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Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 07:07
by lupedafiasco
I’m just looking at the constants. At some point we need to figure out why our players aren’t coming up with plays in big moments. I consider that a motivation and preparation issue.
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 08:11
by Drj820
APB wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 06:37
lupedafiasco wrote: ↑14 Feb 2024 19:06
Papa John wrote: ↑14 Feb 2024 17:59
In the case of the 2023 Packers, I would say we were playing consistently when it mattered most- in the playoffs. We played sound football against Dallas and for 3 quarters against SF. The lights just proved to be too bright for this young team. Now my question is-
why were they too bright? Was it because our our collective youth and inexperience? Was it a failure on the part of the coaches? I am hoping that it was only because of our youth. Sometimes, when the pressure is high and you're trying to do everything right, the simplest, most obvious thing is the one thing that you do wrong. IMO that is what we saw from this team in that loss to SF.
My opinion is it was on the coaches. The players on the field just didn’t make plays. That is becoming a trend under LaFleur. We saw against the Buccs and the 49ers in 2021 this team just doesn’t execute in key situations.
I think of Adams dropping a TD against the Buccs or Lazard not blocking on a pick play that would have scored or ducking a TD to potentially tie the game. Or allowing a blocked punt against the 49ers for a score.
This year we had Savage and Nixon dropping picks. Love just making a pass that at this point in his career should have been drilled out of him.
I find it strange you open by blaming the coaches, and MLF in particular, but then go on to list a series of individual player mistakes.
It's clear, from your examples, the players were coached/schemed to be in position to make plays. But yet, when it was time to execute the play, the player failed....and that's the coaches fault?
at minimum the GM gets some blame for consistently picking players who do not make plays
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 08:55
by go pak go
Drj820 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 08:11
APB wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 06:37
lupedafiasco wrote: ↑14 Feb 2024 19:06
My opinion is it was on the coaches. The players on the field just didn’t make plays. That is becoming a trend under LaFleur. We saw against the Buccs and the 49ers in 2021 this team just doesn’t execute in key situations.
I think of Adams dropping a TD against the Buccs or Lazard not blocking on a pick play that would have scored or ducking a TD to potentially tie the game. Or allowing a blocked punt against the 49ers for a score.
This year we had Savage and Nixon dropping picks. Love just making a pass that at this point in his career should have been drilled out of him.
I find it strange you open by blaming the coaches, and MLF in particular, but then go on to list a series of individual player mistakes.
It's clear, from your examples, the players were coached/schemed to be in position to make plays. But yet, when it was time to execute the play, the player failed....and that's the coaches fault?
at minimum the GM gets some blame for consistently picking players who do not make plays
You can't consistently pick players who do not make plays when your team as GM has been in the Divisional Round or better every season from 2019 - 2023 for the exception of on year.
And that is with a new quarterback at the helm and a cap/roster turnover. Having that level of consistent succeses would suggest you are a GM who is picking players who DO make plays. Because you can't get that far without it.
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 09:15
by Yoop
Drj820 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 08:11
APB wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 06:37
lupedafiasco wrote: ↑14 Feb 2024 19:06
My opinion is it was on the coaches. The players on the field just didn’t make plays. That is becoming a trend under LaFleur. We saw against the Buccs and the 49ers in 2021 this team just doesn’t execute in key situations.
I think of Adams dropping a TD against the Buccs or Lazard not blocking on a pick play that would have scored or ducking a TD to potentially tie the game. Or allowing a blocked punt against the 49ers for a score.
This year we had Savage and Nixon dropping picks. Love just making a pass that at this point in his career should have been drilled out of him.
I find it strange you open by blaming the coaches, and MLF in particular, but then go on to list a series of individual player mistakes.
It's clear, from your examples, the players were coached/schemed to be in position to make plays. But yet, when it was time to execute the play, the player failed....and that's the coaches fault?
at minimum the GM gets some blame for consistently picking players who do not make plays
so now we blame the GM because players in high tension situations can't remained focused on one thing at a time, which is what this amounts to.
hard for coaches as well to lesson the tension players feel, this goes back to thinking, if your thinking about what you should do, you've already wasted to much time/concentration to do it.
personally I blame coaching more then the GM.
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 11:09
by lupedafiasco
Gutenbumst has to take his share of blame up to this past season. He was a downright terrible GM from 2018-2021. Theres no way around that. Terrible drafts, terrible cap decisions, awful roster & personnel decisions. 2022 and 23 though were just straight up good offseasons. He made really good moves in the draft and financially but to be fair he created those situations in the first place.
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 11:17
by BF004
lupedafiasco wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 11:09
Gutenbumst has to take his share of blame up to this past season. He was a downright terrible GM from 2018-2021. Theres no way around that.
We did have arguably the best roster in football in both ‘20 and ‘21.
Guess we have different definitions of terrible.
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 12:01
by Drj820
failure after failure and never anyone to blame lol
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 12:55
by Yoop
Drj820 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 12:01
failure after failure and never anyone to blame lol
we fired 3 ST's cords, 3 D cords, a GM, and a HC, seems they where blamed
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 13:04
by go pak go
Drj820 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 12:01
failure after failure and never anyone to blame lol
I know this sounds crazy but hear me out.
You blame the actual player who didn't make the play that was there to be made that should be expected to be made by any NFL caliber player.
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 13:06
by Drj820
go pak go wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 13:04
Drj820 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 12:01
failure after failure and never anyone to blame lol
I know this sounds crazy but hear me out.
