How much do you think a player like Zach Moss would cost? Would it make sense to replace Dillon with one of these free agent RBs? I really think you maximize Jones' impact by giving him a "thunder" counterpart. Or do we just draft Braelon Allen and consider it covered?
I quoted [mention]mnkcarp[/mention] from the 2024 FA thread but the response fits better here.
Braelon Allen alternative:
Re: 2024 Draft Discussion
Posted: 29 Feb 2024 06:41
by APB
I'm not sure how I feel about this.
I can appreciate new owner engagement and taking an interest in perhaps the most important pick for the future of the franchise. But there's also an element of "meddling" and owner influence here that is many times detrimental for the GM and scouting staffs trying to do their work.
Re: 2024 Draft Discussion
Posted: 29 Feb 2024 07:36
by BF004
Absolutely nothing wrong with that, I sure as hell would.
Just big differences if he’s using it for learning exercises or even had minimal inputs, just as long as he doesn’t try to play side seat GM.
You spend billions for this franchise, this is literally the make or break decision for your team for the next 3-4 years. I would absolutely want to be in the know. Just have to have the humility that you don’t know what you don’t know, however.
Re: 2024 Draft Discussion
Posted: 29 Feb 2024 07:44
by YoHoChecko
Franchise QB is about the only evaluation that owner sign-off matters to me. Not in the football sense of evaluation; you need the GM to make that call. But if the football odds close, the PERSON who represents your franchise matters to an owner.
But yes as BF said, there are ways this would be awful news and ways this would be non-factor mews, which inherently makes it not really news on its own
Absolutely nothing wrong with that, I sure as hell would.
Just big differences if he’s using it for learning exercises or even had minimal inputs, just as long as he doesn’t try to play side seat GM.
You spend billions for this franchise, this is literally the make or break decision for your team for the next 3-4 years. I would absolutely want to be in the know. Just have to have the humility that you don’t know what you don’t know, however.
"Humility" and "billionaire" are two traits not often seen together. Insert Jerry Jones photo.
I guess I'd have no problem if he was back briefed on the interviews or watching the recording after the fact. I think it crosses into interference when he's sitting in on the actual interview real time. The player, scouting staff and GM can't help but be influenced with the big guy in the room.
Re: 2024 Draft Discussion
Posted: 29 Feb 2024 09:49
by Pckfn23
Trading picks for players:
Re: 2024 Draft Discussion
Posted: 29 Feb 2024 11:13
by BF004
Trading a pick for a player almost always seems like a bad idea to me. In theory.
Like why trade for Tee Higgins AND give a fair market contract to him, when you can get a WR in FA AND keep the picks.
However, good WRs haven’t been hitting FA, at least recently.
I remember when the Chiefs gave up that first for Frank Clark a few years back and gave him a contract (granted they traded Dee Ford for a 2nd).
But they could have just signed any of Preston Smith, ZaDarius Smith or Trey Flowers, for a similar contract, and kept their first.
Guess i kind of don’t get it if already at fair market price, I would want at minimum one more year of rookie deal left, ala AJ Brown, to at least make preferable to an URFA contract.
But again, guys like Davante and AJ Brown and even Tee Higgins aren’t often floating around FA. So in theory I guess, but get and FA and a draft pick for me.
Re: 2024 Draft Discussion
Posted: 29 Feb 2024 11:21
by lupedafiasco
I think trading rounds 3 and on is fine. Trading 1sts and 2nds are dumb unless hes an absolute god.
I think trading rounds 3 and on is fine. Trading 1sts and 2nds are dumb unless hes an absolute god.
most of em are, imo it's absolutely about a GM liking a player he's trading for over who he can get in UFA, didn't we trade picks for Woodson?
to me your trading hope, for established, top 30 picks still bust or play below pick slot value 40% of the time. (estimate)
people like hoping, and the unknown, over someone who's ceiling has been established, it's the dream of a super duper one of a kind stud that keeps our attention on the first day or two of the draft, we are addicted to that, it's like crack to a junky
I think trading rounds 3 and on is fine. Trading 1sts and 2nds are dumb unless hes an absolute god.
most of em are, imo it's absolutely about a GM liking a player he's trading for over who he can get in UFA, didn't we trade picks for Woodson?
to me your trading hope, for established, top 30 picks still bust or play below pick slot value 40% of the time. (estimate)
people like hoping, and the unknown, over someone who's ceiling has been established, it's the dream of a super duper one of a kind stud that keeps our attention on the first day or two of the draft, we are addicted to that, it's like crack to a junky
Woodson was a FA. In 2021 the Packers traded for Randall Cobb straight up for a 6th. We swapped a 6th for a 7th round pick for Bojorquez. We also traded Josh Jackson for Isaac Yiadom. Since 2021 we havent traded for anyone.
How much do you think a player like Zach Moss would cost? Would it make sense to replace Dillon with one of these free agent RBs? I really think you maximize Jones' impact by giving him a "thunder" counterpart. Or do we just draft Braelon Allen and consider it covered?
I quoted @mnkcarp from the 2024 FA thread but the response fits better here.
Braelon Allen alternative:
I had him iny last mock. Big dude that actually moves and is explosive. Really like his no bs style.
On a different topic. I know rakestraw is a fan fav but reading his list of injuries really worries me.
