Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 13:01
Yeah, that is pathetic.
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Packers Defense - 2024
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Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 13:30
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 13:57
Great post, thanks.
So much to glean from it.
First, a middle linebacker given a free shot at the QB and yet Quay hesitates and fails to close. If a player lacks instincts to play there is just no way to overcome that reality.
Second, what is Hafley supposed to do to make it easier for Quay?
Third, I am not sure that the RB out of the backfield is Williams' responsibility, but even if he was at least Evan displayed sufficient wherewithal to recover and prevent what might otherwise have been a TD (love the rookie).
Fourth, and sadly, Kenny Clark looks washed barely getting any push on what was an obvious passing down.
Again, thanks for sharing.
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 14:09
Blitzing has been something he has usually be decent at. He looked very lost outside of a few plays yesterday.LombardiTime wrote: ↑18 Nov 2024 13:57First, a middle linebacker given a free shot at the QB and yet Quay hesitates and fails to close. If a player lacks instincts to play there is just no way to overcome that reality.
Move him at the very least. Make him a backup to spell Wilson, or McDuffie. Make him the passing down LBer only.Second, what is Hafley supposed to do to make it easier for Quay?
If it was not Williams' then it was Walker's, but it most certainly was Williams' for the reason below. He didn't pass off the Dig fast enough. Like you said, he did well to recover. If Walker didn't hesitate that is probably not a completion.Third, I am not sure that the RB out of the backfield is Williams' responsibility, but even if he was at least Evan displayed sufficient wherewithal to recover and prevent what might otherwise have been a TD (love the rookie).
Since Walker is blitzing it is 100% Clark's job to occupy the guard so that Walker can rush free. I can't fault him on this play alone. This part also tells me it is Williams who has the left flat.Fourth, and sadly, Kenny Clark looks washed barely getting any push on what was an obvious passing down.
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 14:11
And if WAlker had committed too soon and Williams jucked him and ran you would blame Walker for that, I can't wait to see the PFF grades, Walker was better than all this negative talkLombardiTime wrote: ↑18 Nov 2024 13:57Great post, thanks.
So much to glean from it.
First, a middle linebacker given a free shot at the QB and yet Quay hesitates and fails to close. If a player lacks instincts to play there is just no way to overcome that reality.
Second, what is Hafley supposed to do to make it easier for Quay?
Third, I am not sure that the RB out of the backfield is Williams' responsibility, but even if he was at least Evan displayed sufficient wherewithal to recover and prevent what might otherwise have been a TD (love the rookie).
Fourth, and sadly, Kenny Clark looks washed barely getting any push on what was an obvious passing down.
Again, thanks for sharing.
RPO QB's have played hell with us in other games, again it is why your seeing passive pass rush, and if we couldn't only tackle better, the results of these rush schemes would have much better results.
not saying I like this stuff, just that there is a reason we are doing it.
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 14:15
That play isn't an RPO. It is a straight pass play. There is not even any play action.
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 14:31
so??? Williams still burned us with his legs and Walker had to honor that ability, that is so obvious during that play, and it's also completely obvious with our pass rush, yet people just simply refuse to accept or understand that containment and stopping the run has become a much higher focus then just pass rush, and if Valentine and the others would use proper tackling technique these scheme would pay off, I watch Valentine miss 3 easy tackles yesterday because he sets up head down and hits with the shoulder, same with others.
I bet we has a dozen missed tackles yesterday.
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 15:01
Quay Walker makes me miss Krys Barnes.
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 15:10
Drive through the near hip. Stopping to let the ball carrier make a move puts the defender in a bad position.
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 15:18
On this play, there's no defending Quay. The stop and wiggle did absolutely nothing, except for ruin his GREAT chance of hitting the QB before he had a chance to throw or run. If anything, it opened up a lane for Williams to run to the outside (inside was clogged already).Yoop wrote: ↑18 Nov 2024 14:31so??? Williams still burned us with his legs and Walker had to honor that ability, that is so obvious during that play, and it's also completely obvious with our pass rush, yet people just simply refuse to accept or understand that containment and stopping the run has become a much higher focus then just pass rush, and if Valentine and the others would use proper tackling technique these scheme would pay off, I watch Valentine miss 3 easy tackles yesterday because he sets up head down and hits with the shoulder, same with others.
I bet we has a dozen missed tackles yesterday.
I do point out when Q does make good plays, but this particular one is just a failing grade play, pure and simple.
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 15:44
true, I wasn't actually trying to defend that play, rather just reasoning why he was tentative, he was worried that Williams would juke him, as Williams was able to with others yesterday, Walker wasn't the only one burnt with William speed.salmar80 wrote: ↑18 Nov 2024 15:18On this play, there's no defending Quay. The stop and wiggle did absolutely nothing, except for ruin his GREAT chance of hitting the QB before he had a chance to throw or run. If anything, it opened up a lane for Williams to run to the outside (inside was clogged already).Yoop wrote: ↑18 Nov 2024 14:31so??? Williams still burned us with his legs and Walker had to honor that ability, that is so obvious during that play, and it's also completely obvious with our pass rush, yet people just simply refuse to accept or understand that containment and stopping the run has become a much higher focus then just pass rush, and if Valentine and the others would use proper tackling technique these scheme would pay off, I watch Valentine miss 3 easy tackles yesterday because he sets up head down and hits with the shoulder, same with others.
I bet we has a dozen missed tackles yesterday.
I do point out when Q does make good plays, but this particular one is just a failing grade play, pure and simple.
