Packers Huddle

Foosball wrote: ↑

27 Apr 2020 19:57

What if Rodgers doesn’t report to training camp this year?

I doubt that will happen because he is so concerned with his legacy. But you know that the Love pick has to bug the hell out of Arod (and I don’t blame him). He’s a HOFer.

Especially since he has stipulated that he wants to play into his 40’s. Rodgers can put on a game face but he is a sensitive dude. He has to be thinking WTF! That has to bleed over somewhere.

So maybe he holds out and takes his legacy to New England.

This is exactly what I mean when I say the fans (and media) are making more of this than anyone else.

Nothing like this is going to happen, at all. If Lupe is right and he uses this to prove everyone wrong and make everyone look stupid... that means... WE WIN. No one loses in that scenario.

This literally won't matter again for two years, except that the media will ask about it every chance they get and the fans are running around with pitchforks.

Not a single on-field, in-building flying F will be given.

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

27 Apr 2020 20:06

Foosball wrote: ↑

27 Apr 2020 19:57

What if Rodgers doesn’t report to training camp this year?

I doubt that will happen because he is so concerned with his legacy. But you know that the Love pick has to bug the hell out of Arod (and I don’t blame him). He’s a HOFer.

Especially since he has stipulated that he wants to play into his 40’s. Rodgers can put on a game face but he is a sensitive dude. He has to be thinking WTF! That has to bleed over somewhere.

So maybe he holds out and takes his legacy to New England.

This is exactly what I mean when I say the fans (and media) are making more of this than anyone else.

Nothing like this is going to happen, at all. If Lupe is right and he uses this to prove everyone wrong and make everyone look stupid... that means... WE WIN. No one loses in that scenario.

This literally won't matter again for two years, except that the media will ask about it every chance they get and the fans are running around with pitchforks.

Not a single on-field, in-building flying F will be given.

Every player on this team wants to win a championship. Some more than others probably but everyone wants to win. No one enjoys losing more than others. Management cares about a SB but it’s like a consolation prize to them as long as they do well enough to sell tickets and raise prices. That’s all they really care about. They just want to be good enough to satisfy the fans who are just happy the teams there.

No player thinks this team is better with Jordan Love than Patrick Queen except maybe Oren Burks and Pat Summers. No one thinks this offense is better without some WR help except this slow group of receivers and depth perception less MVS. There’s a reason this draft is ranked dead last by damn near everyone. Queue the wait and see comment. We still purchased a bunch of products way above market value.

If I’m right, which I most assuredly am, no one wins. We wasted a pick. A bunch of picks for that matter on a scheme that didn’t suit the franchise QB we already had.

lupedafiasco wrote: ↑

27 Apr 2020 21:06

Every player on this team wants to win a championship. Some more than others probably but everyone wants to win. No one enjoys losing more than others. Management cares about a SB but it’s like a consolation prize to them as long as they do well enough to sell tickets and raise prices. That’s all they really care about. They just want to be good enough to satisfy the fans who are just happy the teams there.

No player thinks this team is better with Jordan Love than Patrick Queen except maybe Oren Burks and Pat Summers. No one thinks this offense is better without some WR help except this slow group of receivers and depth perception less MVS. There’s a reason this draft is ranked dead last by damn near everyone. Queue the wait and see comment. We still purchased a bunch of products way above market value.

Anyone who studies economics below the surface level knows that markets are not efficient without equality of information, and that in many markets, the seller has far more information than the potential buyers. In many other markets, privileged buyers have access to more information than other buyers, and thus make better, more efficient decisions.

Pretty effing bold of you to think that you and the media guys are privileged buyers with better market information than the NFL GMs in general and Gutey in particular. That's not to say no GMs are bad at this, or to say no GMs make mistakes; or to say that even with good information, sometimes you still make a choice where the risk doesn't pan out. But I can be darn certain that you personally have absolutely no idea what the market value is on any of these players, and that the media has pretty limited access to that insight as well.

