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Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 14:51
by Crazylegs Starks
Raptorman wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 12:31
The only reason why Brady has 7 rings is he has always had good defenses...
Ding, ding, ding! It's ridiculous how few times Brady has had below average or bad defenses. He's the luckiest modern era QB by far.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 15:43
by Raptorman
Crazylegs Starks wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 14:51
Raptorman wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 12:31
The only reason why Brady has 7 rings is he has always had good defenses...
Ding, ding, ding! It's ridiculous how few times Brady has had below average or bad defenses. He's the luckiest modern era QB by far.
Luck. No. Now does QB play have an effect on the defense? I'm sure it does. How much? Well, take NE as an example. Are you going to tell me that Mac Jones's play is good enough to have the Pats defense at 17 ppg? Last year was New England's worst year on defense since Belichick took over. 22 ppg. That tells you how bad Newton played. He couldn't win with a good defense.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 15:46
by Drj820
The Bucs werent a playoff team before he got to tampa and they had a lot of talent before he got there. Brady comes in and showed them how to win. Showed them the championship mindset needed to hold up a trophy. Showed even Arians how to come in and prepare for greatness everyday. He barked at his OLmen when they needed an adjustment as he was getting everyone to raise their standard of professionalism and preparation. I believe he learned alot of this from Bill Belichik. To Bradys credit, he was the perfect person to implement Bills vision on the field. He then went to tampa and implemented that vision successfully.
Credit where it is due.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 15:56
by bud fox
Brady has been put in great situations but he has also converted. Many times. Great quarterback. There are better qbs e.g. Rodgers and Marino, but Brady has won which is most important for legacy.
Packers were caught off guard with how physical the bucs were and the wrs really helped Brady. I don't expect that again this this around.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 15:57
by Raptorman
Drj820 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 15:46
The Bucs werent a playoff team before he got to tampa and they had a lot of talent before he got there. Brady comes in and showed them how to win. Showed them the championship mindset needed to hold up a trophy. Showed even Arians how to come in and prepare for greatness everyday. He barked at his OLmen when they needed an adjustment as he was getting everyone to raise their standard of professionalism and preparation. I believe he learned alot of this from Bill Belichik. To Bradys credit, he was the perfect person to implement Bills vision on the field. He then went to tampa and implemented that vision successfully.
Credit where it is due.
Yeah, okay. Tampa's defense gave up 22 ppg last year. By far the worst defense Brady has ever played with.
But okay. So, we can credit Mac Jones with the Turn around in New England from last year?
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 15:57
by Drj820
Raptorman wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 15:57
Drj820 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 15:46
The Bucs werent a playoff team before he got to tampa and they had a lot of talent before he got there. Brady comes in and showed them how to win. Showed them the championship mindset needed to hold up a trophy. Showed even Arians how to come in and prepare for greatness everyday. He barked at his OLmen when they needed an adjustment as he was getting everyone to raise their standard of professionalism and preparation. I believe he learned alot of this from Bill Belichik. To Bradys credit, he was the perfect person to implement Bills vision on the field. He then went to tampa and implemented that vision successfully.
Credit where it is due.
Yeah, okay. Tampa's defense gave up 22 ppg last year. By far the worst defense Brady has ever played with.
But okay. So, we can credit Mac Jones with the Turn around in New England from last year?
Wake me up when Mac Jones wins a SB.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 16:03
by Drj820
Raptorman wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 15:57
Drj820 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 15:46
The Bucs werent a playoff team before he got to tampa and they had a lot of talent before he got there. Brady comes in and showed them how to win. Showed them the championship mindset needed to hold up a trophy. Showed even Arians how to come in and prepare for greatness everyday. He barked at his OLmen when they needed an adjustment as he was getting everyone to raise their standard of professionalism and preparation. I believe he learned alot of this from Bill Belichik. To Bradys credit, he was the perfect person to implement Bills vision on the field. He then went to tampa and implemented that vision successfully.
Credit where it is due.
Yeah, okay. Tampa's defense gave up 22 ppg last year. By far the worst defense Brady has ever played with.
But okay. So, we can credit Mac Jones with the Turn around in New England from last year?
Question, if kork Cousins was the Bucs QB last year...do you believe Cousins comes to Lambeau and beats the Packers in the NFCCG?
I, emphatically, do not.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 16:32
by Acrobat
Or if you put Cousins and Brady on the Lions. I have a hunch on what QB would fare better.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 17:15
by Pugger
wallyuwl wrote: ↑29 Dec 2021 16:13
NCF wrote: ↑29 Dec 2021 12:01
Getting those two back for Detroit, plus Alexander, IMO there is no stopping this team.
I have a feeling Bak won't be back before the playoffs.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 17:28
by packman114
At this point in time I think we're better off with Patrick staying at center for the playoffs. He's playing pretty well and Myers being a rookie against playoff defenses would just make me uncomfortable.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 18:34
by BF004
packman114 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 17:28
At this point in time I think we're better off with Patrick staying at center for the playoffs. He's playing pretty well and Myers being a rookie against playoff defenses would just make me uncomfortable.
I totally agree there. It's Patrick's for the rest of the year barring injury, IMO. Myers can be pencilled in as the 2022 starter.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 19:07
by dsr
Raptorman wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 13:48
Simply pointing out the fact that when you consistently have a defense that holds the other team to 20 ppg or less, it's a lot easier for a QB to win. How many times has Rodgers had that? 3 times How many times has Brady? 15. Cousins. Once The worst defense Brady ever had, gave up 21.6 ppg during the year. Even Stafford wins 73% of his games when his defense only gives up 21 ppg. Cousins win 80% of those games. Rodgers 85%. The NFL norm for QB's winning at 21 ppg or less is around 80%. Go to 18 ppg and it goes up to 85%. Everyone praises Brady as the greatest of all time. Put on Detroit and let's see how he does.