WAlker has not played up to draft slot very often, I think he was better as a rookie and letting Campbell wear the mic, Hopefully Cooper can handle that job better, But WAlker plays bigger and is more proto-typical MLB, so we'll see
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 15:44
Walker is terrified to make a mistake so he does nothing proactive. All reactive! Time for Jamesrob to call on Guttey to play Hopper in preseason and blowouts!
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 16:26
flapackfan wrote: ↑18 Nov 2024 15:44Walker is terrified to make a mistake so he does nothing proactive. All reactive! Time for Jamesrob to call on Guttey to play Hopper in preseason and blowouts!
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 21:00
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 18 Nov 2024 21:11
Peter Buttkowski said it on his pod today. Idk how you justify continuing to play Quay Walker in the starting defense and that was true a month ago. I don’t know what the coaches see to keep putting him out there. He is one of the worst starters in all of football. Where’s the accountability?
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 19 Nov 2024 08:29
Andy Herman was pretty brutally negative on Sunday about Quay's performance, as well. The evidence is stacking up against Quay. I am actually fairly surprised the beat hasn't pushed it harder.lupedafiasco wrote: ↑18 Nov 2024 21:11Peter Buttkowski said it on his pod today. Idk how you justify continuing to play Quay Walker in the starting defense and that was true a month ago. I don’t know what the coaches see to keep putting him out there. He is one of the worst starters in all of football. Where’s the accountability?
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 19 Nov 2024 09:02
simple, he's performed more consistently than anyone else at ILB, every game he ranks top 5 on defense, as Flapackfan said (same with other players) there more concerned with not making mistakes than just simply playing, it's the learning curve players go through in new schemes, Walker is a much better player then this guy we see now, jmo.NCF wrote: ↑19 Nov 2024 08:29Andy Herman was pretty brutally negative on Sunday about Quay's performance, as well. The evidence is stacking up against Quay. I am actually fairly surprised the beat hasn't pushed it harder.lupedafiasco wrote: ↑18 Nov 2024 21:11Peter Buttkowski said it on his pod today. Idk how you justify continuing to play Quay Walker in the starting defense and that was true a month ago. I don’t know what the coaches see to keep putting him out there. He is one of the worst starters in all of football. Where’s the accountability?
Next year someone else may wear the mic, maybe McDuffy, and move Walker to sam with Cooper at will backer???? but right now neither seems as ready/experienced to claim that job
another note of interest is that one of the blockers, maybe Buttkowski said Haf's defense schemes are complicated, for whatever that's worth.
maybe BSA or 23 can shed more light on that????
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 19 Nov 2024 09:13
I don't think the other guys are outplaying Walker at all. Wilson has some big plays in a couple games but down to down I think he's as good as he's going to get and in limited action is in the same general area of level as Quay. McDuffie is not and he's not going to get better than what he is. He's a back up at best.
Quay has is mistakes, that's been obvious. Quay has also made plays that are overshadowed and many played exactly how they want that get lost in the increasing yells to get rid of him. Wilson nor McDuffie are breaking up that pass play later in the game and that was a huge play.
So at the end of the day we have 2 guys who are pretty much as good as they're going to be with only one of them close to Quay and then Quay is at or above both of them with a ceiling that will go much higher. to me, it's not really a question of why he's getting so many more opportunities as frustrating as it is.
They've gotten the other guys to where they're going to get them, they're going to keep trying to get Quay to where they see his ability taking him. I don't think we're better with either of the other 2 on the field. Go back to the Lions game and watch McD and Wilson. They weren't good down in and down out. Lots of bad angles, eaten by blocks, backs to the runners as they flew by them etc.
Quay has is mistakes, that's been obvious. Quay has also made plays that are overshadowed and many played exactly how they want that get lost in the increasing yells to get rid of him. Wilson nor McDuffie are breaking up that pass play later in the game and that was a huge play.
So at the end of the day we have 2 guys who are pretty much as good as they're going to be with only one of them close to Quay and then Quay is at or above both of them with a ceiling that will go much higher. to me, it's not really a question of why he's getting so many more opportunities as frustrating as it is.
They've gotten the other guys to where they're going to get them, they're going to keep trying to get Quay to where they see his ability taking him. I don't think we're better with either of the other 2 on the field. Go back to the Lions game and watch McD and Wilson. They weren't good down in and down out. Lots of bad angles, eaten by blocks, backs to the runners as they flew by them etc.
Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 19 Nov 2024 09:24
well said, and thanks for these comments of support for Walker,musclestang wrote: ↑19 Nov 2024 09:13I don't think the other guys are outplaying Walker at all. Wilson has some big plays in a couple games but down to down I think he's as good as he's going to get and in limited action is in the same general area of level as Quay. McDuffie is not and he's not going to get better than what he is. He's a back up at best.
Quay has is mistakes, that's been obvious. Quay has also made plays that are overshadowed and many played exactly how they want that get lost in the increasing yells to get rid of him. Wilson nor McDuffie are breaking up that pass play later in the game and that was a huge play.
So at the end of the day we have 2 guys who are pretty much as good as they're going to be with only one of them close to Quay and then Quay is at or above both of them with a ceiling that will go much higher. to me, it's not really a question of why he's getting so many more opportunities as frustrating as it is.
They've gotten the other guys to where they're going to get them, they're going to keep trying to get Quay to where they see his ability taking him. I don't think we're better with either of the other 2 on the field. Go back to the Lions game and watch McD and Wilson. They weren't good down in and down out. Lots of bad angles, eaten by blocks, backs to the runners as they flew by them etc.
I think a lot of the angst for him is because we used slot 22 to draft him and many thought it was a reach, including me, I want to see more Cooper, but obviously, he hasn't gained enough trust from the coaches as yet.Re: Packers Defense - 2024
Posted: 19 Nov 2024 09:37