Arnold and Wiggins are more then likely gone but Mitchell would be my next choice. He's a dog
Re: 2024 Draft Discussion
Posted: 02 Mar 2024 14:16
by mnkcarp
Estime was slow on the 40 (4.71) with an unspectacular 1.58 on the 10yd split. Might have lost some ground there. I still think Braelon Allen is the better back, but I don't see any 40/10yd times on him. Apparently, he put up a 4.4 forty with a 1.49 split last year, and claims to be leaner and faster this year, although heavier. I really like the idea of a beast like him in the backfield, but only if he has the wheels and burst to get out of there and to the second level, where he will mow people down. He took a step in pass protection in 2023 and I really like that.
Otherwise, both of these backs look good if we're concerned about thunder, and both will probably be available on day 2.
Some interesting speedier guys, but very few that have had much of a workload. Trey Benson made some money at the combine, I think, but he is another of the speedier guys with no record of heavy usage. Seems like he has the perfect body for it, though, and his yards per attempt (6.1 over his college career) and yards per catch (11.2) look real nice.
The rest of the fastest guys seem old, with really late breakout ages, and I'm not sure what to make of that. The good news is, they'll be around a little later in the draft.
Estime was slow on the 40 (4.71) with an unspectacular 1.58 on the 10yd split. Might have lost some ground there. I still think Braelon Allen is the better back, but I don't see any 40/10yd times on him. Apparently, he put up a 4.4 forty with a 1.49 split last year, and claims to be leaner and faster this year, although heavier. I really like the idea of a beast like him in the backfield, but only if he has the wheels and burst to get out of there and to the second level, where he will mow people down. He took a step in pass protection in 2023 and I really like that.
Otherwise, both of these backs look good if we're concerned about thunder, and both will probably be available on day 2.
Some interesting speedier guys, but very few that have had much of a workload. Trey Benson made some money at the combine, I think, but he is another of the speedier guys with no record of heavy usage. Seems like he has the perfect body for it, though, and his yards per attempt (6.1 over his college career) and yards per catch (11.2) look real nice.
The rest of the fastest guys seem old, with really late breakout ages, and I'm not sure what to make of that. The good news is, they'll be around a little later in the draft.
Yea that slow
Re: 2024 Draft Discussion
Posted: 05 Mar 2024 07:18
by APB
I know WR isn't a need pick in this draft but there's a guy I've been looking at that just seems to me to be a perfect compliment to the guys already on the roster. Hailing from Sterling Sharpe's alma mater, he reminds me of him...only faster. A tough outside SOB who plays bigger than what he measures.
I'm torn on Legette. He is exactly the type of guy I have been looking at for a while--the thicker WR who has the skills to play conventionally AND/OR be a gadget guy. Now, I think Reed is that guy for us even though he's not thicker/bigger, but I do like the profile of Legette.
But because he comes from South Carolina and because of his thickness and athleticism he's been compared to Deebo Samuel a TON and the reviews are that he's just not that guy and to hope for that guy is to get disappointed. So then you're looking at a poor man's Deebo Samuel--someone like Deebo but not as special. And what, really, is that?
Is he useful and have an appealing overall profile? Yes. Is he a guy who is likely to be good and interesting but not game-changing at a position where our roster is loaded? Yeah, to me he is. And for me I'm just not sure the juice is worth the squeeze on expending that capital to get him. If Melton hadn't emerged and we were still in need of a secondary speed element, I'd be much higher on this kid as a fit. But I just can't get excited about him for us, even though I think he's a fun and useful NFL football player.
All that said, to each their own. I have a strange soft spot for AD Mitchell out of Texas and a lot of what I've said here (not stylistically, just in terms of being a guy who adds some things but not necessarily things we don't already have) applies there, as well. So I support your emerging draft crush.
~*~*~*~
unrelated, but on the topic of emerging draft crushes... I'm really gravitating toward Graham Barton and his maxed out versatility for us. He would quickly be one of the best 5 OLmen, and he could slot in at either OG or C (or maybe even stay at OT if needed due to injury or whatever) to get those best five on the field without moving our impressive young OTs. But in my head he should be a guy you take at 41 and it feels/sounds/seems a lot like he's a guy we'd have to take at 25 if we want to get him.
Re: 2024 Draft Discussion
Posted: 05 Mar 2024 08:38
by BF004
I feel like Graham Barton has been our most likely pick for like a month, lol.
Lot about it always made a tons of sense.
His combine measurements tell me he is most likely a guard at the next level.
I feel like Graham Barton has been our most likely pick for like a month, lol.
Lot about it always made a tons of sense.
His combine measurements tell me he is most likely a guard at the next level.
I think Bartons best position is probably going to end up being C and then LG. Hes gone 3 straight years at LT and played C as a freshman for a handful of games. Still its a positions hes not refined on at the college level. I dont think that makes him worth a 1st. However in the 2nd I am in on drafting him.
From there you figure out where the biggest dropoff is between Myers or Rhyan. From what I've seen so far I dont know if you can keep Rhyan on the field. Myers is inconsistent in the run game for sure but at least he protects well. Rhyan is inconsistent everywhere but maybe year 3 things click for him.
Alex is so obvious, I like Rakestraw, I think Dejean, Wiggins, Arnold and Mitchell will go prior to our pick.