You're just guessing and telling us you're opinion. It's every bit as useful as the homeless guy who told the Browns to draft Johnny Manziel. Don't try to sell it as logic or fact.

lupedafiasco wrote: ↑

27 Apr 2020 21:06

Management cares about a SB but it’s like a consolation prize to them as long as they do well enough to sell tickets and raise prices. That’s all they really care about. They just want to be good enough to satisfy the fans who are just happy the teams there.

Honestly reading this makes me feel even more proud of our GM. He didn't take the easy way out I can tell you. The easy route is drafting safe. The easy route is drafting immediate need. The easy route is not to have the microscope on you.

Gutey made this selection knowing his career is on the line. If he had taken Mims or Queen at 26 and they don't work out....it's easy. Everyone would say you only hit 50% but Gutey tried. What else can you do. Live to fight another day.

But if the Packers don't produce this year and Love isn't developing in the background...Gute is out of a job. I would say that's as competitive as it gets.

go pak go wrote: ↑

27 Apr 2020 21:31

lupedafiasco wrote: ↑

27 Apr 2020 21:06

Management cares about a SB but it’s like a consolation prize to them as long as they do well enough to sell tickets and raise prices. That’s all they really care about. They just want to be good enough to satisfy the fans who are just happy the teams there.

Honestly reading this makes me feel even more proud of our GM. He didn't take the easy way out I can tell you. The easy route is drafting safe. The easy route is drafting immediate need. The easy route is not to have the microscope on you.

Gutey made this selection knowing his career is on the line. If he had taken Mims or Queen at 26 and they don't work out....it's easy. Everyone would say you only hit 50% but Gutey tried. What else can you do. Live to fight another day.

But if the Packers don't produce this year and Love isn't developing in the background...Gute is out of a job. I would say that's as competitive as it gets.

That's good. In my way of saying it, Guty didn't play to not lose. He played to WIN. Too many GMs and fans and coaches don't get that.

I'm not going to run around the financials like some of you guys did. That's your game, not mine. But I will present a hypothetical scenario. That's my game. So let's play the HC/GM a little here.
;-)

2020 season: IF the NFL plays, Love is likely to be QB#3 on the depth chart. He will carry a clipboard all year unless he simply shows better decision making than QB2 Boyle. But that's Love's best case. Rodgers is the starter, barring injury. That much is settled. In the instance where Rodgers does miss any time for injury, it's gonna rattle some fans that Love will likely not be the QB who walks onto the field for relief. Boyle will be the guy, at least at first. (Modify this scenario if Boyle is cut or traded.)

2021 season: If Love progresses like we should all hope, will Boyle even be around? The depth chart will flip for Boyle/Love. Rodgers is still going to be QB1, barring injury. By now, maybe MLF uses Love on a few specialty plays, even if he isn't hinting at it. There's just too much temptation. But I digress!

In one of these two seasons, it'll be interesting to see if Aaron gets hurt and loses time. If Boyle enters and fares no better than Kizer did two years ago, it's gonna set the stage for Love.

2022 season: Barring a regressing in playing performance, Aaron Rodgers will be the QB1. But make no mistake, if MLF sees a great improvement in Love, that'll put pressure on Aaron. Even with dead money, the HC and GM are going to field the QB who they feel gives them the best chance to win in January. If Rodgers plays well enough, it's still his job to lose. But if he's declining, Love will get his shot.

On another point, how many think that Aaron Rodgers, even with his Superman cape on, isn't going to lose a game or two or three for injury within the next three years? It's going to happen, as much as I hope not.

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

27 Apr 2020 20:06

Foosball wrote: ↑

27 Apr 2020 19:57

What if Rodgers doesn’t report to training camp this year?

I doubt that will happen because he is so concerned with his legacy. But you know that the Love pick has to bug the hell out of Arod (and I don’t blame him). He’s a HOFer.

Especially since he has stipulated that he wants to play into his 40’s. Rodgers can put on a game face but he is a sensitive dude. He has to be thinking WTF! That has to bleed over somewhere.

So maybe he holds out and takes his legacy to New England.

This is exactly what I mean when I say the fans (and media) are making more of this than anyone else.

