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Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 12:15
by Pckfn23
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 13:01
by Yoop
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 10:47
Yoop wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 10:44
my argument is with Sternbergers opinion that some teams keep it simpler, my opinion is that those are less then the norm, and obviously not connected to the Shanahan tree.
And what experience do you have to form that opinion? Do you or any of us here have any experience in an NFL offense? I tend to take the opinion of a guy who has experienced a few of them over anyone here, including myself.
again when people think schemes are easy to adjust to fit any situation I disagree, I believe during the season, even bye week off it's much harder to accomplish then people realize.
Who thinks that? Who has said they are?
I think sports news media people direct conversations and opinions in the direction they themselves feel strongly about, and all the talk has been lately that Lafleurs scheme designs are to complicated for rookies, people here say it, as well as media, to me that is mostly over blown hype.
we have for many years route design where (back to most of McCarthy's years had route variances) the receiver has a choice of breaking in or out depending on defender post snap adjustments.
that stuff is as old as the hills
it was the same talk concerning Capers years ago
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 13:13
by Pckfn23
Yoop wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 13:01
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 10:47
Yoop wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 10:44
my argument is with Sternbergers opinion that some teams keep it simpler, my opinion is that those are less then the norm, and obviously not connected to the Shanahan tree.
And what experience do you have to form that opinion? Do you or any of us here have any experience in an NFL offense? I tend to take the opinion of a guy who has experienced a few of them over anyone here, including myself.
again when people think schemes are easy to adjust to fit any situation I disagree, I believe during the season, even bye week off it's much harder to accomplish then people realize.
Who thinks that? Who has said they are?
we have for many years route design where (back to most of McCarthy's years had route variances) the receiver has a choice of breaking in or out depending on defender post snap adjustments.
that stuff is as old as the hills
Go watch it again, that isn't just what Sternberger is talking about. He is talking about the small details too and that not all offenses require the attention to detail that LaFluer's system does. For example he specifically mentions the exact yardage of a route outside the numbers and how they need to also be aware of the other routes that are being run. Are you saying that Sternberger is not being truthful in recounting his experiences in Green Bay, Pittsburgh, and Buffalo?
Jace Sternberger isn't a media guy, FYI. He is a player with real experiences in NFL offenses recounting those first hand experiences. He DID NOT or IS NOT saying the offense is too complicated. He never even once hinted at that.
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 13:15
by Yoop
go pak go wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 11:29
Boy yoop.
I got a very different vibe from Stern's discussion. He was very positive and complimentary of MLF.
of course he was, but thats not what I was trying to convey, his point, if I understand it right, was to say Lafleurs pass schemes are to complicated, my point is, there not much different then the schemes used across the league.
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 13:20
by Pckfn23
Here is another part of the conversation that adds to it being about the minute details.
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 13:24
by Yoop
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 13:13
Yoop wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 13:01
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 10:47
And what experience do you have to form that opinion? Do you or any of us here have any experience in an NFL offense? I tend to take the opinion of a guy who has experienced a few of them over anyone here, including myself.
Who thinks that? Who has said they are?
we have for many years route design where (back to most of McCarthy's years had route variances) the receiver has a choice of breaking in or out depending on defender post snap adjustments.
that stuff is as old as the hills
Go watch it again, that isn't just what Sternberger is talking about. He is talking about the small details too and that not all offenses require the attention to detail that LaFluer's system does. For example he specifically mentions the exact yardage of a route outside the numbers and how they need to also be aware of the other routes that are being run. Are you saying that Sternberger is not being truthful in recounting his experiences in Green Bay, Pittsburgh, and Buffalo?
Jace Sternberger isn't a media guy, FYI. He is a player with real experiences in NFL offenses recounting those first hand experiences.
never said he was a media guy, maybe re read what I said, and every receiver has to know what you just described, and of the 3 teams two then are complicated and only Pittsburg runs a HS scheme.
also you don't know that Lafleur requires his rookie receivers to know every route, that was a McCarthy and Rodgers thing, course to be able to move receivers around it's obviously necessary.
I'am saying that Sternburger was probably led into some of the comments he made from Butkowski, what receivers coaches don't expect exact yardage to break or catch points? how is a QB suppose to know where to throw the ball?
again the whole point of that article was to shift blame from the receivers over to Lafleur, no sale.
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 13:31
by Pckfn23
and every receiver has to know what you just described, and of the 3 teams two then are complicated and only Pittsburg runs a HS scheme.
In the Packer offense, yes, the receivers do need to know those things. In the Pittsburgh offense, it doesn't revolve around those small details.
also you don't know that Lafleur requires his rookie receivers to know every route, that was a McCarthy and Rodgers thing, course to be able to move receivers around it's obviously necessary.
I didn't talk about rookies. I never even typed that word.
I'am saying that Sternburger was probably led into some of the comments he made from Butkowski, what receivers coaches don't expect exact yardage to break or catch points? how is a QB suppose to know where to throw the ball?
You have no basis for that belief. There is just no reason to not believe what Jace Sternberger is saying. Again, though, you aren't understanding the actual details that Sternberger is talking about. He is talking about much more than just different routes for coverage and routes are certain yards. Again, why don't you believe what Jace is saying when he says the Packer offense is more detail oriented?
again the whole point of that article was to shift blame from the receivers over to Lafleur, no sale.
What article? There isn't an article. That leads me to believe you didn't even watch the video. That and there was no blame at all in the video. Ya, I don't think you watched it.
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 13:40
by go pak go
lol.
Yoop is now just straight up trolling.
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 13:42
by Yoop
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 13:31
sports news media people direct conversations and opinions in the direction they themselves feel strongly about
This is not what is happening in that conversation. You are trying to drive your own narrative into this.
then why did Butkowski interview a past player concerning the pass routes Lafleur uses? of course he led Sterno in the direction he wanted Stern to talk about.
