Rank the Roster 2023: #15

[NCF]

Does anyone have access to any PFF or ESPN or NextGen stats about the performance of Tom, Nijman, JRJ, and Meyers? Do we have any data that validates or challenges what we seem to be seeing with our eyes?

Would also love to see the splits on Tom. I had forgotten about the Lions game, even though I was there, live. Like did Tom's performance seemingly get better quarter-to-quarter or was it all over the place, a good game here and a bad game there. I would take a strong 4th quarter 2022 push as an indication that bigger and better things are coming.

[Yoop]

right side to left side, vice versa is not as easy for some players to do, I think we saw that with Nijman and fo sure saw it with Jenkins last year.

anyway I went with Wyatt and Doubs, both I think will make a second year jump

[Madcity_matt]

Doubs is WR2, good numbers last season, early reports out of OTAs say he looks like he's taken another step forward.

Tom gets my other vote. He is our third best OL, whether they rightly start him or not. Wyatt and Deguara next.

Funnily enough, Doubs and Tom were my votes at #35/Final last year. Now they were my votes at #14 and here at 15.

That's where my head's at, Doubs and Tom

Crazy, the thought of voting for two different 4th rounders from a year ago over last years first rounder.

Wyatt will be coming soon for me, I do expect a nice jump. DL seems especially tough as a rookie.

[TheSkeptic]

I have a very bad feeling about Wyatt. I know others like him but I think he is a character bust. Aaron Hernandez 2.0

What leads you believe he is anywhere near the level of character concern as Aaron Hernandez? I'm genuinely curious.

Violence against women. He was arrested for it and there are rumors of problems with other women.

While NFL players are frequently able to bribe the victim and get the charges dropped, there is always the possibility of a responsible father or brother with a 12 gauge loaded with 00. And then there is that Lions trainer incident.

Back at the 2022 NFL Scouting Combine, WalterFootball.com reported there were serious character concerns that were hurting Georgia defensive tackle Devonte Wyatt with pro teams. Wyatt put together an excellent combine workout, many began projecting him to the first round of the 2022 NFL Draft. Multiple NFL teams told WalterFootball.com since that they have dropped Wyatt off their boards because of repeated incidents of domestic violence.

In February of 2020, Wyatt was arrested for a "family violence" incident. Team sources say that their private investigators found out about three additional domestic violence incidents. With that in his background, sources from multiple teams say Wyatt is off their draft board.

"He's off our board," said an AFC general manager whose team needs defensive tackle help. "If teams are okay with the character, I think he goes between No. 21-32. He has a lot of red flags."

https://www.walterfootball.com/nflhotpr ... c-Violence

Wyatt is a thug, plain and simple. He is a 5 time loser already.

[APB]

I have a very bad feeling about Wyatt. I know others like him but I think he is a character bust. Aaron Hernandez 2.0

What leads you believe he is anywhere near the level of character concern as Aaron Hernandez? I'm genuinely curious.

Violence against women. He was arrested for it and there are rumors of problems with other women.

While NFL players are frequently able to bribe the victim and get the charges dropped, there is always the possibility of a responsible father or brother with a 12 gauge loaded with 00. And then there is that Lions trainer incident.

Back at the 2022 NFL Scouting Combine, WalterFootball.com reported there were serious character concerns that were hurting Georgia defensive tackle Devonte Wyatt with pro teams. Wyatt put together an excellent combine workout, many began projecting him to the first round of the 2022 NFL Draft. Multiple NFL teams told WalterFootball.com since that they have dropped Wyatt off their boards because of repeated incidents of domestic violence.

In February of 2020, Wyatt was arrested for a "family violence" incident. Team sources say that their private investigators found out about three additional domestic violence incidents. With that in his background, sources from multiple teams say Wyatt is off their draft board.

"He's off our board," said an AFC general manager whose team needs defensive tackle help. "If teams are okay with the character, I think he goes between No. 21-32. He has a lot of red flags."

https://www.walterfootball.com/nflhotpr ... c-Violence

Wyatt is a thug, plain and simple. He is a 5 time loser already.

From the write-up following Wyatt's arrest:

Georgia defensive lineman Devonte Wyatt was arrested Tuesday evening in relation to a domestic incident that allegedly occurred last week. According to the Athens-Clarke County booking report, Wyatt is facing three misdemeanor charges including criminal trespass, damage to property and family violence.

The incident took place last Friday when, according to the UGA Police Department, officers responded to a 911 call to McWhorter Hall where a male and female were fighting. Officers identified Wyatt as one of the parties involved in what was deemed a verbal altercation. However, the report states that Wyatt allegedly kicked the female's door "multiple times from the hallway, damaging the door and forcing it open." Wyatt and the female reportedly had an on-again, off-again relationship. The report also stated that "neither party indicated they were in fear for their safety."

There were never any charges pressed in any of the other rumored incidents.

