Packers Huddle

I know that when things go bad, fans tend to want to lynch (I almost said “lunch”) everybody at Lombardi. But I don’t get the fault directed at Guty. The guy has pulled great players out of nowhere. He’s retained every vet that he had reason to. His team gets 13 wins each year prior to this.

Yeah, his team hasn’t won the Lombardi Trophy. Oh, I get it. So now he deserves to be fired? Maybe I’m minority here. But I think he’s done well. And he doesn’t deserve this. Kinda reminds me of when Ted Thompson put a Super Bowl winning team together. But once the team showed any decline, too many called for his badge, laptop, office keys and more.

I can call for firing other people. Not Guty. I’d stand by him.

Drj820 wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:38

Yoop wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:37

Drj820 wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:05

I don’t think gutey would have moved on from rodgers as soon as he could because he begged him back and got an extension out of his quality play

my point was, would Rodgers have been resigned after the 2018 season if it was up to Gutekunst? Murphy gave him the huge contract before awarding Brian the GM job, again, Guty had no choice but to extend him, we where already going to be paying dead money, and he just had a MVP season, Guty, Murphy and everyone involved would have been run out of town if they'd have dumped him, this team was built to excel this year, except at WR.

what we are seeing now is how players play when hope is gone, they take plays off, give less then 100% effort, it doesn't take much for everything to look bad.

Would Rodgers have been resigned after the 2018 season? Yes.

really, after being such a pain in the butt in 2018, he literally forced a decision to fire McCarthy, wouldn't throw to wide open check down receivers, he really was upset with drafting 3 mid round raw ones, and you think Rodgers and Guty where getting along, his whole thing with not taking the check downs was to point out he needed better receivers that could beat 1x1 coverage, Guty's answer to Rodgers was to pass on any decent receiver and trade up to pick Rodgers replacement in the next draft.

nah I'am thinking if Guty had control he'd have traded Rodgers after 2018 to the highest bidder for draft Capitol, and did whatever he had to to draft one of the best QB in that class, brought in a older vet for a season needed for grooming up the rookie, least I'am pretty sure thats what I'd have done, I was shocked beyond belief that Murphy just decided for no good reason at all to resign Rodgers to the largest contract ever given right after demoting Ted, firing Capers, and giving McCarthy a lame duck one year contract, anyone that can make sense of that I'd give them a Daniel Webster cigar and a bottle of that Tequila Ringo likes so much

Yoop wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:58

Drj820 wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:38

Yoop wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:37

my point was, would Rodgers have been resigned after the 2018 season if it was up to Gutekunst? Murphy gave him the huge contract before awarding Brian the GM job, again, Guty had no choice but to extend him, we where already going to be paying dead money, and he just had a MVP season, Guty, Murphy and everyone involved would have been run out of town if they'd have dumped him, this team was built to excel this year, except at WR.

what we are seeing now is how players play when hope is gone, they take plays off, give less then 100% effort, it doesn't take much for everything to look bad.

Would Rodgers have been resigned after the 2018 season? Yes.

really, after being such a pain in the butt in 2018, he literally forced a decision to fire McCarthy, wouldn't throw to wide open check down receivers, he really was upset with drafting 3 mid round raw ones, and you think Rodgers and Guty where getting along, his whole thing with not taking the check downs was to point out he needed better receivers that could beat 1x1 coverage, Guty's answer to Rodgers was to pass on any decent receiver and trade up to pick Rodgers replacement in the next draft.

nah I'am thinking if Guty had control he'd have traded Rodgers after 2018 to the highest bidder for draft Capitol, and did whatever he had to to draft one of the best QB in that class, brought in a older vet for a season needed for grooming up the rookie, least I'am pretty sure thats what I'd have done, I was shocked beyond belief that Murphy just decided for no good reason at all to resign Rodgers to the largest contract ever given right after demoting Ted, firing Capers, and giving McCarthy a lame duck one year contract, anyone that can make sense of that I'd give them a Daniel Webster cigar and a bottle of that Tequila Ringo likes so much

Is the bolded sentence a serious question or some joke at trying to follow along with your story?

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:42

I know that when things go bad, fans tend to want to lynch (I almost said “lunch”) everybody at Lombardi. But I don’t get the fault directed at Guty. The guy has pulled great players out of nowhere. He’s retained every vet that he had reason to. His team gets 13 wins each year prior to this.

Just out of curiosity, when Packer fans look out and see the wide receiver and tight end positions are they supposed to think (a) they are perfectly fine or (b) Gutekunst bears no responsibility for the "talent" at those two positions?

