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There are some learning disabilities that don’t allow someone to recognize a grey area.
Ya, you are not going to get away with saying someone might have a disability. That's wrong on all levels. That was not warranted at all so don't try and play the righteous card.
Now, this was specifically said:
that was apparent when he hired Lafleur never even consulting Rodgers,
This has been proven to just not be true, so the goalposts are being moved to now include the quality of the consultation.
oh please spare us all your PC garble 23, how often have you and others here insulted me?
and asking a bunch of players what traits there looking for is not even close to a actual consultation with a coach, which you know damn well is what I was referring to
No one was insulted here even a little until the completely wrong disability claim. That should never be accepted here and should be called out without hesitation. And please do not play the righteous card when you of all people insult every member of this board constantly. Let's try not to hold grudges.
Say what you mean then and don't expect people to decipher what you write. You said Rodgers was NEVER even consulted in the coaching hire, so I took that for how it read.
Palmy - "Very few have the ability to truly excel regardless of system. For many the system is the difference between being just a guy or an NFL starter. Fact is, everyone is talented at this level."
There are some learning disabilities that don’t allow someone to recognize a grey area.
Ya, you are not going to get away with saying someone might have a disability. That's wrong on all levels. That was not warranted at all so don't try and play the righteous card.
Now, this was specifically said:
that was apparent when he hired Lafleur never even consulting Rodgers,
This has been proven to just not be true, so the goalposts are being moved to now include the quality of the consultation.
oh please spare us all your PC garble 23, how often have you and others here insulted me?
and asking a bunch of players what traits there looking for is not even close to a actual consultation with a coach, which you know damn well is what I was referring to
I didn’t even insult him. Just made you aware we may be dealing with a situation that prevents one from understanding nuance. I was trying to be kind and prevent drama by agreeing with you that it is best just not to engage.
That said, you are right. The kicker is obviously whether Aaron considered that to be “consulting him” about the new hire. I agree with Aaron that it wasn’t much of a consultation and definitely not what he would have had in mind.
I didn’t even insult him. Just made you aware we may be dealing with a situation that prevents one from understanding nuance. I was trying to be kind and prevent drama by agreeing with you that it is best just not to engage.
Ah, the passive aggressive lie. Everyone knows the road you were taking and it was not the high one. It was completely inappropriate.
And it was never about what Aaron would have wanted, it was about what [mention]Yoop[/mention] said happened, which was not the reality no matter the quality.
Palmy - "Very few have the ability to truly excel regardless of system. For many the system is the difference between being just a guy or an NFL starter. Fact is, everyone is talented at this level."
Ya, you are not going to get away with saying someone might have a disability. That's wrong on all levels. That was not warranted at all so don't try and play the righteous card.
Now, this was specifically said:
This has been proven to just not be true, so the goalposts are being moved to now include the quality of the consultation.
oh please spare us all your PC garble 23, how often have you and others here insulted me?
and asking a bunch of players what traits there looking for is not even close to a actual consultation with a coach, which you know damn well is what I was referring to
I didn’t even insult him. Just made you aware we may be dealing with a situation that prevents one from understanding nuance. I was trying to be kind and prevent drama by agreeing with you that it is best just not to engage.
That said, you are right. The kicker is obviously whether Aaron considered that to be “consulting him” about the new hire. I agree with Aaron that it wasn’t much of a consultation and definitely not what he would have had in mind.
004 hit the nail on the head, Rodgers deserved a sit down with the prospects, Consultation was probably the wrong word taken generically, what I meant was a personal consultation.
but I think the party so insulted new that and just played his word games
but I think the party so insulted new that and just played his word games
You said Rodgers was NEVER EVEN consulted. Say what you mean and do not expect others to decipher your meaning.
Palmy - "Very few have the ability to truly excel regardless of system. For many the system is the difference between being just a guy or an NFL starter. Fact is, everyone is talented at this level."
If Aaron was willing, I would have scheduled a good 30 minutes for him to sit in with each candidate, Gute and Murphy and Russ, and basically let the coach try to sell his offensive scheme and plane, let Aaron ask a few questions.
I mean the QB coach relationship is super important as we learned, and we were locked into that QB for basically the length of the coaches contract, give or take. I just would have valued his opinion. Certainly not to the extent of who do you want, but I’d want to get someone where Aaron would feel indebted to work with.
I could see the value of doing this if you're 110% committed to Rodgers long-term, but I think the Love pick in 2020 shows that they had some doubts.
And what if Murph fou d himself in a situation where he is smitten with one particular candidate (as was reportedly the case with MLF) but then Rodgers feels just as strongly about some other candidate entirely?
Then you either have to do what he says to keep him happy (where does that end?) or Murph hires the guy he wants against Rodgers's wishes and then that worsens the rift.
It could end up doing more harm than good.
“Most other nations don't allow a terrorist to be their leader.”
“... Yet so many allow their leaders to be terrorists.”—Magneto
Boom. Aaron Rodgers was consulted, so we can hopefully get away from that argument. Thank you!
As expected, the discussion moved away from if Aaron was consulted to the level of consultation wasn't enough
This is why I don't try to be fair-and-balanced about Rodgers—nothing is ever good enough. Nothing short of singing the team away to him for life.
you where fair and balanced, what changed is you wouldn't accept that the QB you now profess to hate was not the real reason we lose PO games, in every one of those losses I pointed out the biggest reason why it became harder for that QB to snatch victory from defeat as he was so capable of doing during the regular season games, but you wouldn't listen.
your responses just like Go Pack Go and some others had to do with his contract, which doesn't mean squat during a game, or he had enough good receivers, RB's, or defense, ST's when actually he was down to stems and seeds in all categories, you also gave him no room for error even when I and others pointed out Tom Brady or Mahomes weren't free of error either and won SB's, no ones perfect.