So you equate kicking in a door and other rumored heated exchanges with his girlfriend (Wyatt) with a conviction for murder and suspicion of involvement in several others (Hernandez)?

I guess that's where we disagree. I don't think Wyatt is an angel by any means but "Hernandez 2.0" is a serious stretch.

[BF004]

The Packers generally hold them selves to a very high level on that regard. Culture instilled by the community down through board down through President down through staff.

Packers have earned the benefit of the doubt until they get one wrong. And I really hope that day never comes.

So until I see Wyatt screw up as a Packer, I’ll trust the work the Packers did on his character and his legal issues.

[Yoop]

I lobbied for Wyatt prior to the draft, at the time this stuff from Walters seemed overblown, charges where dropped, the rumors that some GM's dropped him from there draft boards where never substantiated, and we drafted him right where he was expected to slot out.

not sure what his passed has to do with where we rank him in this exercise

[TheSkeptic]

I view Wyatt spending time in prison for murder as just a matter of time. The women he associates with are not angels. A broken nose, a black eye equals a $50,000 payment from Wyatt now or 10k from someone on the University sports faculty before he became a Packer - and that buys one hell of a lot of crack. She may even provoke the fight for that hush money. Of course then she says her other boyfriend beat her up, not Wyatt and charges against Wyatt are dropped. But when (not if) he kills one of them hush money does not work.

I raised 4 daughters to full adulthood. In their mid to late teens I had to threaten 2 boyfriends and physically chase one of them out of my home. I should have terminated the other, not doing so is the biggest mistake of my life. Fortunately only 1 of my daughters had her life ruined by her choices and my hesitation. And none of the boyfriends were anywhere near as obvious as Wyatt is.

You guys seem to be still wet behind the ears. I guess it comes with the territory - a sheltered middle class life in northern Wisconsin.

[BF004]

So because we don’t hastily judge some 20 year old kid from the south as a rapist/murderer after reading 3 minutes of tweets and online articles, we are the bad people?

[NCF]

So because we don’t hastily judge some 20 year old kid from the south as a rapist/murderer after reading 3 minutes of tweets and online articles, we are the bad people?

Sheltered people.

[Yoop]

I view Wyatt spending time in prison for murder as just a matter of time. The women he associates with are not angels. A broken nose, a black eye equals a $50,000 payment from Wyatt now or 10k from someone on the University sports faculty before he became a Packer - and that buys one hell of a lot of crack. She may even provoke the fight for that hush money. Of course then she says her other boyfriend beat her up, not Wyatt and charges against Wyatt are dropped. But when (not if) he kills one of them hush money does not work.

I raised 4 daughters to full adulthood. In their mid to late teens I had to threaten 2 boyfriends and physically chase one of them out of my home. I should have terminated the other, not doing so is the biggest mistake of my life. Fortunately only 1 of my daughters had her life ruined by her choices and my hesitation. And none of the boyfriends were anywhere near as obvious as Wyatt is.

You guys seem to be still wet behind the ears. I guess it comes with the territory - a sheltered middle class life in northern Wisconsin.

sorry to hear about your personal situation Skeptic, but what happened for you is not the norm, Wyatt has been a model citizen and quality team mate out side of this one circumstance, all kids with a troubled childhood or run in with domestic disturbance don't grow up to murder people or do bad stuff.

[NCF]

I think the guy very well could be a turd, but I think a lot of these guys probably are people I would not associate with. I think the issue is whether or not he can keep his nose clean while a member of the Packers. As fans, I think we kind of have to separate those two things.

[Labrev]

Saying he's for sure going to be Aaron Hernandez is a bridge too far. People can and do turn their lives around.

With that said, Wyatt's past definitely worries me. I do not have reason to think he was guilty of the charges against him that were dropped, so I will not suppose that anything wrongful happened. That said, it concerns me that he found himself in that situation on more than one occasion. So his ability to stay out of trouble is a concern, at least until he goes a while without having an incident.

What also worries me is he apparently is dumb as rocks. I think he scored like an 8 on the Wonderlic, a test with laughably easy questions. A bird can peck a double-digit score on that test. That kind of stupidity can be dangerous.

I hate to say it, though, but DT also is a good position to have a guy who's a thug.

[TheSkeptic]

Saying he's for sure going to be Aaron Hernandez is a bridge too far. People can and do turn their lives around.

With that said, Wyatt's past definitely worries me. I do not have reason to think he was guilty of the charges against him that were dropped, so I will not suppose that anything wrongful happened. That said, it concerns me that he found himself in that situation on more than one occasion. So his ability to stay out of trouble is a concern, at least until he goes a while without having an incident.

What also worries me is he apparently is dumb as rocks. I think he scored like an 8 on the Wonderlic, a test with laughably easy questions. A bird can peck a double-digit score on that test. That kind of stupidity can be dangerous.

