Packers Huddle

I agree about how good Jenkins is.

But people. This isn't about how good Jenkins is. This is about Z'darius and Preston being the best tandem pass rushing group by far in Packers history last year.

We could still be in games if Elgton was on the injury list. We would not have been in games if the Smiths didn't play.

We are talking the Mt. Rushmore of Pass Rushers in Packers history in my lifetime.

1. Reggie White
2. Z Smith
3. Clay Matthews
4. Preston Smith/Aaron Kampman

It's not just about sacks. It's about hits. It's about hurries. And it's about the timing of the sacks. When we needed it...Preston delivered.

OK, you guys convinced me to vote Preston over Jenkins and break the tie.

On the flip side, I think the pro-Jenkins crowd has convinced me to go with Jenkins once Preston is off the board. Ahead of Amos, though, who, although nothing special, is about as rock solid as they come. That definitely made a HUGE difference in our secondary and for our entire defense last year.

Preston Smith. Kind of surprised he has fallen this far. I would have voted for him earlier but I haven't been on the forum in a couple days. He was pretty much as productive as Z was, but Z is way more marketable.

Also definitely want to start hyping Amos, who is very underrated (yet still highly-rated, so what does that tell you)

NCF wrote: ↑

07 May 2020 16:08

On the flip side, I think the pro-Jenkins crowd has convinced me to go with Jenkins once Preston is off the board. Ahead of Amos, though, who, although nothing special, is about as rock solid as they come. That definitely made a HUGE difference in our secondary and for our entire defense last year.

Jenkins is far better and far more rock solid than Amos. I agree with that. I think Kevin King is ahead of Amos to be honest.

NCF wrote: ↑

07 May 2020 14:43

Waldo wrote: ↑

07 May 2020 14:36

Packfntk wrote: ↑

07 May 2020 11:24

Not sure why Jenkins is this high, or in the conversation with Preston.

Josh Sitton was in the top 3 of this thing its first two years, before falling to #6 his last year with the team.

Many of use remember what Sitton was like early on, and how quickly he became one of the league's best guards.

Jenkins' rookie year was better than Sitton's first year starting (2nd year overall). As good as Sitton was, Jenkins can be even better.

I mean there is some projection involved, but many people (myself included) believe he's the next Steve Hutchinson and will be regarded as the best guard in the NFL sooner rather than later.

I truly applaud what he was able to do as a rookie, but he's not in Josh Sitton territory for me, yet. I did go back and look at the rankings, myself, and was reminded at all the wars I had over the years advocating for TJ Lang to be slotted higher. This isn't about positional value for me, its just, I'm not quite there, yet, on Jenkins... even with projection.

Yeah, this is where I am at as well with him. But if Waldo is right, it would be fantastic.

If the sack/rush production by Smith is important, why value Jenkins' ability to stop opposing sacks/rushes *and* pave running lanes any lower?

And, again, Jenkins did it consistently, as in every week, whereas Smith is a non-factor some weeks.

What was Preston pressure stats?

Felt like remember that dropping off after the bye, even if he got a few sacks here and there.

about 50 or so, Z had about 80, 130 between the two, or 1,000,000 a pressure, need a job?

Preston had 55 pressures
Z Smith had 93 pressures

https://www.si.com/nfl/packers/news/201 ... ck-is-back

Ty, I wonder what their pressures were around the halfway mark.

BF004 wrote: ↑

07 May 2020 23:28

Ty, I wonder what their pressures were around the halfway mark.

After 8 games per PFR:

Z 8 sacks, 21 pressures (full season 13.5 sacks, 50 pressures)
Preston 9 sacks, 22 pressures (full season 12 sacks, 34 pressures)

go pak go wrote: ↑

07 May 2020 23:05

Preston had 55 pressures
Z Smith had 93 pressures

https://www.si.com/nfl/packers/news/201 ... ck-is-back

thanks for the actual stats, I forgot where I found them, had to go from memory, just phenominal improvement, we went from about 25th or so to 2nd in the league.
SI. counts sacks, touches, and hurry's, where I believe PFR only counts sacks and touches, both seem consistent though

Yoop wrote: ↑

08 May 2020 06:21

go pak go wrote: ↑

07 May 2020 23:05

Preston had 55 pressures
Z Smith had 93 pressures

https://www.si.com/nfl/packers/news/201 ... ck-is-back

thanks for the actual stats, I forgot where I found them, had to go from memory, just phenominal improvement, we went from about 25th or so to 2nd in the league.
SI. counts sacks, touches, and hurry's, where I believe PFR only counts sacks and touches, both seem consistent though

PFR is similar to PFF at 56 combined pressures.

Yoop, this forum makes it so easy to copy and paste stats now. All you need to do is use the snipping function, screen print what you want, copy and paste in here and the img tags automatically do everything for you. You gotta alotta football knowledge and experience in that ole noggin of yours. It would be awesome if you could start searching stats and data to back your stuff.

Especially because PFR is so awesome.

go pak go wrote: ↑

08 May 2020 07:33

Yoop wrote: ↑

08 May 2020 06:21

go pak go wrote: ↑

07 May 2020 23:05

Preston had 55 pressures
Z Smith had 93 pressures

https://www.si.com/nfl/packers/news/201 ... ck-is-back

thanks for the actual stats, I forgot where I found them, had to go from memory, just phenominal improvement, we went from about 25th or so to 2nd in the league.
SI. counts sacks, touches, and hurry's, where I believe PFR only counts sacks and touches, both seem consistent though

PFR is similar to PFF at 56 combined pressures.

