Packers Huddle

A day removed from the Kenny interview and I think it was more significant than I first gave it credit for. In terms of, I think 12 said a lot.

He told us who he is not mad at (players, fans, and coaches), and he told us exactly who the problem was with. This felt like old news, but not sure we have heard it directly from his mouth. To say it on ESPN...to put the bulls eye on directly two men’s back (Gute and Murphy)...to further dig in and give no ground that the issue can be resolved...moves the needle for me.

I was pretty 50/50 on the outcome of this feud for the 2021. I think the interview made it harder for him to come back, and less likely. In his own way he confirmed what we knew...He ain’t burying the hatchet with Murphy and Gute.

Drj820 wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 08:58

A day removed from the Kenny interview and I think it was more significant than I first gave it credit for. In terms of, I think 12 said a lot.

He told us who he is not mad at (players, fans, and coaches), and he told us exactly who the problem was with. This felt like old news, but not sure we have heard it directly from his mouth. To say it on ESPN...to put the bulls eye on directly two men’s back (Gute and Murphy)...to further dig in and give no ground that the issue can be resolved...moves the needle for me.

I was pretty 50/50 on the outcome of this feud for the 2021. I think the interview made it harder for him to come back, and less likely. In his own way he confirmed what we knew...He ain’t burying the hatchet with Murphy and Gute.

Ehhh, I see what you mean, but it also doesn't change the underlying incentives in which it makes zero sense to trade him, and made it easier for him to coexist in a locker room with the people he actually shares space with if he does come back.

He also didn't take the chance to say out loud that he is dug in or isn't budging.

GB has just two options: get rid of Gute or let #12 walk as expensive as possible.

If those are the 2 options, you let Rodgers walk. If fire Gutenkunst you lose the organization for the foreseeable future. You give the players all the power in running the team. Awful idea.

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 09:01

Drj820 wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 08:58

A day removed from the Kenny interview and I think it was more significant than I first gave it credit for. In terms of, I think 12 said a lot.

He told us who he is not mad at (players, fans, and coaches), and he told us exactly who the problem was with. This felt like old news, but not sure we have heard it directly from his mouth. To say it on ESPN...to put the bulls eye on directly two men’s back (Gute and Murphy)...to further dig in and give no ground that the issue can be resolved...moves the needle for me.

I was pretty 50/50 on the outcome of this feud for the 2021. I think the interview made it harder for him to come back, and less likely. In his own way he confirmed what we knew...He ain’t burying the hatchet with Murphy and Gute.

Ehhh, I see what you mean, but it also doesn't change the underlying incentives in which it makes zero sense to trade him, and made it easier for him to coexist in a locker room with the people he actually shares space with if he does come back.

He also didn't take the chance to say out loud that he is dug in or isn't budging.

as stubborn as Rodgers has always seemed to be, if he choses to hold out I don't see him changing his mind any time during the season, in that sense I see no advantage for the team to not trade him, get a couple #1's and maybe a player or two, and move on with Love/Bortles, he wont coexist in the locker room, he wont even come to town, why would he? whats he to gain by being here? the fans, as usual are siding with the FO, and like with Favre his presence will be a locker room cancer, a lot of players will side with Rodgers, so it will divide versus unit players.

who knows really whats going on, but the longer this drags out the more division it will create.

I've seen posters estimate the haul we'll get by trading Rodgers, I should say over estimate, this idea that we'll get more then two first rounder is insane, who actually would give up 3 future years of #1's? I can't think of any GM that desperate, same with Players, I don't expect to get recent first round selections, maybe, but thats a real stretch to expect that.

2 first, and maybe a 3rd or 4th would work for me, and maybe several backup players, actually I think Rodgers is more valuable to us then any other team.

APB wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 06:18

German_Panzer wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 01:45

This dude protects his legacy and sees it threatened.

By destroying it himself?

That's just the GB-fan perspective. Rodgers doesn't care about franchises and its fans. He's a pro. He cares about his legacy because that's his paved road (VIP, pundit jobs,...) and anti-depressiva for the 2nd part of his life. It's about him - and only him, the team just is as importat as it suits him. (This works because every player thinks like it and so they work together but not for the team, but for themselves thru being a team - subtle but important difference.) It's important to be able to switch perspectives to understand the other side or it will always be a mystery, even if it destroys dreams.