Nothing like this is going to happen, at all. If Lupe is right and he uses this to prove everyone wrong and make everyone look stupid... that means... WE WIN. No one loses in that scenario.

This literally won't matter again for two years, except that the media will ask about it every chance they get and the fans are running around with pitchforks.

Not a single on-field, in-building flying F will be given.

Rodgers will not hold out. He may make it clear that he wants to be traded after this season. And I don't give a damn about whether he is a HOFer based on what he did a few years ago, I care if the Packers win a lot in the future. If the Packers do come close to the SB, they are going to get most of another team's draft for Rodgers after this season.

WHY would Rodgers want to be traded? That isn't going to happen, at least not within the next year.

Past experience, the QB in question wanted to play with the Vikes because one of his buddies was the OC. And the QB still got traded to the Jets in the meanwhile. Rodgers isn't going to follow that path. And where would he go, Dallas? Not.

go pak go wrote: ↑

27 Apr 2020 21:31

lupedafiasco wrote: ↑

27 Apr 2020 21:06

Management cares about a SB but it’s like a consolation prize to them as long as they do well enough to sell tickets and raise prices. That’s all they really care about. They just want to be good enough to satisfy the fans who are just happy the teams there.

Honestly reading this makes me feel even more proud of our GM. He didn't take the easy way out I can tell you. The easy route is drafting safe. The easy route is drafting immediate need. The easy route is not to have the microscope on you.

Gutey made this selection knowing his career is on the line. If he had taken Mims or Queen at 26 and they don't work out....it's easy. Everyone would say you only hit 50% but Gutey tried. What else can you do. Live to fight another day.

But if the Packers don't produce this year and Love isn't developing in the background...Gute is out of a job. I would say that's as competitive as it gets.

This.

Rodgers job is to play QB. Gute's job is to protect the franchise.

It would have been so easy to pick Queen or a WR. So easy. The fact they went with Love shows a) they think he was by far the best player available and b) that they aren't afraid at upsetting the media darlings to secure the long term health of the franchise.

Madcity_matt wrote: ↑

27 Apr 2020 14:43

Just some information to share on Rodgers contracts, as some of the posters who hate the Love pick don't have a firm grasp on how Rodgers contract plays out.

cut before/during this season: 21.6M Cap figure, 51.1M Dead money, (29.5 cap savings) ouch
Cut before/during 2021 season: 36.3M Cap, 31.5M Dead money, 4.8M Cap savings
Cut before/during 2022 season: 39.8M Cap, 17.2M Dead money, 22.6M Cap savings
Cut before/during 2023 season: 28.3M Cap, 2.8M Dead money, 25.5M Cap savings

This nonsense about not being able to cut Rodgers for the entire length of Love's rooking contract are absurd. GB could move on from Rodgers after this season and actually bank a bit of cap savings, and a massive one after two seasons.

Couple of random ideas:
1) Even if drafting Love may feel like smack in the face for Rodgers, he can't claim the organization hasn't done right with him in the past - both in taking a chance on him over Favre, and in the contract department.

2) If we do trade AR, let's say after the 2021 season, his high remaining cap numbers should not be a terrible problem for the new team. We'd eat some of it, and they could extend AR with 3 more or less bogus year and move that cap around.

3) If we did hit on Love, third great QB in a row, oh boy, those unending Bears fans tears will make up for everything... While we wouldn't get all of the coveted the cheap years of the rookie QB contract, we'd still have some, along with a more developed QB. Let's face it - we were not gonna be picking top 5, where the insta-starter QBs go, anyways.

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

28 Apr 2020 05:19

WHY would Rodgers want to be traded? That isn't going to happen, at least not within the next year.

Past experience, the QB in question wanted to play with the Vikes because one of his buddies was the OC. And the QB still got traded to the Jets in the meanwhile. Rodgers isn't going to follow that path. And where would he go, Dallas? Not.

You are very correct. Rogers is not going to be traded withing the next year. He will want to prove himself with a SB run. The Packers know that Love is not ready and Boyle may be no more than a career backup. So they don't want a trade now either.

