Rodgers wants out

[bud fox]

Rodgers was lied to and embarrassed. He is now just standing up for himself, I commend those actions.

The guy is in a position where he doesn't have to slurp management like the majority of the workforce.

Packers primary business activity is playing football. Rodgers is the best footballer in the world right now. Management didn't think he would be and that is what makes this so difficult. How can you possibly move from the MVP even though it is your plan?

Rodgers ruined there plans for management to look good, however it was a big plus for fans as we got to watch a MVP season.

And another early exit in the playoffs.

He can't throw and catch the ball, he can't hand off and rush with no fumbles, he can't throw and block ... Maybe he can play corner.

Would you rather Rodgers played terrible so we could have got rid of him with no drama? I don't understand why you would bring up the early exit (NFC championship lol). Would you prefer Rodgers to not be our QB?

[Trudge]

I mean...NFC Championship would be what our last guy got?

[Drj820]

To answer the question of “Rodgers best chance to win”

I kind of agree with [mention]bud fox[/mention] that Rodgers can make many places he goes an instant contender. I would just say that place needs elite special teams, and to be a top 5 defense.

Give him those things and he can win 2 or 3 in a row as he makes the offense adequate at minimum.

In GB, no matter the attempts to fix the issues he’s always had awful STs and a D that fails in crucial spots. There are a number of teams that don’t have the offensive fire power to win anything, but have the STs and the Defenses to never have those same problems...put Rodgers on any of those teams and he has a great chance to win a ring. Hel help the O score enough points.

[TheSkeptic]

To answer the question of “Rodgers best chance to win”

I kind of agree with @bud fox that Rodgers can make many places he goes an instant contender. I would just say that place needs elite special teams, and to be a top 5 defense.

Give him those things and he can win 2 or 3 in a row as he makes the offense adequate at minimum.

In GB, no matter the attempts to fix the issues he’s always had awful STs and a D that fails in crucial spots. There are a number of teams that don’t have the offensive fire power to win anything, but have the STs and the Defenses to never have those same problems...put Rodgers on any of those teams and he has a great chance to win a ring. Hel help the O score enough points.

How many of those teams have the salary cap room to pay him? Without destroying that D by not being able to resign key players

[Drj820]

To answer the question of “Rodgers best chance to win”

I kind of agree with @bud fox that Rodgers can make many places he goes an instant contender. I would just say that place needs elite special teams, and to be a top 5 defense.

Give him those things and he can win 2 or 3 in a row as he makes the offense adequate at minimum.

In GB, no matter the attempts to fix the issues he’s always had awful STs and a D that fails in crucial spots. There are a number of teams that don’t have the offensive fire power to win anything, but have the STs and the Defenses to never have those same problems...put Rodgers on any of those teams and he has a great chance to win a ring. Hel help the O score enough points.

How many of those teams have the salary cap room to pay him? Without destroying that D by not being able to resign key players

Good follow up question. I assume by going that route you agree with me at least partially in theory, but correctly add something I should consider for my theory. I would say that if Rodgers achieved his goal of getting out of town, surely he would rework his deal on his new team and make thinks feasible for them in at least the short term. If he would give them any type of relief at all, there are several teams he could play for that wouldn’t have to be blown up immediately, and potentially have to be blown up after he wins a ring or two down the road. The teams with great defenses and STs that he could instantly raise to contender status would be at least, and probably more than just these, but:

Washington FT, Tampa Bay (wouldn’t happen but still), Cleveland, Miami, Denver, Rams, Indy.

That’s just off top of my head

[Pugger]

It is obvious the Packers brass is not interested in trading Rodgers at this time so AR has 3 options: sit out, swallow his pride and return or retire. The clock is ticking towards TC.

[Half Empty]

Rodgers was lied to and embarrassed. He is now just standing up for himself, I commend those actions.

The guy is in a position where he doesn't have to slurp management like the majority of the workforce.

Packers primary business activity is playing football. Rodgers is the best footballer in the world right now. Management didn't think he would be and that is what makes this so difficult. How can you possibly move from the MVP even though it is your plan?

Rodgers ruined there plans for management to look good, however it was a big plus for fans as we got to watch a MVP season.

And another early exit in the playoffs.

He can't throw and catch the ball, he can't hand off and rush with no fumbles, he can't throw and block ... Maybe he can play corner.