And I would love to be enlightened on how Gutekunst has "pulled great players out of nowhere" at tight end and wide receiver during his five years as GM, because I admit I just don't see any great players at these positions.

In fact, an argument could be made that Gutekunst has not added a single great player on offense since he took over, other than possibly Elgton Jenkins prior to his ACL.

LombardiTime wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 15:14

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:42

I know that when things go bad, fans tend to want to lynch (I almost said “lunch”) everybody at Lombardi. But I don’t get the fault directed at Guty. The guy has pulled great players out of nowhere. He’s retained every vet that he had reason to. His team gets 13 wins each year prior to this.

Just out of curiosity, when Packer fans look out and see the wide receiver and tight end positions are they supposed to think (a) they are perfectly fine or (b) Gutekunst bears no responsibility for the "talent" at those two positions?

And I would love to be enlightened on how Gutekunst has "pulled great players out of nowhere" at tight end and wide receiver during his five years as GM, because I admit I just don't see any great players at these positions.

In fact, an argument could be made that Gutekunst has not added a single great player on offense since he took over, other than possibly Elgton Jenkins prior to his ACL.

100% he is at fault for the WR position. Put all his eggs in Sammy Watkins being able to make it. Hugely failed. TE, I think is adequate.

As for stars on offense. Josh Myers probably is going to be added to that list. A short list, for sure.

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:42

I know that when things go bad, fans tend to want to lynch (I almost said “lunch”) everybody at Lombardi. But I don’t get the fault directed at Guty. The guy has pulled great players out of nowhere. He’s retained every vet that he had reason to. His team gets 13 wins each year prior to this.

Yeah, his team hasn’t won the Lombardi Trophy. Oh, I get it. So now he deserves to be fired? Maybe I’m minority here. But I think he’s done well. And he doesn’t deserve this. Kinda reminds me of when Ted Thompson put a Super Bowl winning team together. But once the team showed any decline, too many called for his badge, laptop, office keys and more.

I can call for firing other people. Not Guty. I’d stand by him.

Guty has been attempting to build HIS team, and it didn't include providing Rodgers with receiver talent, instead he spent it on Rodgers replacement, a RB, A TE , 2 OL, and defensive players, and a 3rd round slot receiver who has proven to mostly be a bust

Rodger and Guty have been bumping heads since Murphy promoted him after making Rodgers the richest player in the league, a pacifier mostly from Murphy to lock up Rodgers ( control Rodgers) and install Guty as GM ( a title more then a position) and retain McCarthy another season, which seem to upset Rodgers from the very start, he lacked quality receivers for go routes to work and our arsenal of uptempo short stuff consisted of slants and curls, when I mentioned it looked like he was refusing to throw checkoffs, people thought I was crazy, more and more I think I was right, specially watching him look off the open guy and throw right into double coverage for the same or even less yardage Sunday and at other times this year, sounds insane to think this I know, usually though it's not the last play of the game, but we know he's a control freak

anyway sorry for the rant, but this stuff really bugs me, as to Guty, I wont blame him for trying to build his own team, versus inheriting all the problems Rodgers has provided, I defend him because he has been ( up to now, debatable? ) the least reason we've lost games, and most often the biggest reason we've won em, and with a batch of good receivers I doubt we'd have the problems winning as we do now, even with all the injury's and sub standard play, but his frustration with the receiver situation is escalating fast, it's ugly to see him showing it on the field.

believe it or not ( i already know most wont ) I didn't like giving that huge contract the off season prior to the GM change when Murphy took control, we where in a big switch, McCarthy's contract was coming do,, we should have waited till the next off season after all the changes had settled in.

all water over the damn now, I don't see a valid reason just because of this disaster season to fire anyone, we have to good a necleus to go in to rebuilding, Guty is no worse then the late Ted for getting Rodgers receiver talent, and using to many resources to build a great defense, I under stand the need, thats a thing that refuses balance, every GM in the league spends more on defense then offense ( Pckfn ya wanna check me on that, times do change ) can't have a weak position on defense, or it's exposed,

geesus I been typing a long time lol. anyway I'd bring back Rodgers, force Gutekunst to either bring in a receiver with a IQ, or suit up himself, I'd bet Rodgers would never miss hitting him in the numbers

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:42

I know that when things go bad, fans tend to want to lynch (I almost said “lunch”) everybody at Lombardi. But I don’t get the fault directed at Guty. The guy has pulled great players out of nowhere. He’s retained every vet that he had reason to. His team gets 13 wins each year prior to this.

