Packers Huddle

Yoop wrote: ↑

07 Dec 2024 10:21

Labrev wrote: ↑

07 Dec 2024 10:15

The defense performed pretty well on paper for the most part, but our inability to defend the middle is an Achilles heal. People think it's because we are weak at CB, which is partly true, but we also lack the LB personnel needed to do so, too. I like McDuffie and Wilson, but they can be picked on in coverage. Walker has the athleticism to be pretty solid in coverage, but probably not who you want going up against St. Brown.

The good news is, the solution is on our roster, they just need to get healthy: getting back Jaire and Cooper. And for that matter, Williams, and Bullard. It went from bad to worse with those injuries.

Also yeah, a more disruptive pass-rush would be nice, but I think we kind of have what we have there.

Sorry yoop, we need to draft for defense in April.

don't be sorry, I'am already on board with using first 2 picks on CB's, I wanted one in first 3 rounds in the last draft

Remember Edwards, Vinson and McKenzie in 1999. Along with Clete Hunt, Josh Bidwell, and some 7th rounder named Donald Driver. McKenzie was the best DB drafted that year. Edwards and Vinson never excelled.

RingoCStarrQB wrote: ↑

07 Dec 2024 14:36

Yoop wrote: ↑

07 Dec 2024 10:21

Labrev wrote: ↑

07 Dec 2024 10:15

The defense performed pretty well on paper for the most part, but our inability to defend the middle is an Achilles heal. People think it's because we are weak at CB, which is partly true, but we also lack the LB personnel needed to do so, too. I like McDuffie and Wilson, but they can be picked on in coverage. Walker has the athleticism to be pretty solid in coverage, but probably not who you want going up against St. Brown.

The good news is, the solution is on our roster, they just need to get healthy: getting back Jaire and Cooper. And for that matter, Williams, and Bullard. It went from bad to worse with those injuries.

Also yeah, a more disruptive pass-rush would be nice, but I think we kind of have what we have there.

Sorry yoop, we need to draft for defense in April.

don't be sorry, I'am already on board with using first 2 picks on CB's, I wanted one in first 3 rounds in the last draft

Remember Edwards, Vinson and McKenzie in 1999. Along with Clete Hunt, Josh Bidwell, and some 7th rounder named Donald Driver. McKenzie was the best DB drafted that year. Edwards and Vinson never excelled.

old Ron Wolf figured, well we need two, so I'll take 3 we ended up with a great starter in McKenzie, and traded Vincent which I believe was the pick used to draft Mathews, Old Ronny could wheel and deal

this grabed my eye this morning, it explains our dilemma Thursday, we needed a 5th pass rusher, and Goff took advantage of the space it provided him. ouch, there's more, and some of it good

14-for-17: Jared Goff targeting in-breaking routes, per Next Gen Stats. His 14 completions resulted in 152 passing yards and two touchdowns. The Lions tore into the Packers defense with dig routes. Often forced to blitz inside linebackers, the Packers left huge open spaces in coverage in the middle of the field and the Lions took advantage over and over again. Isaiah McDuffie, Eric Wilson and Quay Walker were charged with giving up 16 completions.

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/5-stats-kn ... 00715.html

Yoop wrote: ↑

08 Dec 2024 07:37

RingoCStarrQB wrote: ↑

07 Dec 2024 14:36

Yoop wrote: ↑

07 Dec 2024 10:21

don't be sorry, I'am already on board with using first 2 picks on CB's, I wanted one in first 3 rounds in the last draft

Remember Edwards, Vinson and McKenzie in 1999. Along with Clete Hunt, Josh Bidwell, and some 7th rounder named Donald Driver. McKenzie was the best DB drafted that year. Edwards and Vinson never excelled.

old Ron Wolf figured, well we need two, so I'll take 3 we ended up with a great starter in McKenzie, and traded Vincent which I believe was the pick used to draft Mathews, Old Ronny could wheel and deal

Nope, not Clay.

Fred Vinson was a terrific pick. Not in the sense of plays he made for us, though.

He was the player traded away to acquire Ahman Green.