I hate to say it, though, but DT also is a good position to have a guy who's a thug.

I never said it was certain. Only probable.

[Yoop]

Saying he's for sure going to be Aaron Hernandez is a bridge too far. People can and do turn their lives around.

With that said, Wyatt's past definitely worries me. I do not have reason to think he was guilty of the charges against him that were dropped, so I will not suppose that anything wrongful happened. That said, it concerns me that he found himself in that situation on more than one occasion. So his ability to stay out of trouble is a concern, at least until he goes a while without having an incident.

What also worries me is he apparently is dumb as rocks. I think he scored like an 8 on the Wonderlic, a test with laughably easy questions. A bird can peck a double-digit score on that test. That kind of stupidity can be dangerous.

I hate to say it, though, but DT also is a good position to have a guy who's a thug.

I never said it was certain. Only probable.

it's not even probable, in fact it's less then likely, we do a intensive search and explore as deep as any team in the league.

my biggest concern with Wyatt and even Walker where the low wonderlic scores, but then if players have high wonderlic they are usually offensive players, as long as a defender can learn there schemes and responsibilities who cares about the rest

[YoHoChecko]

I talked about this before and just after the draft last year, but since we're discussing it and it is relevant...

I think both of the arguments I'm primarily seeing (not to say some aren't middle grounding responsibly) are a little off. A guy who reportedly has multiple domestic violence-adjacent incidents in college is bad, but not necessarily predictive; and "not getting caught" and having the charges dropped doesn't mean we should write it off until/unless something happens in a Packers uniform.

Violence/anger/temper/domestic abuse incidents usually escalate over time as each incident without consequences slowly moves the barrier for what is "too far" until that barrier is finally snapped (which often is not gradual).

I read a guy who has rumors and allegations of past incidents, plus a police report in which his girlfriend was hiding from him and his temper in a bathroom when he kicked the door in as someone who is progressing down the path toward escalation and breaking that "too far" barrier in legal terms eventually, much like TheSkeptic does. I think to draft Wyatt with that history and without a plan for intervention would be irresponsible.

But, as I just alluded to, I also believe in intervention. And the resources and community development team the Packers have should be invested in making sure Wyatt learns how/where/when to channel his anger, get any counseling he may or may not need, and is firmly schooled on the consequences of any violence, particularly against women.

We got Wyatt in the building at a fairly crucial point in adult development--24/25 year olds are seeing their brain fully develop, their impulsivity decline, their beliefs and personalities settle into a fully-developed picture. They change less from that point on, but are still highly malleable in that phase.

So to me it's impossible to know what's next for Wyatt. I HOPE that the Packers took his past seriously and got him some education and conversation and support systems to mitigate any possible escalation, both for the Packers' sake and for the sake of people in Wyatt's life. But I don't think we would ever know things like that unless/until he chooses to talk about it or we have a reason to bring it up. So hopefully we'll hear about it after he retires some day, how the NFL and the Green Bay Packers saved him from a dark path. And hopefully we have good reason to forget about the past incidents/allegations in time (meaning because it never happens again)

[Yoop]

I read a guy who has rumors and allegations of past incidents, plus a police report in which his girlfriend was hiding from him and his temper in a bathroom when he kicked the door in as someone who is progressing down the path toward escalation and breaking that "too far" barrier in legal terms eventually, much like TheSkeptic does. I think to draft Wyatt with that history and without a plan for intervention would be irresponsible.

all I ever found was the multiple incidents where connected to the same person and and all 3 charges the same thing.

and that Walters draft profile when they say a bunch of teams dropped Wyatt as a draft prospect has zero substantiation, at least I wasn't able to connect that, so it could be just rumor that Walters got and thats all, I don't even use Walters as a reliable football draft site any more, there usually the lone Wolf that contradicts most other draft sites

[Crazylegs Starks]

You guys seem to be still wet behind the ears. I guess it comes with the territory - a sheltered middle class life in northern Wisconsin.

Skeptic, that kind of generalization is not cool. I won't go into things that happened to people I care about, but suffice to say, living "a sheltered middle class life in northern Wisconsin" didn't protect them.

[williewasgreat]

You guys seem to be still wet behind the ears. I guess it comes with the territory - a sheltered middle class life in northern Wisconsin.

Skeptic, that kind of generalization is not cool. I won't go into things that happened to people I care about, but suffice to say, living "a sheltered middle class life in northern Wisconsin" didn't protect them.

Correct! It's called stereotyping and is making assumptions that are not based on any facts. Also, I happen to live in southern Wisconsin.

[Acrobat]

Much similar to what I said about Brett Favre the other day. You don't have to like the player personally, just enjoy the good level of play they provide. Wyatt has made some personal mistakes but if he can keep himself clean of any further incidents and have a great career with us, then awesome.

Also, just because someone makes a mistake, it doesn't mean that they will repeat those mistakes.