If Aaron was willing, I would have scheduled a good 30 minutes for him to sit in with each candidate, Gute and Murphy and Russ, and basically let the coach try to sell his offensive scheme and plane, let Aaron ask a few questions.
I mean the QB coach relationship is super important as we learned, and we were locked into that QB for basically the length of the coaches contract, give or take. I just would have valued his opinion. Certainly not to the extent of who do you want, but I’d want to get someone where Aaron would feel indebted to work with.
I could see the value of doing this if you're 110% committed to Rodgers long-term, but I think the Love pick in 2020 shows that they had some doubts.
And what if Murph fou d himself in a situation where he is smitten with one particular candidate (as was reportedly the case with MLF) but then Rodgers feels just as strongly about some other candidate entirely?
Then you either have to do what he says to keep him happy (where does that end?) or Murph hires the guy he wants against Rodgers's wishes and then that worsens the rift.
It could end up doing more harm than good.
why is it you and your posse wont listen? Murphy took Rodgers old contract with 2 full seasons still remaining and upped it 120 million right after he demoted Ted and promoted Gutekunst to GM, no way he or anyone thought Rodgers was short term
also Gute said he tried to trade up for one of the top 5 receivers in that draft class prior to them being off the board prior to trading up for Love, now I don't know if I believe that entirely, but thats what he said
If Aaron was willing, I would have scheduled a good 30 minutes for him to sit in with each candidate, Gute and Murphy and Russ, and basically let the coach try to sell his offensive scheme and plane, let Aaron ask a few questions.
I mean the QB coach relationship is super important as we learned, and we were locked into that QB for basically the length of the coaches contract, give or take. I just would have valued his opinion. Certainly not to the extent of who do you want, but I’d want to get someone where Aaron would feel indebted to work with.
I could see the value of doing this if you're 110% committed to Rodgers long-term, but I think the Love pick in 2020 shows that they had some doubts.
And what if Murph fou d himself in a situation where he is smitten with one particular candidate (as was reportedly the case with MLF) but then Rodgers feels just as strongly about some other candidate entirely?
Then you either have to do what he says to keep him happy (where does that end?) or Murph hires the guy he wants against Rodgers's wishes and then that worsens the rift.
It could end up doing more harm than good.
why is it you and your posse wont listen? Murphy took Rodgers old contract with 2 full seasons still remaining and upped it 120 million right after he demoted Ted and promoted Gutekunst to GM, no way he or anyone thought Rodgers was short term
also Gute said he tried to trade up for one of the top 5 receivers in that draft class prior to them being off the board prior to trading up for Love, now I don't know if I believe that entirely, but thats what he said
I think there could be truth to the idea that they wanted a coach for life beyond rodgers. Remember, murph gave him that deal but that deal covered Rodgers for as long as Murphy may have wanted him. It was the deals beyond that one that were so counterintuitive to the plan of moving on. Mainly the deal Rodgers got last time.
But again, I’m not arguing whether or not Rodgers should have been fully consulted. I’m just agreeing with you and Rodgers that a 9 man pow wow before the process really even begins is not what Rodgers had in mind when he hoped to be involved.
This is not a shot at anyone, but I just knew this multi-page diversion would happen. I could see it coming from a mile away. We've all become very predictable when the subject is Rodgers-related.
“We didn’t lose the game; we just ran out of time.”
- Vince Lombardi
why is it you and your posse wont listen? Murphy took Rodgers old contract with 2 full seasons still remaining and upped it 120 million right after he demoted Ted and promoted Gutekunst to GM, no way he or anyone thought Rodgers was short term
That was in August of 2018 according to Spotrac. Then came arguably two of Rodgers's worst seasons, definitely among his worst three up to that point. It was unclear how much of that was Rodgers's play falling off versus other things that may have affected his play, but there was reason to think he wasn't the same guy anymore.
So yes, I think they felt uncertain about Rodgers. Not 'done' with him, just uncertain. Drafting a high-upside project passer like Jordan Love is a move you make when you can live with what you have at QB but are not 110% committed to him.
Murphy also said what they liked about MLF was his ability to coach QBs because they take that very seriously. I think MLF appealed to them both in terms of being able to help get Rodgers back on track *and/or* coach up a new QB when the time came.
also Gute said he tried to trade up for one of the top 5 receivers in that draft class prior to them being off the board prior to trading up for Love, now I don't know if I believe that entirely, but thats what he said
We have no way of knowing that, but we *do* know that Gute and MLF did very extensive scouting on Jordan Love pre-draft.
“Most other nations don't allow a terrorist to be their leader.”
“... Yet so many allow their leaders to be terrorists.”—Magneto
This is not a shot at anyone, but I just knew this multi-page diversion would happen. I could see it coming from a mile away. We've all become very predictable when the subject is Rodgers-related.
Well A) none of us have ever stated our opinions on the topic before. First time anyone have us have ever chimed in. B) at least this is the appropriate thread for it, to an extent.
So it sounds like the consensus from group A is that Murphy made the mistake for not including Aaron in the interviewing and hiring committee.
I wasn’t saying what should have happened, just saying I can see why rodgers wasn’t satisfied by a 9 man pow wow when he desired to be more involved.
What's the right amount of involvement and power you think AR deserved and should have had?
100% ?
75% ?
50% ?
25% ?
10 % ?
5 % ?
0 ?
Indulge me:
Paint me a verbal picture of how a "good and respectful" consultation with AR woulda gone.
What part of “I’m not saying what should have happened” was hard to understand?
I can just agree with Yoop and rodgers that a 9 man pow wow about personalities of future coaches may not have counted to rodgers as the consultation he was looking for