Would you rather Rodgers played terrible so we could have got rid of him with no drama? I don't understand why you would bring up the early exit (NFC championship lol). Would you prefer Rodgers to not be our QB?

First, as always in a sports forum, definition. I am one of those for whom an early exit, in a year in which the Pack is a legitimate contender, is anything short of hoisting the Lombardi. Obviously a personal decision/choice but one which explains why losing the NFC championship game is not a laughing matter to me. The SB loss to Denver still bothers me more than most of the Gory Years preceding it.

As far as Rodgers goes, I'm looking for consistency - not from him but from posters. If he is to be deified when he has a really good game and brings the team close despite some terrible plays and decisions, then he also needs to be judged on (after turning the first of the three straight INTs into a TD) two consecutive 3-and-outs thereafter. If one had tuned in to the game just before the 2nd INT, how would they have felt at the end?

I have no problem with him being the QB as far as pure physical QB talent, but the fact remains that, given my first paragraph, how many potential Lombardis have gone wanting in the last decade?

[Pugger]

And another early exit in the playoffs.

He can't throw and catch the ball, he can't hand off and rush with no fumbles, he can't throw and block ... Maybe he can play corner.

Would you rather Rodgers played terrible so we could have got rid of him with no drama? I don't understand why you would bring up the early exit (NFC championship lol). Would you prefer Rodgers to not be our QB?

First, as always in a sports forum, definition. I am one of those for whom an early exit, in a year in which the Pack is a legitimate contender, is anything short of hoisting the Lombardi. Obviously a personal decision/choice but one which explains why losing the NFC championship game is not a laughing matter to me. The SB loss to Denver still bothers me more than most of the Gory Years preceding it.

As far as Rodgers goes, I'm looking for consistency - not from him but from posters. If he is to be deified when he has a really good game and brings the team close despite some terrible plays and decisions, then he also needs to be judged on (after turning the first of the three straight INTs into a TD) two consecutive 3-and-outs thereafter. If one had tuned in to the game just before the 2nd INT, how would they have felt at the end?

I have no problem with him being the QB as far as pure physical QB talent, but the fact remains that, given my first paragraph, how many potential Lombardis have gone wanting in the last decade?

Having AR as our QB does improve our chances of winning another Lombardi but he can't do it alone. In the NFCC game at Lambeau the consensus GOAT didn't play a great game either but his teammates did thus Tampa went to the SB instead of us.

[Yoop]

ya know what wins play off games and SB's, great coaching, and making less mistakes then the other team, same for losing, but just the opposite.

last year, and the year before we lost because our DC couldn't figure how to stop the run, or realizing that King was no match for Miller with a one on one coverage, that stupidity cost us 14 points, against SF Pettine used one ILB in a 20 front and they ran the ball down our throats.

015 we lost to the Hawks because McCarthy was out coached, last series with all 11 hawk defenders on the los he runs Lacy into that brick wall, Rodgers could have flipped it to almost any receiver for a first down with his left hand between his legs for christ sakes, McCarthy should have been fired the next day.

011, we had a great passing offense, as long as Rodgers had time to throw, he didn't, the Giants brought a terrific pass rush all game and played a deep cover shell, and we went home with our tails between our legs, we couldn't run, couldn't stop the run and a great 15-1 season was all for naught, both KC and NY gave up covering our short game, and dedicated themselves to pressuring Rodgers, and doubling up on any receiver going deep, still we couldn't consistently move the chains and keep drives alive running, coaching again seemed the major issue.

it's easy to lay blame with the QB, but Rodgers was the least of our problems in these games, if ya expect him to over come these issues with super play then all your doing is excusing the ineptness with coaching and personal decisions.

[Drj820]

ya know what wins play off games and SB's, great coaching, and making less mistakes then the other team, same for losing, but just the opposite.

last year, and the year before we lost because our DC couldn't figure how to stop the run, or realizing that King was no match for Miller with a one on one coverage, that stupidity cost us 14 points, against SF Pettine used one ILB in a 20 front and they ran the ball down our throats.

015 we lost to the Hawks because McCarthy was out coached, last series with all 11 hawk defenders on the los he runs Lacy into that brick wall, Rodgers could have flipped it to almost any receiver for a first down with his left hand between his legs for christ sakes, McCarthy should have been fired the next day.