You blame the actual player who didn't make the play that was there to be made that should be expected to be made by any NFL caliber player.
i like that one. After that can I blame who picked that player? or who stuck with that player all year after the same player made mistakes all year? Like say, Anders Carlson?
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 13:18
by lupedafiasco
BF004 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 11:17
lupedafiasco wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 11:09
Gutenbumst has to take his share of blame up to this past season. He was a downright terrible GM from 2018-2021. Theres no way around that.
We did have arguably the best roster in football in both ‘20 and ‘21.
Guess we have different definitions of terrible.
MVP QB play will do that.
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 14:09
by Yoop
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 14:29
by BF004
lupedafiasco wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 13:18
BF004 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 11:17
lupedafiasco wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 11:09
Gutenbumst has to take his share of blame up to this past season. He was a downright terrible GM from 2018-2021. Theres no way around that.
We did have arguably the best roster in football in both ‘20 and ‘21.
Guess we have different definitions of terrible.
MVP QB play will do that.
Ah right, just like in ‘17 and ‘18 too, right. Roster didn’t get any better, Rodgers just magically played better?
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 14:33
by BF004
Drj820 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 12:01
failure after failure and never anyone to blame lol
How is thinking Gutekunst was not ‘terrible’ (while building a roster that got back to back #1 seeds) at all the same as never blaming anyone.
About the quality response I’ve come to expect though.
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 15:31
by Drj820
BF004 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 14:33
Drj820 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 12:01
failure after failure and never anyone to blame lol
How is thinking Gutekunst was not ‘terrible’ (while building a roster that got back to back #1 seeds) at all the same as never blaming anyone.
About the quality response I’ve come to expect though.
nice zinger at the end.
I actually think Gutey has done a decent job. I just call a spade a spade when we roll a problematic kicker into the playoffs and pretend hes not a problem
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 15:47
by BF004
Well A) That has nothing to do with the conversation. It was Brian was a terrible GM from '18-'21. B) By no means do I think he was perfect and without blame, just think terrible is a terrible description given our success. C) Not sure how or why that brought our your response about never anyone to blame. With an lol at the end. So yeah, about the level of quality I'm used to. Just calling a spade a spade. D) On this completely unrelated and different topic about 2023 kickers, I was the only person on the board that I remember saying we should sign Mason Crosby to our active 53, and not just after the fact, how about that. So interesting you would choose my post to reference about never anyone to blame, one who was actively pre-emptively asking to fix the kicker spot for the playoffs, for the reason of not fixing the kicker spot. With an lol.
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 15:55
by Drj820
BF004 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 15:47
Well A) That has nothing to do with the conversation. It was Brian was a terrible GM from '18-'21. B) By no means do I think he was perfect and without blame, just think terrible is a terrible description given our success. C) Not sure how or why that brought our your response about never anyone to blame. With an lol at the end. So yeah, about the level of quality I'm used to. Just calling a spade a spade. D) On this completely unrelated and different topic about 2023 kickers, I was the only person on the board that I remember saying we should sign Mason Crosby to our active 53, and not just after the fact, how about that. So interesting you would choose my post to reference about never anyone to blame, one who was actively pre-emptively asking to fix the kicker spot for the playoffs, for the reason of not fixing the kicker spot. With an lol.
i never said Gute has been terrible. You have your wires crossed.
Also sounds like you agree with much of what i was saying. glad we agree, no need to be defensive.
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 16:34
by go pak go
Drj820 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 13:06
go pak go wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 13:04
Drj820 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 12:01
failure after failure and never anyone to blame lol
I know this sounds crazy but hear me out.
You blame the actual player who didn't make the play that was there to be made that should be expected to be made by any NFL caliber player.
i like that one. After that can I blame who picked that player? or who stuck with that player all year after the same player made mistakes all year? Like say, Anders Carlson?
Yes. I think the Anders Carlson decision of not bringing in a vet (Crosby) to kick 45 and under FGs can be scrutinzed.
But that's about the only real good example I can think of this year.
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 16:36
by Yoop
BF004 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 14:29
lupedafiasco wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 13:18
BF004 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 11:17
We did have arguably the best roster in football in both ‘20 and ‘21.
Guess we have different definitions of terrible.
MVP QB play will do that.
Ah right, just like in ‘17 and ‘18 too, right. Roster didn’t get any better, Rodgers just magically played better?
play calling changed, pass routes changed, doesn't mean the offense wouldn't have been better specially on PO games had we had another excellent WR, so what if the Offense is ranked number one it didn't play like it in the most important games
that Rodgers played better, OK, but the change in scheme made it easier for him to do better, being able to finally unleash a RB improved play action, everything got better as a result of hiring Lafleur, another stud muffin receiver would have made that offense even better, no way I gonna change my stance on that
Re: Super Bowl LVIII
Posted: 15 Feb 2024 17:55
by go pak go
BF004 wrote: ↑15 Feb 2024 15:47
Well A) That has nothing to do with the conversation. It was Brian was a terrible GM from '18-'21. B) By no means do I think he was perfect and without blame, just think terrible is a terrible description given our success. C) Not sure how or why that brought our your response about never anyone to blame. With an lol at the end. So yeah, about the level of quality I'm used to. Just calling a spade a spade. D) On this completely unrelated and different topic about 2023 kickers, I was the only person on the board that I remember saying we should sign Mason Crosby to our active 53, and not just after the fact, how about that. So interesting you would choose my post to reference about never anyone to blame, one who was actively pre-emptively asking to fix the kicker spot for the playoffs, for the reason of not fixing the kicker spot. With an lol.
You and I were both in the kick the tires on Crosby camp. We talked about the open roster spot with Enegbare going on IR.