@pckfan23: Well, it depends what's there against Gute. If he did some serious blunders, it could be him, esp. if the majority of players backs #12. The organization is weaker than the people who run it. It tries to make it forgotten but actually GB's 53 can do whatever they want because Gute & Murphy and MLF are nothing without them, but they are still good to go without the white collar bozos. If this was 2012 Rodgers might ignite a revolution, but he hasn't the leverage he would have had 10 years ago. So eventually I agree with you, they'll trade him...I might even trade him to some NFC team if they offer better than the AFC because without Rodgers we won't matter anyway and we'll be in rebuild-mode.

Yoop wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 09:36

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 09:01

Drj820 wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 08:58

A day removed from the Kenny interview and I think it was more significant than I first gave it credit for. In terms of, I think 12 said a lot.

He told us who he is not mad at (players, fans, and coaches), and he told us exactly who the problem was with. This felt like old news, but not sure we have heard it directly from his mouth. To say it on ESPN...to put the bulls eye on directly two men’s back (Gute and Murphy)...to further dig in and give no ground that the issue can be resolved...moves the needle for me.

I was pretty 50/50 on the outcome of this feud for the 2021. I think the interview made it harder for him to come back, and less likely. In his own way he confirmed what we knew...He ain’t burying the hatchet with Murphy and Gute.

Ehhh, I see what you mean, but it also doesn't change the underlying incentives in which it makes zero sense to trade him, and made it easier for him to coexist in a locker room with the people he actually shares space with if he does come back.

He also didn't take the chance to say out loud that he is dug in or isn't budging.

as stubborn as Rodgers has always seemed to be, if he choses to hold out I don't see him changing his mind any time during the season, in that sense I see no advantage for the team to not trade him, get a couple #1's and maybe a player or two, and move on with Love/Bortles, he wont coexist in the locker room, he wont even come to town, why would he? whats he to gain by being here? the fans, as usual are siding with the FO, and like with Favre his presence will be a locker room cancer, cause a lot of players will side with Rodgers, so it will divide versus unit players.

who knows really whats going on, but the longer this drags out the more division it will create.

Yeah the biggest thing for me is if we can get an attractive offer this summer. If the Broncos for instance offer a WR or even their new CB plus 3 1st round picks and it appears there is no reconcilation that will happen...he's gone.

But if the trade offer is 2 first rounders....I'd have a tougher time pulling the trigger just for the sake of not having a divided locker room.

It's gonna be a tough call if it comes to that. I hope it doesn't.

Yoop wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 09:36

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 09:01

Drj820 wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 08:58

A day removed from the Kenny interview and I think it was more significant than I first gave it credit for. In terms of, I think 12 said a lot.

He told us who he is not mad at (players, fans, and coaches), and he told us exactly who the problem was with. This felt like old news, but not sure we have heard it directly from his mouth. To say it on ESPN...to put the bulls eye on directly two men’s back (Gute and Murphy)...to further dig in and give no ground that the issue can be resolved...moves the needle for me.

I was pretty 50/50 on the outcome of this feud for the 2021. I think the interview made it harder for him to come back, and less likely. In his own way he confirmed what we knew...He ain’t burying the hatchet with Murphy and Gute.

Ehhh, I see what you mean, but it also doesn't change the underlying incentives in which it makes zero sense to trade him, and made it easier for him to coexist in a locker room with the people he actually shares space with if he does come back.

He also didn't take the chance to say out loud that he is dug in or isn't budging.

as stubborn as Rodgers has always seemed to be, if he choses to hold out I don't see him changing his mind any time during the season, in that sense I see no advantage for the team to not trade him, get a couple #1's and maybe a player or two, and move on with Love/Bortles, he wont coexist in the locker room, he wont even come to town, why would he? whats he to gain by being here? the fans, as usual are siding with the FO, and like with Favre his presence will be a locker room cancer, cause a lot of players will side with Rodgers, so it will divide versus unit players.

who knows really whats going on, but the longer this drags out the more division it will create.

