2021 NFL Draft Discussion

[go pak go]

Right now I would have the following for CBs for the Packers in the draft that I am looking at:

Tier 1: (but ain't happenin bro)

Caleb Farley
Jaycee Horn

Tier 2:

Patrick Surtain (I don't like him like others do but he will be gone anyways)
Greg Newsome
Asante Samuel Jr.
Paulson Adebo
Eric Stokes

Tier 3:

Elijah Molden
Ifeatu Melifonwu
Trill Williams
Tyson Campbell
Ambry Thomas
Kary Vincent Jr.

I don't know much else below that to be honest.

Tier 1 is basically RUN THE F*ING card up now.
Tier 2 is I would be happy at 29 all the way back to 62 and stoked in round 3 if they were pick. (definitely going in order of most preferred to lower round)
Tier 3 is probably Round 3 to Round 5 candidates.

But basically I just look for one thing. Explosive. Athletic. Smooth hips.

If I see the word, tight hips etc....no. Just no.

[YoHoChecko]

Ooof, you gotta swap Stokes and Campbell among UGA CBs. Stokes isn't physical enough for me and I'm not sure he has all the tools. Campbell does have some ball location issues, I admit, but I think he's both a higher ceiling and a more versatile player, despite his good length

[go pak go]

I don't love either of the Georgia CBs until Round 3 at the earliest honestly.

Stokes is weird for me. Some people are raving about him and say he's a hidden gem and yet his tape says otherwise.

The narrative I was reading is that the country doesn't actually know how athletic he is and more importantly, his coach raves about his personality and says the team that drafts him is going to be getting a steal.

I probably have him too high and I have never actually drafted him in any of my mock drafts. He honestly probably has risen on my radar mostly due to breaking the 4.3's at his Pro Day.

But the same is said for Asante Samuel.

I see some have him in the 20's and not reaching us and others having him in the 3rd round. Just a lot of variation in grades and perception behind the top 3.

[YoHoChecko]

I don't love either of the Georgia CBs until Round 3 at the earliest honestly.

Stokes is weird for me. Some people are raving about him and say he's a hidden gem and yet his tape says otherwise.

The narrative I was reading is that the country doesn't actually know how athletic he is and more importantly, his coach raves about his personality and says the team that drafts him is going to be getting a steal.

I probably have him too high and I have never actually drafted him in any of my mock drafts. He honestly probably has risen on my radar mostly due to breaking the 4.3's at his Pro Day.

But the same is said for Asante Samuel.

I see some have him in the 20's and not reaching us and others having him in the 3rd round. Just a lot of variation in grades and perception behind the top 3.

Yeah, for me Stokes is one of those guys where you buy the measurables without seeing it on tape; Campbell is one where you buy the high-end tape without seeing the down-to-down consistency.

For me, in the draft on days 1 and 2, I want to buy flashes of tape and rely on coaching and experience to build consistency than just measurables but unspectacular film. That said, I recognize you run the risk of getting Kevin King 2.0 when you rely on flashes--a guy who showed similarly but never developed the consistency.

[Yoop]

But basically I just look for one thing. Explosive. Athletic. Smooth hips.

If I see the word, tight hips etc....no. Just no.

If they can't dance, then they shouldn't even come to the party

KIng really fooled us, what where his cod stats, the3 guy takes forever to flip his hips, he makes up for that by being straight line fast, against WR with comparable speed he's toast.

[YoHoChecko]

KIng really fooled us, what where his cod stats, the3 guy takes forever to flip his hips, he makes up for that by being straight line fast, against WR with comparable speed he's toast.

His cod numbers were amazing. I think he was in the 98th percentile in the 3-cone drill despite being like 6'3"

That said, I remember at the time analysts saying that those numbers didn't show up on tape. So that may have always been more preparation and measurable fools' gold

[BF004]

[go pak go]

I really like Moehring.

I just don't think his draft slot will align with our value at all.

[YoHoChecko]

I really like the idea of an instinctive CB/S hybrid type of player with the size and physicality of a safety but the c.o.d. of a CB being a sort of slot specialist. Like the old Charles Woodson role of a CB essentially playing LB, where you can hide a lack of deep speed through a more specialized role without sacrificing too much run D or physical presence in the middle of the field...

But still, taking a safety early given our roster would be very very tough to swallow.

[go pak go]

I really like the idea of an instinctive CB/S hybrid type of player with the size and physicality of a safety but the c.o.d. of a CB being a sort of slot specialist. Like the old Charles Woodson role of a CB essentially playing LB, where you can hide a lack of deep speed through a more specialized role without sacrificing too much run D or physical presence in the middle of the field...

But still, taking a safety early given our roster would be very very tough to swallow.

I really wonder where Hamsah Nasirildeen is going to get drafted.

There is so much to like about him and yet so much unknown about him and his injury history. I really liked Jeremy Chinn last year having him go in my mocks in round 2 a lot.

I have wanted that type of player for a long time and Hamsah is probably one of my higher list guys this year. Having said that, I wouldn't think about him until our rd 3 pick at least.

[YoHoChecko]

I have wanted that type of player for a long time and Hamsah is probably one of my higher list guys this year. Having said that, I wouldn't think about him until our rd 3 pick at least.

