsistent and it's not because Rodgers and Lafluer are calling for iso verticals in every second half game, you refuse to accept that our receivers can't get open on a consistent enough basis 5 or 10 yrds beyond the los, we fail to move the chains at critical times during games.

you want to blame lafluer and Rodgers for this stuff and defend our situation at WR, to some extent I can agree with the angst with Rodgers, but I'am not going to blame him and exonerate this group of WR's, cause that has been the biggest reason this offense has struggled for ages, you and others here simply refuse to accept that, go ask any opposing coach in the league and they will tell you the same thing I'am, and I'd take there word for it over our beat writers and guys like Herman, or some stats that actually are deceiving.

Posted: **11 Oct 2022 16:41**

I don’t see the point in arguing which reason the offense sucks, because all the reasons given are valid and are legit factors.

1) would it help if we had better receivers? Heck ya
2) would it help if we would run the ball more? Heck ya
3) Has Lafleur bent the knee to Rodgers and we’re seeing the negative affects of that? Heck ya
4) do we need to be more creative and scheme guys open more often? Of course
5) should rodgers keep his mouth shut and worry about scoring points instead of calling out star CB Jaire? Yup.
6) Does Rodgers throw too much on the 1 yard line because he wants a td pass instead of just handing it to Jones or Dillon for a yard? Yup.
7) does rodgers not play within the offense, miss open guys, and throw the ball deep too much? Yessir

All of it is true, and all of it can be fixed/addressed.

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