23 I have trouble accepting almost everything Stern said, route combo's, route depths are as old as I'am for cripe sakes, and if ya dial stuff back with singular route designs, don't you think DC's will catch on to that in a NY minute, of course they will.
No, this was basically a interview to paint Lafleur as to complicated, and to defend these poor rookie receivers, that you and others agree, ehhh, just can't get on board, sorry.
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 13:44
by Yoop
go pak go wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 13:40
lol.
Yoop is now just straight up trolling.
so defending a rational point of view is now trolling
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 13:47
by Yoop
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 13:31
and every receiver has to know what you just described, and of the 3 teams two then are complicated and only Pittsburg runs a HS scheme.
In the Packer offense, yes, the receivers do need to know those things. In the Pittsburgh offense, it doesn't revolve around those small details.
also you don't know that Lafleur requires his rookie receivers to know every route, that was a McCarthy and Rodgers thing, course to be able to move receivers around it's obviously necessary.
I didn't talk about rookies. I never even typed that word.
I'am saying that Sternburger was probably led into some of the comments he made from Butkowski, what receivers coaches don't expect exact yardage to break or catch points? how is a QB suppose to know where to throw the ball?
You have no basis for that belief. There is just no reason to not believe what Jace Sternberger is saying. Again, though, you aren't understanding the actual details that Sternberger is talking about. He is talking about much more than just different routes for coverage and routes are certain yards. Again, why don't you believe what Jace is saying when he says the Packer offense is more detail oriented?
again the whole point of that article was to shift blame from the receivers over to Lafleur, no sale.
What article? There isn't an article. That leads me to believe you didn't even watch the video. That and there was no blame at all in the video. Ya, I don't think you watched it.
so again, your calling me a liar, watching it is what convinced me that Butkowski was attempting to lay blame at the feet of Lafleur, I bet he dial up ten ex packer receivers before he found one to spout the nonsense that Sternberger did.
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 13:49
by Pckfn23
Yoop wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 13:42
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 13:31
sports news media people direct conversations and opinions in the direction they themselves feel strongly about
This is not what is happening in that conversation. You are trying to drive your own narrative into this.
then why did Butkowski interview a past player concerning the pass routes Lafleur uses? of course he led Sterno in the direction he wanted Stern to talk about.
He didn't interview him about that...
They were talking about the differences in the Packers and Pittsburgh offenses.
23 I have trouble accepting almost everything Stern said, route combo's, route depths are as old as I'am for cripe sakes, and if ya dial stuff back with singular route designs, don't you think DC's will catch on to that in a NY minute, of course they will.
He didn't talk about that. You may want to actually go watch the video.
No, this was basically a interview to paint Lafleur as to complicated, and to defend these poor rookie receivers, that you and others agree, ehhh, just can't get on board, sorry.
You are free to think what you like, but you are wrong.
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 13:50
by Pckfn23
Yoop wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 13:47
so again, your calling me a liar, watching it is what convinced me that Butkowski was attempting to lay blame at the feet of Lafleur, I bet he dial up ten ex packer receivers before he found one to spout the nonsense that Sternberger did.
Bukowski says 3 words in the entire 210 second clip.
Maybe, just maybe Bukowski talked to Sternberger because Sternberger has ties to Green Bay and Pittsburgh...
Hey, I know you are into conspiracies, so proceed!
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 13:50
by wallyuwl
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 14:00
by Yoop
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 13:50
Yoop wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 13:47
so again, your calling me a liar, watching it is what convinced me that Butkowski was attempting to lay blame at the feet of Lafleur, I bet he dial up ten ex packer receivers before he found one to spout the nonsense that Sternberger did.
Hey, I know you are into conspiracies, so proceed!
I know BS when I hear it, we had to know how to read a DB to win leverage, had to know depth of brake and catch points 60 years ago, now according to a TE thats never held a job over 2 seasons since we cut him, that this stuff isn't expected to be known as a rookie nfl receiver, come on
this is probably why he can't stick with a team.
also how many other ink peddlers like Butkowski are pointing fingers and throwing anything that will stick to lay some blame on Lafleur,? he's not the only one.
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 14:03
by go pak go
Yoop wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 13:44
go pak go wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 13:40
lol.
Yoop is now just straight up trolling.
so defending a rational point of view is now trolling
The narrative you are pushing that Bukowski is calling up 10 former Packers to get the "Juice" against MLF when the actual interview was nothing but positive to MLF (he literally said he kept MLF's playbook as a resource for when Sternberger will be a coach one day) is rational?
Maybe instead of this wild conspiracy theory you are trying to push...maybe just maybe
that we can actually believe the words that people actually say and there isn't this crazy ulterior motive in the background that only yoop undertands that conveniently also aligns with yoop's pre-decided narrative.
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 14:11
by Pckfn23
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 14:28
by Labrev
"Butt"kowski opened today's episode saying that he still thinks MLF is a good coach, weird opening for his anti-MLF agenda.
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 16:07
by APB
I was gonna comment on the Sternberger interview and how it may offer some insights into why the QB and WRs seem to consistently be on different pages, how it could possibly be a main contributor to why Love is hesitant to let it rip, how Love may not trust the receivers to see and react the same to what he is seeing...but I've lost all interest because the same two adversaries have once again taken over the topic and turned the conversation into a mindless tail chasing exercise.
The answer is a resounding NO.
Re: Packers @ Steelers GDT: Sunday, Nov. 12th, 12:00 PM CST
Posted: 10 Nov 2023 17:03
by Half Empty
go pak go wrote: ↑10 Nov 2023 13:40
lol.
Yoop is now just straight up trolling.
NOW?