Bingo, it’s starting to look like all the rational things that would bring a normal player back to the team and cause him to end his holdout May not being deciding factors to 12 as he is ruled primarily by his stubbornness and inability to bury hatchets.

I guess I just don't see the downside to retaining him on the roster. Like, the media constantly asking people about Rodgers will be annoying, but really low-level as far as outside distractions go. I just don't think it's a big deal. It's hilarious to watch all these media members being like "at some point, this will cause more trouble than it's worth" when they are referring exclusively to themselves.

Like, listen to Amos yesterday. Listen to Clark and Aaron Jones yesterday. They're fine. Everyone is fine.

go pak go wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 09:55

Yoop wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 09:36

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 09:01

Ehhh, I see what you mean, but it also doesn't change the underlying incentives in which it makes zero sense to trade him, and made it easier for him to coexist in a locker room with the people he actually shares space with if he does come back.

He also didn't take the chance to say out loud that he is dug in or isn't budging.

as stubborn as Rodgers has always seemed to be, if he choses to hold out I don't see him changing his mind any time during the season, in that sense I see no advantage for the team to not trade him, get a couple #1's and maybe a player or two, and move on with Love/Bortles, he wont coexist in the locker room, he wont even come to town, why would he? whats he to gain by being here? the fans, as usual are siding with the FO, and like with Favre his presence will be a locker room cancer, cause a lot of players will side with Rodgers, so it will divide versus unit players.

who knows really whats going on, but the longer this drags out the more division it will create.

Yeah the biggest thing for me is if we can get an attractive offer this summer. If the Broncos for instance offer a WR or even their new CB plus 3 1st round picks and it appears there is no reconcilation that will happen...he's gone.

But if the trade offer is 2 first rounders....I'd have a tougher time pulling the trigger just for the sake of not having a divided locker room.

It's gonna be a tough call if it comes to that. I hope it doesn't.

I added a few things to my previous response, #1 is I don't see any GM giving up 3 first rounders, or recent first round picks, and the reason for that is they all know it's better for us to trade Rodgers then allow it to become a worse situation if we keep him, seriously we will have media explosion concerning this all season, every presser for MLF and Guty after every game will start with What about Rodgers this, or Rodgers that, it's why we peddled Favre as soon as we could, to many distractions.

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 09:59

I guess I just don't see the downside to retaining him on the roster. Like, the media constantly asking people about Rodgers will be annoying, but really low-level as far as outside distractions go. I just don't think it's a big deal. It's hilarious to watch all these media members being like "at some point, this will cause more trouble than it's worth" when they are referring exclusively to themselves.

Like, listen to Amos yesterday. Listen to Clark and Aaron Jones yesterday. They're fine. Everyone is fine.

Yoho, if he refuses to play what is the team goal for keeping him? punishment for not bowing to Guty? we gain zero keeping him, and the distractions will be far worse then you seem to think, it'll snow ball, players will become discontented, nothing good comes from playing hard ball with a stubborn person, both sides lose

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 09:59

I guess I just don't see the downside to retaining him on the roster. Like, the media constantly asking people about Rodgers will be annoying, but really low-level as far as outside distractions go. I just don't think it's a big deal. It's hilarious to watch all these media members being like "at some point, this will cause more trouble than it's worth" when they are referring exclusively to themselves.

Like, listen to Amos yesterday. Listen to Clark and Aaron Jones yesterday. They're fine. Everyone is fine.

I don’t think it’s a distraction the players can’t deal with either, but if he is just being paid to sit at home...gotta think at some point Gute will want to not keep being embarrassed and grab the loot while he can

Breaking news:
Dechambeau and Rodgers to face off against Brady and Mickelson on TNT in July in a celeb golf match btw lol

Drj820 wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 10:12

I don’t think it’s a distraction the players can’t deal with either, but if he is just being paid to sit at home...gotta think at some point Gute will want to not keep being embarrassed and grab the loot while he can

Breaking news:
Dechambeau and Rodgers to face off against Brady and Mickelson on TNT in July in a celeb golf match btw lol

He doesn't get paid. If he sits, we get tons of money back; massive fines for missing time; he misses game checks for not playing. Sitting him makes him choose between playing for us or not playing at all. Sitting incites him to return at some point to get credit toward the year. Sitting gives us massive cap flexibility in 2022. And we can still trade him later in the season or next season if he doesn't budge.