011, we had a great passing offense, as long as Rodgers had time to throw, he didn't, the Giants brought a terrific pass rush all game and played a deep cover shell, and we went home with our tails between our legs, we couldn't run, couldn't stop the run and a great 15-1 season was all for naught, both KC and NY gave up covering our short game, and dedicated themselves to pressuring Rodgers, and doubling up on any receiver going deep, still we couldn't consistently move the chains and keep drives alive running, coaching again seemed the major issue.

it's easy to lay blame with the QB, but Rodgers was the least of our problems in these games, if ya expect him to over come these issues with super play then all your doing is excusing the ineptness with coaching and personal decisions.

Good post Yoop, only point I would counter is that after the bone head schemes of the first half in last years NFCCG, the defense played well enough to win. They got us back in the game with turnovers. The reason we lost is because we refused to do what was working when there was plenty of time left on the clock to do it: run the ball.

Straight up refused, and all we had heard was how coach wanted to run the ball in his schemes. Well it was working, the bucs pass rush was destroying our LTs, and we refused to do it. So yes, again...got out coached.

[go pak go]

And we are back to the foundational argument I illustrated a few pages ago.

[Yoop]

ya know what wins play off games and SB's, great coaching, and making less mistakes then the other team, same for losing, but just the opposite.

last year, and the year before we lost because our DC couldn't figure how to stop the run, or realizing that King was no match for Miller with a one on one coverage, that stupidity cost us 14 points, against SF Pettine used one ILB in a 20 front and they ran the ball down our throats.

015 we lost to the Hawks because McCarthy was out coached, last series with all 11 hawk defenders on the los he runs Lacy into that brick wall, Rodgers could have flipped it to almost any receiver for a first down with his left hand between his legs for christ sakes, McCarthy should have been fired the next day.

011, we had a great passing offense, as long as Rodgers had time to throw, he didn't, the Giants brought a terrific pass rush all game and played a deep cover shell, and we went home with our tails between our legs, we couldn't run, couldn't stop the run and a great 15-1 season was all for naught, both KC and NY gave up covering our short game, and dedicated themselves to pressuring Rodgers, and doubling up on any receiver going deep, still we couldn't consistently move the chains and keep drives alive running, coaching again seemed the major issue.

it's easy to lay blame with the QB, but Rodgers was the least of our problems in these games, if ya expect him to over come these issues with super play then all your doing is excusing the ineptness with coaching and personal decisions.

Good post Yoop, only point I would counter is that after the bone head schemes of the first half in last years NFCCG, the defense played well enough to win. They got us back in the game with turnovers. The reason we lost is because we refused to do what was working when there was plenty of time left on the clock to do it: run the ball.

Straight up refused, and all we had heard was how coach wanted to run the ball in his schemes. Well it was working, the bucs pass rush was destroying our LTs, and we refused to do it. So yes, again...got out coached.

Thanks

yep, offensive Balance, Matt stressed that a lot, a better mix of pass/run keeps a defense off balance, thing is though we had blundered on offense early, and allowing a score right before and after the first half rattles a coach, so I don't want to blame MLF to much, but that game was still in hand and we've seen Rodgers and C0. score points fast in the past.

gotta give the Bucs defense credit though, Minus Bak there pass rush and excellent coverage made it tough for guys to get open and Rodgers the time needed for them to open up, again it's easy to blame Rodgers when they are actually clear, but he can't see everyone in the split second that they are, specially with a pass rush breathing down his neck, add in the 5 or so drops,but your right, Matt should have used Dillon and Williams more.

[Yoop]

And we are back to the foundational argument I illustrated a few pages ago.

really, I think my opinion varies a lot from yours.

[go pak go]

And we are back to the foundational argument I illustrated a few pages ago.

really, I think my opinion varies a lot from yours.

I believe that is the very definition of what an argument is.

Although I will admit. You have argued with me before when your opinion was the same as mine.

[Yoop]

And we are back to the foundational argument I illustrated a few pages ago.

really, I think my opinion varies a lot from yours.

I believe that is the very definition of what an argument is.

Although I will admit. You have argued with me before when your opinion was the same as mine.

true, but your a third street lawyer and I often have trouble comprehending comments you make

[dsr]

Rodgers was lied to and embarrassed. He is now just standing up for himself, I commend those actions.