I don't think I'm oversimplifying here. A good QB controls the ball for 35 minutes. A bad QB controls the ball for 25 minutes. Is it not possible to the point of certainty, that one of the reasons his defence concedes fewer points per game is because the opposing offence has fewer chances?
(And that's before we consider interceptions.)
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 20:02
by Raptorman
dsr wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 19:07
Raptorman wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 13:48
Simply pointing out the fact that when you consistently have a defense that holds the other team to 20 ppg or less, it's a lot easier for a QB to win. How many times has Rodgers had that? 3 times How many times has Brady? 15. Cousins. Once The worst defense Brady ever had, gave up 21.6 ppg during the year. Even Stafford wins 73% of his games when his defense only gives up 21 ppg. Cousins win 80% of those games. Rodgers 85%. The NFL norm for QB's winning at 21 ppg or less is around 80%. Go to 18 ppg and it goes up to 85%. Everyone praises Brady as the greatest of all time. Put on Detroit and let's see how he does.
I don't think I'm oversimplifying here. A good QB controls the ball for 35 minutes. A bad QB controls the ball for 25 minutes. Is it not possible to the point of certainty, that one of the reasons his defence concedes fewer points per game is because the opposing offence has fewer chances?
(And that's before we consider interceptions.)
The most extra chances for an offense to have the ball in a game, barring onside kicks is 2, 3 in overtime games.
Interceptions are not as important as you think they are. Favre has 3 times as many (game-wise) as Rodgers and yet their win percentages are about the same.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 21:09
by paco
Looking like I might get tickets to this game. Wife looking for a hotel. Now just hoping whatever I'm coming down with isn't covid and is gone by Sunday.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 30 Dec 2021 22:28
by wallyuwl
paco wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 21:09
Looking like I might get tickets to this game. Wife looking for a hotel. Now just hoping whatever I'm coming down with isn't covid and is gone by Sunday.
If u weren't ill my parents live 6 blocks from Lambeau and will be out of town until Sunday afternoon.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 31 Dec 2021 05:02
by dsr
Raptorman wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 20:02
dsr wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 19:07
Raptorman wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 13:48
Simply pointing out the fact that when you consistently have a defense that holds the other team to 20 ppg or less, it's a lot easier for a QB to win. How many times has Rodgers had that? 3 times How many times has Brady? 15. Cousins. Once The worst defense Brady ever had, gave up 21.6 ppg during the year. Even Stafford wins 73% of his games when his defense only gives up 21 ppg. Cousins win 80% of those games. Rodgers 85%. The NFL norm for QB's winning at 21 ppg or less is around 80%. Go to 18 ppg and it goes up to 85%. Everyone praises Brady as the greatest of all time. Put on Detroit and let's see how he does.
I don't think I'm oversimplifying here. A good QB controls the ball for 35 minutes. A bad QB controls the ball for 25 minutes. Is it not possible to the point of certainty, that one of the reasons his defence concedes fewer points per game is because the opposing offence has fewer chances?
(And that's before we consider interceptions.)
The most extra chances for an offense to have the ball in a game, barring onside kicks is 2, 3 in overtime games.
Interceptions are not as important as you think they are. Favre has 3 times as many (game-wise) as Rodgers and yet their win percentages are about the same.
Exactly. If a QB is so good that he just has 3 or 4 possessions each half, then the opposition get far fewer chances to score than if he regularly goes 3-and-out. If they produce stats on average number of possessions per game, I bet Brady (and by extension his opponents) is relatively lower than most.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 31 Dec 2021 05:34
by TheSkeptic
dsr wrote: ↑31 Dec 2021 05:02
Raptorman wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 20:02
dsr wrote: ↑30 Dec 2021 19:07
I don't think I'm oversimplifying here. A good QB controls the ball for 35 minutes. A bad QB controls the ball for 25 minutes. Is it not possible to the point of certainty, that one of the reasons his defence concedes fewer points per game is because the opposing offence has fewer chances?
(And that's before we consider interceptions.)
The most extra chances for an offense to have the ball in a game, barring onside kicks is 2, 3 in overtime games.
Interceptions are not as important as you think they are. Favre has 3 times as many (game-wise) as Rodgers and yet their win percentages are about the same.
Exactly. If a QB is so good that he just has 3 or 4 possessions each half, then the opposition get far fewer chances to score than if he regularly goes 3-and-out. If they produce stats on average number of possessions per game, I bet Brady (and by extension his opponents) is relatively lower than most.
The worst thing that can happen to a D, any D, is to have the O go 3-and-out more than once a game. But this is Rodgers' MO. Deep pass on 1st down, overthrown. Handoff to Jones on the 2nd down, gains 2 yards. Pressured on 3rd down and incomplete.
Of course it could be a little different, AR could throw it away on first down if he gets pressure. As opposed to a small risk of an interception and getting a pass interference flag and a 1st down.
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 31 Dec 2021 08:04
by Pckfn23
Hehe
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 31 Dec 2021 08:11
by paco
Pansies can't handle the cold!
Re: Vikings @ Packers GDT: Sunday, January 2nd, 2022 - 7:20 CST
Posted: 31 Dec 2021 09:09
by Yoop
paco wrote: ↑31 Dec 2021 08:11
Pansies can't handle the cold!
the domers are staying home
sounds like Jefferson chewed out the team for lack of energetic play last week, riling up the team to play for a play off birth, we need to dash there hopes, I love to hear the vikings fans wailing in despair