But assuming the Rodgers does have a better year than the last few and does prove that he is still a top 3 QB in the league, he will want out while he still has 2-3 good years. Rodgers is an emotional man and he is going to want to end his career on his terms. He will not wait for the Packers to dump him.

TheSkeptic wrote: ↑

28 Apr 2020 14:05

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

28 Apr 2020 05:19

WHY would Rodgers want to be traded? That isn't going to happen, at least not within the next year.

Past experience, the QB in question wanted to play with the Vikes because one of his buddies was the OC. And the QB still got traded to the Jets in the meanwhile. Rodgers isn't going to follow that path. And where would he go, Dallas? Not.

You are very correct. Rogers is not going to be traded withing the next year. He will want to prove himself with a SB run. The Packers know that Love is not ready and Boyle may be no more than a career backup. So they don't want a trade now either.

But assuming the Rodgers does have a better year than the last few and does prove that he is still a top 3 QB in the league, he will want out while he still has 2-3 good years. Rodgers is an emotional man and he is going to want to end his career on his terms. He will not wait for the Packers to dump him.

I'd agree with you, up to the point of predicting what any man would do. People have their own motivations. Even under predictable circumstances, there's no telling what Aaron would do in two or three years.

Even if Rodgers is playing at a high level in 2-3, there’s nothing to stop him from trying to force an extension that the packers might not want to do. This gives us leverage. I thinkRodgers will handle this like a pro, personally, but I like the insurance policy at such a critical position. The cost of that insurance plan was steep, only time will tell if it was worth the capital.

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

29 Apr 2020 08:17

TheSkeptic wrote: ↑

28 Apr 2020 14:05

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

28 Apr 2020 05:19

WHY would Rodgers want to be traded? That isn't going to happen, at least not within the next year.

Past experience, the QB in question wanted to play with the Vikes because one of his buddies was the OC. And the QB still got traded to the Jets in the meanwhile. Rodgers isn't going to follow that path. And where would he go, Dallas? Not.

You are very correct. Rogers is not going to be traded withing the next year. He will want to prove himself with a SB run. The Packers know that Love is not ready and Boyle may be no more than a career backup. So they don't want a trade now either.

But assuming the Rodgers does have a better year than the last few and does prove that he is still a top 3 QB in the league, he will want out while he still has 2-3 good years. Rodgers is an emotional man and he is going to want to end his career on his terms. He will not wait for the Packers to dump him.

I'd agree with you, up to the point of predicting what any man would do. People have their own motivations. Even under predictable circumstances, there's no telling what Aaron would do in two or three years.

why would Rodgers leave unless he feels he has no chance to win a SB and believes some other team would want him that gives him a better chance, or that as McGinn thinks there is some sort of pis sing match going on that, for the most part are only visable through the signs of frustration about a play failure, common of course when implamenting new plays and schemes, other then that Rodgers looked and even said he had fun.

minus that stuff, why would Rodgers even leave before his contract ends, the Packers still give him the best shot to win it all, and the odds of Love beating him out certainly aren't over whelming ever, let alone in 1 or 2 years.

Yoop, I'll answer your good question. Aaron probably wouldn't leave. It isn't like some other QBs who saw a great window open up or they just wanted to play on teams that also employed good friends of theirs.

Aaron already has gotten to the point that he hardly has anything to gain. I don't know if he sees it that way. But he might have the most uncommon reason to stay or to leave. And his reasons either way will probably change between now and 2022.

Maybe the worst thing that can happen for his thinking is if the NFL doesn't get to play this year. Too much time to think can really play games with a man's mind.

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

30 Apr 2020 04:38

Yoop, I'll answer your good question. Aaron probably wouldn't leave. It isn't like some other QBs who saw a great window open up or they just wanted to play on teams that also employed good friends of theirs.

Aaron already has gotten to the point that he hardly has anything to gain. I don't know if he sees it that way. But he might have the most uncommon reason to stay or to leave. And his reasons either way will probably change between now and 2022.