The guy is in a position where he doesn't have to slurp management like the majority of the workforce.

Packers primary business activity is playing football. Rodgers is the best footballer in the world right now. Management didn't think he would be and that is what makes this so difficult. How can you possibly move from the MVP even though it is your plan?

Rodgers ruined there plans for management to look good, however it was a big plus for fans as we got to watch a MVP season.

Lied to? Apart from the (IMO) fatuous suggestion that the Packers knew in 2018 that they were going to draft Love two years later, I don't think there have been many suggestions that he was lied to. Only that he wasn't kept in the loop on draft day.

As for plan to move on from Rodgers, I don't see the difficulty. Management has literally two options:

1. Have a plan to move on after Rodgers is done.
2. Do not have a plan to move on after Rodgers is done.

I can't see any scenario where option 2 is better.

[go pak go]

really, I think my opinion varies a lot from yours.

I believe that is the very definition of what an argument is.

Although I will admit. You have argued with me before when your opinion was the same as mine.

true, but your a third street lawyer and I often have trouble comprehending comments you make

My foundational argument was pretty clear.

There are two camps.

One who believes the Packers have been a poorly run and inferior franchise the last 14 years and the camp who believes the Packers have been, on the whole, a well run franchise the last 14 or so years.

I am in the camp who believes the Packers have been a good franchise because they assembled championship level rosters in 07, 09, 10, 11, 13, 14, 19, 20. I consider 8 out of14 years with championship level rosters to be very good.

You are in the camp that believes the Packers have been an inferior franchise and poorly run and as a result has held back Rodgers greatness. You, Lupe and Bud Fox are in this group.

The only wiggle room you three will agree is that the Packers were very well run from 2007 - 2010. Even though I don't consider those rosters to even be 2nd best the last 14 years.

[Drj820]

I believe that is the very definition of what an argument is.

Although I will admit. You have argued with me before when your opinion was the same as mine.

true, but your a third street lawyer and I often have trouble comprehending comments you make

My foundational argument was pretty clear.

There are two camps.

One who believes the Packers have been a poorly run and inferior franchise the last 14 years and the camp who believes the Packers have been, on the whole, a well run franchise the last 14 or so years.

I am in the camp who believes the Packers have been a good franchise because they assembled championship level rosters in 07, 09, 10, 11, 13, 14, 19, 20. I consider 8 out of14 years with championship level rosters to be very good.

You are in the camp that believes the Packers have been an inferior franchise and poorly run and as a result has held back Rodgers greatness. You, Lupe and Bud Fox are in this group.

The only wiggle room you three will agree is that the Packers were very well run from 2007 - 2010. Even though I don't consider those rosters to even be 2nd best the last 14 years.

I think the packers have been a well run franchise. I’ve explained my thoughts in detail before about how the team runs itself like a manager of an endowment fund..never taking on too much risk, always being generally smart, and doing what needs to be done to turn a profit. The org has been run smoothly.

That said, How many of those championship level rosters actually had the things that most championship teams have?

That would be an elite qb (check, theyve had that), a reliable run game when it’s necessary, special teams that NEVER hurt the team...only help, and a what...top ten-ish defense (generally top 5)?

So basically my point is the team has always had staples that constitute a good roster, yet they have always sprung leaks in key areas whether that is a defense that can’t stop the run, a special teams unit that can’t kick the ball out of the back of the end zone or cover kickoffs, or a lack of commitment to the run game when things get tight and cold in January.

Every team you list has had a fatal flaw for the most part.

So ya, very well run org..but most championship level teams have balance across those key areas, not glaring weaknesses year after year.

[Yoop]

I believe that is the very definition of what an argument is.

Although I will admit. You have argued with me before when your opinion was the same as mine.

true, but your a third street lawyer and I often have trouble comprehending comments you make

My foundational argument was pretty clear.

There are two camps.

One who believes the Packers have been a poorly run and inferior franchise the last 14 years and the camp who believes the Packers have been, on the whole, a well run franchise the last 14 or so years.

I am in the camp who believes the Packers have been a good franchise because they assembled championship level rosters in 07, 09, 10, 11, 13, 14, 19, 20. I consider 8 out of14 years with championship level rosters to be very good.