Yeah, his team hasn’t won the Lombardi Trophy. Oh, I get it. So now he deserves to be fired? Maybe I’m minority here. But I think he’s done well. And he doesn’t deserve this. Kinda reminds me of when Ted Thompson put a Super Bowl winning team together. But once the team showed any decline, too many called for his badge, laptop, office keys and more.

I can call for firing other people. Not Guty. I’d stand by him.

As usual the gm gets a few chances to fire and get rid if people he actually acquired in order to keep HIS job. Same will happen here. Not sure why u want to die on the Gute vine. And u will.

Yoop wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:03

paco wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 13:45

Breaking news, Rodgers has no idea on NFL trades work. He thought you could still trade for guys after the deadline.

Must be watching too much baseball.

I think he's acting dumb, he's known to say stupid things, like Favre not knowing what Nickel defense was, QB's that been doing this stuff for years are just not that stupid.

If you watch it, he really did seem to think trades could still be made. But admitted he may be wrong. Didn't seem like an act, maybe just more confusion.

Yoop wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:58

Drj820 wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:38

Yoop wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:37

my point was, would Rodgers have been resigned after the 2018 season if it was up to Gutekunst? Murphy gave him the huge contract before awarding Brian the GM job, again, Guty had no choice but to extend him, we where already going to be paying dead money, and he just had a MVP season, Guty, Murphy and everyone involved would have been run out of town if they'd have dumped him, this team was built to excel this year, except at WR.

what we are seeing now is how players play when hope is gone, they take plays off, give less then 100% effort, it doesn't take much for everything to look bad.

Would Rodgers have been resigned after the 2018 season? Yes.

really, after being such a pain in the butt in 2018, he literally forced a decision to fire McCarthy, wouldn't throw to wide open check down receivers, he really was upset with drafting 3 mid round raw ones, and you think Rodgers and Guty where getting along, his whole thing with not taking the check downs was to point out he needed better receivers that could beat 1x1 coverage, Guty's answer to Rodgers was to pass on any decent receiver and trade up to pick Rodgers replacement in the next draft.

nah I'am thinking if Guty had control he'd have traded Rodgers after 2018 to the highest bidder for draft Capitol, and did whatever he had to to draft one of the best QB in that class, brought in a older vet for a season needed for grooming up the rookie, least I'am pretty sure thats what I'd have done, I was shocked beyond belief that Murphy just decided for no good reason at all to resign Rodgers to the largest contract ever given right after demoting Ted, firing Capers, and giving McCarthy a lame duck one year contract, anyone that can make sense of that I'd give them a Daniel Webster cigar and a bottle of that Tequila Ringo likes so much

What you fail to understand is gutey placated rodgers more recently than that even with rodgers behaving much worse than 2018. Gute still bent the knee because he was terrified of life without him.

Oh and it worked also…gute just got an extension. Doubt he gets that without Rodgers. He and Lafleur know that too.

Sometimes when you ride the Bull, you get the horns.

LombardiTime wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 15:14

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:42

I know that when things go bad, fans tend to want to lynch (I almost said “lunch”) everybody at Lombardi. But I don’t get the fault directed at Guty. The guy has pulled great players out of nowhere. He’s retained every vet that he had reason to. His team gets 13 wins each year prior to this.

Just out of curiosity, when Packer fans look out and see the wide receiver and tight end positions are they supposed to think (a) they are perfectly fine or (b) Gutekunst bears no responsibility for the "talent" at those two positions?

And I would love to be enlightened on how Gutekunst has "pulled great players out of nowhere" at tight end and wide receiver during his five years as GM, because I admit I just don't see any great players at these positions.

In fact, an argument could be made that Gutekunst has not added a single great player on offense since he took over, other than possibly Elgton Jenkins prior to his ACL.

Bigger picture man. Every GM has spots on this roster that could be better. If you want to dwell on just one group (if TE and WR are in one group), go ahead. I’m looking at bigger picture. And I think that 39 wins over the three seasons prior to this speaks a lot. For this season, if you compare the injury situation with the lack of talent at a skill group, you could make a case that injuries have played as much a part to our demise as any. This team does still have a lot of talent.

You could also make a case that the coaching must be better. But you didn’t, so maybe you aren’t concerned about that. Even so, you don’t fire coaches during mid-year after the past three seasons when you hit a hard spot this season. You stick with it and ride out the season. There’s nothing to be gained by firing coaches while you’re still fighting major injuries on a team.