I feel like there are 60 or so guys I wouldn't want to take before the mid-3rd but I also REALLY like... and only maybe 35 guys I'd want to take at picks 29 or 61.

Like 20 first rounders, 15 second rounders and 55 third rounders on my board

[go pak go]

I have wanted that type of player for a long time and Hamsah is probably one of my higher list guys this year. Having said that, I wouldn't think about him until our rd 3 pick at least.

I feel like there are 60 or so guys I wouldn't want to take before the mid-3rd but I also REALLY like... and only maybe 35 guys I'd want to take at picks 29 or 61.

Like 20 first rounders, 15 second rounders and 55 third rounders on my board

Yeah when I look at the likely board at 25 to 40, there are about a dozen guys I would be happy if we selected but not elated because there are other guys who are about the same and I think most guys we picked at 29 could be seen as a reach.

I know it's popular to say, "trade back". I was okay trading back last year for sure but also was okay trading up.

This year though I really, and I mean REALLY want to trade back. I am hoping above all hope that a QB like Mac Jones falls and someone wants to trade in the 1st round to pluck him.

And there are a lot of teams too that could be looking whether it be ATL, PHI, DET (we probably wouldn't deal with them), CAR, DEN, SF, NE.

I'd prefer not to go farther back than say a CAR or DEN, but we got the first pick of Rd 4 with CLE when we went from 29 to 33 in 2017. So if we get a 4th and a next year 4th or a 3rd (and we maybe give them a 6 comp pick).....man I'd be pretty stoked about that.

[YoHoChecko]

This year though I really, and I mean REALLY want to trade back. I am hoping above all hope that a QB like Mac Jones falls and someone wants to trade in the 1st round to pluck him.

And there are a lot of teams too that could be looking whether it be ATL, PHI, DET (we probably wouldn't deal with them), CAR, DEN, SF, NE.

I'd prefer not to go farther back than say a CAR or DEN, but we got the first pick of Rd 4 with CLE when we went from 29 to 33 in 2017. So if we get a 4th and a next year 4th or a 3rd (and we maybe give them a 6 comp pick).....man I'd be pretty stoked about that.

I ALSO really want to (but always do).... but we don't need to rely on QBs. There is literally no data-driven link to late round-one trades and available QBs. People trade up for players they like, regardless of position, all the time. Sometimes it's for QBs, but not by any means enough to be any sort of special trade magic.

I want to trade back this year both because of the value of the boards--like you said, tons of guys I'd be content with at 29 but think are grouped so closely that we could get the same or equivalent player at better value later... but also because, as I've said in the Packers News thread plan, I want to maximize draft picks the next two years to make sure the roster stays well stocked with fresh, cheap talent while we squeeze what we can out of a very financially top-heavy roster the next two years. It just makes sense, if there's a deal. I have similar limitations on how far back I'd like to go.

It's tricky though because by the more standard trade value chart, which I have proven over and over again that our team clearly uses as a guideline, moving back to that area for a 4th isn't a great return and for a 3rd is too rich. Detroit is actually perfect because they have an extra 3rd, late, which works perfectly.... but like you said, divisional draft trading, while not unheard of, is a bit more rare.

[BF004]

Anyone got that list of Packer interest started?

[go pak go]

Yeah that's why I think we would want to command either getting a 3rd and giving a 5th/6th type thing or asking for a 4th this year and 4th next year type thing.

Obviously depends how far we are trading back.

Usually by now I have a list of 3 players that I have as a draft crush.

I don't have that this year and I wonder if that is because of the pool of players or because I also view this team as having a need at a position virtually everywhere on the roster except IOL (I don't want IOL that early), RB, TE and Safety. I think Edge that early doesn't make sense either for the exception of seeing yoop go absolutely crazy.

Which I think Brian does calculate in his decision making.

[YoHoChecko]

Ugh, I love that guy but loved him a lot more when he was all over the Day Three lists.

I'd LOVE him in the 3rd but it seems like his Senior Bowl (and now Pro Day) will vault him higher than the 92nd pick.

Benjamin St-Juste is a similar player--slightly less bulk but seemingly more fluid hips--that also had a good Senior Bowl week, is on my radar, and doesn't seem quite as high on draft boards.

[Pckfn23]

Anyone got that list of Packer interest started?

https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/2021 ... nte-samuel

However, he is not on there.

[YoHoChecko]

Usually by now I have a list of 3 players that I have as a draft crush.

Honestly, after getting Deguara and Runyan from my "top 5 guys I want us to draft" list last year + AJ Dillon who I loved but just didn't think he'd make sense and couldn't justify it...

I'm putting a lot of pressure on my mid-round draft crushes this year to live up to the hype. So my early draft crushes are, again, falling by the wayside.

[paco]

[Yoop]

If we don't get a vet CB with ufa then we have to draft a ready to play CB in this draft, and those guys are usually found in the first round or early 2nd, so I don't think trading back is a real option, and Barry wants a couple of STAR CB's, obviously one is Alexander, but to add more disguise, 2 is better then just one

I really would like to pick up a vet FA Star though, then maybe take Barmore that dt with our first, then another CB that we can coach into a starter quick, then maybe a tackle, after that BPA, we absolutely need to win another SB with Rodgers, then retool a little, pay our debts and win another in the next couple with Lovie