You are in the camp that believes the Packers have been an inferior franchise and poorly run and as a result has held back Rodgers greatness. You, Lupe and Bud Fox are in this group.

The only wiggle room you three will agree is that the Packers were very well run from 2007 - 2010. Even though I don't consider those rosters to even be 2nd best the last 14 years.

disagree, there are variables, you can have a great/good roster and still lose, we have, and poor coaching led to our demise, and if the backup to a starter isn't up to the task then the roster is weaker, no ones fault really but it makes a difference ( Bak lasst year)

I layed out why I think we lost, probably to simply for you, but you act as though you didn't even bother to read it.

you exaggerate how long and when I felt the team was run and coached poorly, but so be it, what matters is that it was.

it's like the coaches didn't even figure out how KC whipped our asses in 011, if so they didn't do much about it, as the Giants did basically the same stuff, don't give Rodgers time and cover deep, held us to 14 pts.

we should have !@#$ pounded the Giants from one end of the field to the other, instead we let them dictate the game, and made Mistake after mistake, doesn't matter how good the roster is mistakes cost ya games, and poor coaching exaggerates it. link didn't take so I brought the article.

Why the 2011 Green Bay Packers Are the Most Disappointing Playoff Team Ever
ZACH SMITH
JANUARY 15, 2012

GREEN BAY, WI - JANUARY 15:
It's been pretty common knowledge that the Green Bay Packers have been good this year. Very good, in fact. As preseason Super Bowl favorites, enhanced with an experienced and talented roster that only improved with players recovering from injury, they appeared primed to be the first repeat champions since the New England Patriots performed the same feat nearly a decade ago.

Enter the New York Giants.

The Giants entered Lambeau Field for the second time this season looking to avenge their earlier loss at home in Week 13. And boy did they ever.

It was clear from the get go which of the two teams was prepared and ready for the postseason, and which had become too enamored with their hype to actually focus on the game at hand.


True, the Packers were reconciling with the unfortunate news that a family member of one of their coaching staff was found dead in the past week. However, that is still not strong enough of a reason to excuse their pitiful performance tonight.

The only player that seemed to have shown up and mentally prepared himself for this game was likely regular-season MVP Aaron Rodgers. His final stat line was 26/46, 264 yards, two TDs and a garbage time INT leading to a 78.5 QB rating. He also rushed for a team-high 66 yards.

While not even close to the type of numbers he put up in the regular season, little to none of the blame can be put on Rodgers for this.

For starters, he was sacked four times, a weakness of the Packers that was well documented and exploited by the ferocious Giants pass rush.

However, his supporting cast was absolutely abysmal in this game. There was a total of nine drops by Green Bay receivers, usually one of the best corps in the league. There were three fumbles lost, one by Rodgers after Osi Umenyiora came in from his blindside and punched the ball out of his hands as he was cocking back his arm.

As for the defense, they were viciously torn apart by the now-elite Eli Manning. The turning point of the game came after a Hail Mary landed into the arms of Hakeem Nicks, who had a monster performance with 160-plus yards and two touchdowns. Manning ended up going 21/33 for 330 yards, three touchdowns and a pick.


This game was the exact opposite of typical Green Bay football. Mental errors, lackadaisical attitudes and just overall bad football was prevalent in this game. It was an embarrassment and an affront to the prestige that the team crafted for themselves in the regular season.

Give the Giants credit. They came ready to play, and took advantage. But the Packers lost this game.

The last time a No. 1 seed in the playoffs was beaten this soundly after so much hype was when the 2007 14-2 San Diego Chargers were ousted by the Patriots

Their coach, Marty Schottenheimer, ended up being fired a month later. Although Mike McCarthy's job is still safe after this debacle, he must be careful in avoiding another collapse next year if Green Bay makes the playoffs.



we had the best team in 015 too, yet gave the game away in the second half, played with precision first half, then complacent in the 2nd, thats coaching

https://www.forbes.com/sites/robreische ... d627d49b7e

[go pak go]

I mean yoop calls me third street lawyer talk and yet here you both give third street lawyer talk.

At the end of the day, your positions are the Packers are inferior in providing Rodgers another ring. Because it is inconceivable he shouldn't have more.

The one noticeable shift I have found in yoop is he went from defend coaches at all cost (Capers) because the talent is so bad to blaming the coaches.

Which is still the Packers organization by the way