Maybe the worst thing that can happen for his thinking is if the NFL doesn't get to play this year. Too much time to think can really play games with a man's mind.

Aaron has everything to gain from a football perspective after you’ve gotten paid and that cementing a legacy. Sure he will go down as a top 10 QB. 1 ring and 2 MVPs will probably secure him that. 2 rings puts you on another level. Right or wrong that is the way it is. 3 rings puts you in an elite club. There’s only 4 that have done it.

lupedafiasco wrote: ↑

30 Apr 2020 05:44

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

30 Apr 2020 04:38

Yoop, I'll answer your good question. Aaron probably wouldn't leave. It isn't like some other QBs who saw a great window open up or they just wanted to play on teams that also employed good friends of theirs.

Aaron already has gotten to the point that he hardly has anything to gain. I don't know if he sees it that way. But he might have the most uncommon reason to stay or to leave. And his reasons either way will probably change between now and 2022.

Maybe the worst thing that can happen for his thinking is if the NFL doesn't get to play this year. Too much time to think can really play games with a man's mind.

Aaron has everything to gain from a football perspective after you’ve gotten paid and that cementing a legacy. Sure he will go down as a top 10 QB. 1 ring and 2 MVPs will probably secure him that. 2 rings puts you on another level. Right or wrong that is the way it is. 3 rings puts you in an elite club. There’s only 4 that have done it.

Yeah, I dont think he will take the opporunity to leave for another 2 years, or even think there are many better situations to try to win right now. I mean we were 13-3 last year. But if in 2 years this ship has started sinking, and the choice is either battle with Love for a starting job or jump ship to a team that is only a qb away. For instance...a SF post Jimmy G if he fails in the next couple of years, a tampa bay situation like brady has walked into, or some new similar situation that pops up..i absolutely think he would want to leave and go for one more ring. 100%.

But i dont think he is there yet. If he did that now it would be like taking your ball and going home. If he is still playing at a high level and the team still hasnt gotten him a WR in two years...the public will understand why he would want to go to a different situation. I mean GBs already chosen to choose his backup, instead of draft him talent to help him win from another position.

lots of people think they know what Rodgers will do, he's far more close lipped then Favre was, yet I bet there isn't a person here that saw Favre's debacle coming, he lost the NFCC game one week and announced that tearful retirement the next, so for people to act as though there in Rodgers head is laugh out loud funny.

in a way what happened in this draft is no different then the last 5, the team went in a different direction then I'am sure Rodgers wanted, hell the only impact player to emerge from all of them was Aaron Jones, and NO one saw him coming either, in fact most here liked Franklin over either Jones or Williams, thank our stars one became a great pick, point is as O Teddy would say, "they think they know, but havn't a clue" or something like that, and thats how it is with Rodgers, we are guessing based off zero knowledge.

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

28 Apr 2020 03:31

go pak go wrote: ↑

27 Apr 2020 21:31

lupedafiasco wrote: ↑

27 Apr 2020 21:06

Management cares about a SB but it’s like a consolation prize to them as long as they do well enough to sell tickets and raise prices. That’s all they really care about. They just want to be good enough to satisfy the fans who are just happy the teams there.

Honestly reading this makes me feel even more proud of our GM. He didn't take the easy way out I can tell you. The easy route is drafting safe. The easy route is drafting immediate need. The easy route is not to have the microscope on you.

Gutey made this selection knowing his career is on the line. If he had taken Mims or Queen at 26 and they don't work out....it's easy. Everyone would say you only hit 50% but Gutey tried. What else can you do. Live to fight another day.

But if the Packers don't produce this year and Love isn't developing in the background...Gute is out of a job. I would say that's as competitive as it gets.

That's good. In my way of saying it, Guty didn't play to not lose. He played to WIN. Too many GMs and fans and coaches don't get that.

Who was the guy who once said if you listen to the fans you'll soon be sitting with them in the end?

Just because Gutey didn't get Rodgers a WR in this draft doesn't mean he didn't give him any weapons. Weapons are not just WRs.