Realist wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 16:09

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:42

I know that when things go bad, fans tend to want to lynch (I almost said “lunch”) everybody at Lombardi. But I don’t get the fault directed at Guty. The guy has pulled great players out of nowhere. He’s retained every vet that he had reason to. His team gets 13 wins each year prior to this.

Yeah, his team hasn’t won the Lombardi Trophy. Oh, I get it. So now he deserves to be fired? Maybe I’m minority here. But I think he’s done well. And he doesn’t deserve this. Kinda reminds me of when Ted Thompson put a Super Bowl winning team together. But once the team showed any decline, too many called for his badge, laptop, office keys and more.

I can call for firing other people. Not Guty. I’d stand by him.

As usual the gm gets a few chances to fire and get rid if people he actually acquired in order to keep HIS job. Same will happen here. Not sure why u want to die on the Gute vine. And u will.

I’m not picking a hill to die on. I’m just making the case that Guty has done good work overall. That can definitely be justified, at least more than it can for about 25 or more other GMs in the league. And that’s pretty good.

The one big problem that Guty faces is that the 2023 Packers have taken one or more steps away from the Super Bowl. And there’s very little grace for that in PackerNation.

Now, the question is what he will do with the biggest problems of this team going preparing for next season.
1. Cohesion from top to bottom of the roster.
2. Unbalanced salary cap situation (having paid Rodgers so much).
3. Talent at WR.
4. Scheme of the defense. (It clearly wasn’t good for a team that couldn’t get a lead in games.)

Being a good GM doesn’t mean that they will eliminate adversity. It means that they respond well to the adversity that comes.

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 15:28

LombardiTime wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 15:14

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 14:42

I know that when things go bad, fans tend to want to lynch (I almost said “lunch”) everybody at Lombardi. But I don’t get the fault directed at Guty. The guy has pulled great players out of nowhere. He’s retained every vet that he had reason to. His team gets 13 wins each year prior to this.

Just out of curiosity, when Packer fans look out and see the wide receiver and tight end positions are they supposed to think (a) they are perfectly fine or (b) Gutekunst bears no responsibility for the "talent" at those two positions?

And I would love to be enlightened on how Gutekunst has "pulled great players out of nowhere" at tight end and wide receiver during his five years as GM, because I admit I just don't see any great players at these positions.

In fact, an argument could be made that Gutekunst has not added a single great player on offense since he took over, other than possibly Elgton Jenkins prior to his ACL.

100% he is at fault for the WR position. Put all his eggs in Sammy Watkins being able to make it. Hugely failed. TE, I think is adequate.

As for stars on offense. Josh Myers probably is going to be added to that list. A short list, for sure.

Gute is 100% at fault for our WR situation. He dragged his feet about signing Adams so our All-Pro WR decides to leave for Vegas for less money than we eventually offered. Then last spring with 2 first round picks and a WR rich draft he had an opportunity to move up and nab one of them. Unless he couldn't find a dance partner it is troubling indeed. He does draft Watson in the 2nd but this player is green and appears to be injury prone. After the draft he could have signed a vet FA but declined. Just recently he got undercut for Claypool by the Bears. So now after injuries to a weak WR room our receiving corps is now a bigger mess.

Pugger wrote: ↑

09 Nov 2022 11:10

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 15:28

LombardiTime wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 15:14

Just out of curiosity, when Packer fans look out and see the wide receiver and tight end positions are they supposed to think (a) they are perfectly fine or (b) Gutekunst bears no responsibility for the "talent" at those two positions?

And I would love to be enlightened on how Gutekunst has "pulled great players out of nowhere" at tight end and wide receiver during his five years as GM, because I admit I just don't see any great players at these positions.

In fact, an argument could be made that Gutekunst has not added a single great player on offense since he took over, other than possibly Elgton Jenkins prior to his ACL.

100% he is at fault for the WR position. Put all his eggs in Sammy Watkins being able to make it. Hugely failed. TE, I think is adequate.

As for stars on offense. Josh Myers probably is going to be added to that list. A short list, for sure.

Gute is 100% at fault for our WR situation. He dragged his feet about signing Adams so our All-Pro WR decides to leave for Vegas for less money than we eventually offered. Then last spring with 2 first round picks and a WR rich draft he had an opportunity to move up and nab one of them. Unless he couldn't find a dance partner it is troubling indeed. He does draft Watson in the 2nd but this player is green and appears to be injury prone. After the draft he could have signed a vet FA but declined. Just recently he got undercut for Claypool by the Bears. So now after injuries to a weak WR room our receiving corps is now a bigger mess.

I don't blame him for Claypool. Bears got robbed and that was a horrible trade. The rest I agree with though.