There's no scenario in which we pay Rodgers and he doesn't play; that's not how contracts work, it's not how the CBA works. Once Rodgers realizes he can't play for anyone but us, the binary of never playing again or playing for the Packers is a much more advantageous decision matrix toward his return.

So we can keep him, get massive cap savings, and then trade him next year when the money makes more sense and the draft picks we receive are known quantities. Or we can keep him until he comes back. There is no incentive to rush the decision for the Packers. Rodgers' pain points come once training camp starts, and not before. Trading him before that never even gives the incentive structure a chance to work out in our favor.

Let's be real. Rodgers is just trying to make a play to do exactly what Brady did last season. Find a team with a decent roster who's willing to bring some other veterans in who want a ring. Then maybe he'll get Adams to join him in a year.

If he can't find it, then he'll come back to Green Bay and say it was all overblown.

Yoop wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 10:05

go pak go wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 09:55

Yoop wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 09:36

as stubborn as Rodgers has always seemed to be, if he choses to hold out I don't see him changing his mind any time during the season, in that sense I see no advantage for the team to not trade him, get a couple #1's and maybe a player or two, and move on with Love/Bortles, he wont coexist in the locker room, he wont even come to town, why would he? whats he to gain by being here? the fans, as usual are siding with the FO, and like with Favre his presence will be a locker room cancer, cause a lot of players will side with Rodgers, so it will divide versus unit players.

who knows really whats going on, but the longer this drags out the more division it will create.

Yeah the biggest thing for me is if we can get an attractive offer this summer. If the Broncos for instance offer a WR or even their new CB plus 3 1st round picks and it appears there is no reconcilation that will happen...he's gone.

But if the trade offer is 2 first rounders....I'd have a tougher time pulling the trigger just for the sake of not having a divided locker room.

It's gonna be a tough call if it comes to that. I hope it doesn't.

I added a few things to my previous response, #1 is I don't see any GM giving up 3 first rounders, or recent first round picks, and the reason for that is they all know it's better for us to trade Rodgers then allow it to become a worse situation if we keep him, seriously we will have media explosion concerning this all season, every presser for MLF and Guty after every game will start with What about Rodgers this, or Rodgers that, it's why we peddled Favre as soon as we could, to many distractions.

I have always thought the term "distraction" is far too overblown and overrated.

So MLF gets asked a question of "where is Rodgers" that takes up 5 to 10 minutes of his time each press conference.

Big whoop. It's time he would have to spend at a podium anyways.

Yoop wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 10:10

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 09:59

I guess I just don't see the downside to retaining him on the roster. Like, the media constantly asking people about Rodgers will be annoying, but really low-level as far as outside distractions go. I just don't think it's a big deal. It's hilarious to watch all these media members being like "at some point, this will cause more trouble than it's worth" when they are referring exclusively to themselves.

Like, listen to Amos yesterday. Listen to Clark and Aaron Jones yesterday. They're fine. Everyone is fine.

Yoho, if he refuses to play what is the team goal for keeping him? punishment for not bowing to Guty? we gain zero keeping him, and the distractions will be far worse then you seem to think, it'll snow ball, players will become discontented, nothing good comes from playing hard ball with a stubborn person, both sides lose

The idea I think most people are missing is just because you don't sell something in 2021, doesn't mean you can sell something in 2022.



If you feel the market is "deflated" because teams expect the Packers have to move on from Rodgers, pressure the market by saying, "we can just hold him". It's like the stock market. You can panic sell when stock is going down....or you can hold it for another 12 months and the FMV will likely rise from the stock's bottom price.

And if people have the audacity to say the Packers is screwing a player by not letting him play in 2021 via a trade, the defense for that is easy. The Packers can just keep saying, "he is under contract with us and we would love to have him play football in 2021 for the Green Bay Packers."