Yoop, this forum makes it so easy to copy and paste stats now. All you need to do is use the snipping function, screen print what you want, copy and paste in here and the img tags automatically do everything for you. You gotta alotta football knowledge and experience in that ole noggin of yours. It would be awesome if you could start searching stats and data to back your stuff.

Especially because PFR is so awesome.

image.png
image.png

ehhhh, I'll give it a try when I have some time, just so busy now confined and quarantined actually I've painted 2 rooms and contemplating which room to attack next, I still have a few gallons left lol.

I think as long as ya stick to one reference source or another the numbers will be consistent to compare one player to another, I like SI because there the people that gave Aaron Donald the 120 cumulatives 2 years ago, counting all 3 of sacks, hits and hurry's, most since recording such data, so we know just how good Z was to account for 93, remember what I asked of Gary is basically what we got from Preston (52)

I like counting all 3, obviously the hurries can be debated since it's left to some interpretation, imo though if it forces the QB to avoid that rusher in any way then it can be considered at least some what successful, it probably hurried the throw.
lis, I don't think PFR or PFF tabulate hurries, only sacks and hits, thing is a QB can still throw and complete passes after getting hit just as they can when hurried and forced to move.

question, when I highlight some data a quote flagging will pop up, should I just click that? I need to try it I suppose

Yoop wrote: ↑

08 May 2020 08:47

question, when I highlight some data a quote flagging will pop up, should I just click that? I need to try it I suppose

Yes. And read the guide!!

http://packers-huddle.com/phpBB/viewtop ... abb70#p210

salmar80 wrote: ↑

07 May 2020 23:43

BF004 wrote: ↑

07 May 2020 23:28

Ty, I wonder what their pressures were around the halfway mark.

After 8 games per PFR:

Z 8 sacks, 21 pressures (full season 13.5 sacks, 50 pressures)
Preston 9 sacks, 22 pressures (full season 12 sacks, 34 pressures)

TY, so using the power of maths, I can deduce, according to PFR's numbers, Z had 29 pressures the last 8 games and Preston had 12.

So yeah, like I was saying, his play trailed off a bit it seemed towards the end of the year. Especially some of those impact sacks he had early on some big 3rd downs and late in games.

BF004 wrote: ↑

08 May 2020 13:33

salmar80 wrote: ↑

07 May 2020 23:43

BF004 wrote: ↑

07 May 2020 23:28

Ty, I wonder what their pressures were around the halfway mark.

After 8 games per PFR:

Z 8 sacks, 21 pressures (full season 13.5 sacks, 50 pressures)
Preston 9 sacks, 22 pressures (full season 12 sacks, 34 pressures)

TY, so using the power of maths, I can deduce, according to PFR's numbers, Z had 29 pressures the last 8 games and Preston had 12.

So yeah, like I was saying, his play trailed off a bit it seemed towards the end of the year. Especially some of those impact sacks he had early on some big 3rd downs and late in games.

A win in September has the same weight as a win in December. We relied heavy on Preston the first half of season. If Preston wasn't making those plays....our 2019 season could have been, very, very different.

In fact, Gutey Rodgers, and MLF may all be feeling a bit warm in their seat if it weren't for Preston's dominance the first half of the season.

go pak go wrote: ↑

08 May 2020 15:11

BF004 wrote: ↑

08 May 2020 13:33

salmar80 wrote: ↑

07 May 2020 23:43

After 8 games per PFR:

Z 8 sacks, 21 pressures (full season 13.5 sacks, 50 pressures)
Preston 9 sacks, 22 pressures (full season 12 sacks, 34 pressures)

TY, so using the power of maths, I can deduce, according to PFR's numbers, Z had 29 pressures the last 8 games and Preston had 12.

So yeah, like I was saying, his play trailed off a bit it seemed towards the end of the year. Especially some of those impact sacks he had early on some big 3rd downs and late in games.

A win in September has the same weight as a win in December. We relied heavy on Preston the first half of season. If Preston wasn't making those plays....our 2019 season could have been, very, very different.

In fact, Gutey Rodgers, and MLF may all be feeling a bit warm in their seat if it weren't for Preston's dominance the first half of the season.

I'd have to imagine that Gutey for sure would have taken the heat, but not so much Rodgers and MLF. That not only goes for the Preston signing, but certainly the Smith and Amos signing as well. Gutey's biggest job going in was fixing the defense and at least making them respectable, and I think he has done a pretty good job at getting Pettine a roster of guys to work with.

If anything, it's Pettine's seat that will be getting warm this season if he doesn't figure out how to stop the run.

TheGreenMan wrote: ↑

08 May 2020 17:06

If anything, it's Pettine's seat that will be getting warm this season if he doesn't figure out how to stop the run.

Ya, I am on board with this. That playoff loss almost reminds me of the other SF loss where we had no clue how to defend the read option. Taking some of what Martinez said on his way out on how he was tasked with cleaning up what the Smith's did and I think Pettine might be going about this all wrong.