Pugger wrote: ↑

09 Nov 2022 11:10

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 15:28

LombardiTime wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 15:14

Just out of curiosity, when Packer fans look out and see the wide receiver and tight end positions are they supposed to think (a) they are perfectly fine or (b) Gutekunst bears no responsibility for the "talent" at those two positions?

And I would love to be enlightened on how Gutekunst has "pulled great players out of nowhere" at tight end and wide receiver during his five years as GM, because I admit I just don't see any great players at these positions.

In fact, an argument could be made that Gutekunst has not added a single great player on offense since he took over, other than possibly Elgton Jenkins prior to his ACL.

100% he is at fault for the WR position. Put all his eggs in Sammy Watkins being able to make it. Hugely failed. TE, I think is adequate.

As for stars on offense. Josh Myers probably is going to be added to that list. A short list, for sure.

Gute is 100% at fault for our WR situation.

Ya, that is what I said.

He dragged his feet about signing Adams so our All-Pro WR decides to leave for Vegas for less money than we eventually offered.

He didn't. He offered Adams the contract, but with the Rodgers situation he didn't know if he wanted to resign in GB.

After the draft he could have signed a vet FA but declined.

He signed one before the draft. It turned out to be a bad choice. Why would he sign one after the draft?

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑

09 Nov 2022 11:30

Pugger wrote: ↑

09 Nov 2022 11:10

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑

08 Nov 2022 15:28

100% he is at fault for the WR position. Put all his eggs in Sammy Watkins being able to make it. Hugely failed. TE, I think is adequate.

As for stars on offense. Josh Myers probably is going to be added to that list. A short list, for sure.

Gute is 100% at fault for our WR situation.

Ya, that is what I said.

He dragged his feet about signing Adams so our All-Pro WR decides to leave for Vegas for less money than we eventually offered.

He didn't. He offered Adams the contract, but with the Rodgers situation he didn't know if he wanted to resign in GB.

After the draft he could have signed a vet FA but declined.

He signed one before the draft. It turned out to be a bad choice. Why would he sign one after the draft?

Adams has said he didnt want to play the last year of his deal without a contract. I think Adams was ready to resign then, but the packers delayed talks until they knew what Rodgers was doing. I think once they settled the rodgers situation, they then put the press on Adams to stay, but he had already moved on as he saw the org delaying him as disrespect

Drj820 wrote: ↑

09 Nov 2022 11:36

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑

09 Nov 2022 11:30

Pugger wrote: ↑

09 Nov 2022 11:10

Gute is 100% at fault for our WR situation.

Ya, that is what I said.

He dragged his feet about signing Adams so our All-Pro WR decides to leave for Vegas for less money than we eventually offered.

He didn't. He offered Adams the contract, but with the Rodgers situation he didn't know if he wanted to resign in GB.

After the draft he could have signed a vet FA but declined.

He signed one before the draft. It turned out to be a bad choice. Why would he sign one after the draft?

Adams has said he didnt want to play the last year of his deal without a contract. I think Adams was ready to resign then, but the packers delayed talks until they knew what Rodgers was doing. I think once they settled the rodgers situation, they then put the press on Adams to stay, but he had already moved on as he saw the org delaying him as disrespect

There are reports of talks well before Adams was franchised, but because of the uncertainty surrounding Rodgers Adams did not want to sign.

Adams bought a 12 mil. house in vegas in february, before the start of FA, the draft, he had made up his mind he wasn't going to be here no matter what was done

Yoop wrote: ↑

09 Nov 2022 11:55

Adams bought a 12 mil. house in vegas in february, before the start of FA, the draft, he had made up his mind he wasn't going to be here no matter what was done

He didn't buy the house until after he was traded.

Yeah I seem to remember that the Adams deal didn't get done because they wanted to get Rodgers done first, which means he wanted a new deal back in 2020, but they put him on hold for Rodgers. That was the time to lock him up.

In retrospect, we should have kept Adams, the real MVP, and dealt Rodgers away. I can't really fault the FO on that one, though. QB should usually take priority over WR, nothing disrespectful about that (especially after the last two seasons AR had). Then they offered even more money than he ended up signing for in Oakland, not an offer you make if you don't respect the player very highly, but by then I think Adams had made up his mind.

Knowing what I know now, I wish they did it all differently, but their reasons -- given what we knew at the time -- were sound. The "fault" may still lie with them by definition, good reasons or not, but it feels somewhat unfair to slam them for how they handled it.

Rodgers could have gone about things differently and not caused the situation in the first place, and maybe he'd still have his WR1.