Acrobat wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 10:21

Let's be real. Rodgers is just trying to make a play to do exactly what Brady did last season. Find a team with a decent roster who's willing to bring some other veterans in who want a ring. Then maybe he'll get Adams to join him in a year.

If he can't find it, then he'll come back to Green Bay and say it was all overblown.

Green Bay gives him the best chance to win a Championship in 2021.

Let's break this down:

Aaron Rodgers gets traded right now...

here's how it impacts the 2021 season:

• Jordan Love or Blake Bortles are the starting QBs

• There is 0% chance Rodgers plays for the Packers this year

• We have an additional starting-quality player obtained in the trade

• The 2021 cap is reduced by $16 million

and here's how it impacts the 2022 season:

• Jordan Love or Blake Bortles are the starting QBs

• There is a 0% chance Rodgers plays for the Packers this year

• We have an additional first round draft pick that is likely in the 20s or 30s

• We have a $14 million dead cap hit

Aaron Rodgers doesn't get traded right now but doesn't return in time for the season...

here's how it impacts the 2021 season:

• Jordan Love or Blake Bortles are the starting QBs

• There is non-0% chance Rodgers plays for the Packers this year

• distraction

here's how it impacts the 2022 season:

• Jordan Love or Blake Bortles are the starting QBs, unless....

• There is a non-zero chance that Rodgers has returned to the Packers by now

• Massive cap savings for every game check and workout bonus Rodgers missed

• The ability to trade Rodgers for a top-10 pick in the draft instead of an unknown pick

• The ability to acquire a starting-caliber player via trade for 2022 instead of for 2021

So, like, MAYBE.... a starting caliber player in a trade a year earlier. A distraction. A worse draft pick in return for him next year. And fully closing the door on any potential future resolution. That's what you get in 2021 for trading him now. Why is that worth it?

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 10:20

Drj820 wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 10:12

I don’t think it’s a distraction the players can’t deal with either, but if he is just being paid to sit at home...gotta think at some point Gute will want to not keep being embarrassed and grab the loot while he can

Breaking news:
Dechambeau and Rodgers to face off against Brady and Mickelson on TNT in July in a celeb golf match btw lol

He doesn't get paid. If he sits, we get tons of money back; massive fines for missing time; he misses game checks for not playing. Sitting him makes him choose between playing for us or not playing at all. Sitting incites him to return at some point to get credit toward the year. Sitting gives us massive cap flexibility in 2022. And we can still trade him later in the season or next season if he doesn't budge.

There's no scenario in which we pay Rodgers and he doesn't play; that's not how contracts work, it's not how the CBA works. Once Rodgers realizes he can't play for anyone but us, the binary of never playing again or playing for the Packers is a much more advantageous decision matrix toward his return.

So we can keep him, get massive cap savings, and then trade him next year when the money makes more sense and the draft picks we receive are known quantities. Or we can keep him until he comes back. There is no incentive to rush the decision for the Packers. Rodgers' pain points come once training camp starts, and not before. Trading him before that never even gives the incentive structure a chance to work out in our favor.

What happens to all the cap space we allocated for him and then don’t spend bc he doesn’t play? Are you saying we get it the next year?

If so I vote to make him sit. I like trading for known picks too.

Drj820 wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 10:37

What happens to all the cap space we allocated for him and then don’t spend bc he doesn’t play? Are you saying we get it the next year?

If so I vote to make him sit. I like trading for known picks too.

Yes, we get a credit on the 2022 cap for the money Rodgers doesn't get paid this year but was counted against our cap this year.

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 10:39

Drj820 wrote: ↑

26 May 2021 10:37

What happens to all the cap space we allocated for him and then don’t spend bc he doesn’t play? Are you saying we get it the next year?

If so I vote to make him sit. I like trading for known picks too.

Yes, we get a credit on the 2022 cap for the money Rodgers doesn't get paid this year but was counted against our cap this year.

And if he goes full tilt and retires, then he pays us back his "unearned" bonus money (about $23 million I think) and his cap number goes away from our 2021 books immediately. BUT, if he wants to return, we still own his rights for 3 more years and can trade those rights to a team next year once that desire to return is made public.