APB wrote: ↑

08 Dec 2024 08:47

Yoop wrote: ↑

08 Dec 2024 07:37

RingoCStarrQB wrote: ↑

07 Dec 2024 14:36

Remember Edwards, Vinson and McKenzie in 1999. Along with Clete Hunt, Josh Bidwell, and some 7th rounder named Donald Driver. McKenzie was the best DB drafted that year. Edwards and Vinson never excelled.

old Ron Wolf figured, well we need two, so I'll take 3 we ended up with a great starter in McKenzie, and traded Vincent which I believe was the pick used to draft Mathews, Old Ronny could wheel and deal

Nope, not Clay.

Fred Vinson was a terrific pick. Not in the sense of plays he made for us, though.

He was the player traded away to acquire Ahman Green.

thanks for the Ahman Green correction, as to Vincent being a great pick, very debatable, he started 1 game for us and went on to injury with Seattle and that is the NFL career for him, that what I thought I remembered, but checked to be sure, tough and short career for him, Green ended up a franchise RB for us.

Ahman Green (above), a former third-round pick from Nebraska, had fallen out of favor with Seattle head coach Mike Holmgren because of his frequent fumbling. Holmgren, the former Green Bay head coach who’d led the 1996 Packers to the Super Bowl XXXI title, had the dual role of coach and general manager and decided to move Green to his old team. It proved to be a colossal mistake.

Fred Vinson, a 1999 second-round draft pick from Vanderbilt, suffered a torn ACL in his knee while playing basketball during training camp that summer and missed the entire 2000 season. He never played a snap for the Seahawks and his NFL career consisted of the 14 tackles, two interceptions and one sack he’d had for the Packers in 1999.

Holy Smolly, another painful reminder of our ineptness against the blue team, by our friend Pete, plenty of work ahead of us.

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/packers-fi ... 12258.html

Yoop wrote: ↑

08 Dec 2024 09:48

APB wrote: ↑

08 Dec 2024 08:47

Yoop wrote: ↑

08 Dec 2024 07:37

old Ron Wolf figured, well we need two, so I'll take 3 we ended up with a great starter in McKenzie, and traded Vincent which I believe was the pick used to draft Mathews, Old Ronny could wheel and deal

Nope, not Clay.

Fred Vinson was a terrific pick. Not in the sense of plays he made for us, though.

He was the player traded away to acquire Ahman Green.

thanks for the Ahman Green correction, as to Vincent being a great pick, very debatable, he started 1 game for us and went on to injury with Seattle and that is the NFL career for him, that what I thought I remembered, but checked to be sure, tough and short career for him, Green ended up a franchise RB for us.

Ahman Green (above), a former third-round pick from Nebraska, had fallen out of favor with Seattle head coach Mike Holmgren because of his frequent fumbling. Holmgren, the former Green Bay head coach who’d led the 1996 Packers to the Super Bowl XXXI title, had the dual role of coach and general manager and decided to move Green to his old team. It proved to be a colossal mistake.

Fred Vinson, a 1999 second-round draft pick from Vanderbilt, suffered a torn ACL in his knee while playing basketball during training camp that summer and missed the entire 2000 season. He never played a snap for the Seahawks and his NFL career consisted of the 14 tackles, two interceptions and one sack he’d had for the Packers in 1999.

You completely misread my post and the point I was making about Vinson.

Vinson had enough apparent trade value to allow us to acquire Ahman Green. Nothing to do with how he played for us or them. That pick, Fred Vinson, eventually turned into a Packer stud, Ahman Green. Simple thing.

Pass rushers wouldn't have mattered Thursday. Goff got the ball out quick all night. I was disappointed our d-line didn't bat any passes down. Need some of those against those quick passes. Difference between Love and Goff is Goff could care less about the deep ball. He played like Brady, knew exactly where he was going with the ball on pre snap.

I think on offense we need to make sure Reed is involved every game. He's the guy who can help dictate coverages much like Nukua does for the Rams.

packman114 wrote: ↑

08 Dec 2024 16:56

Goff could care less about the deep ball. He played like Brady, knew exactly where he was going with the ball on pre snap.

over the middle. They attacked McDuffie, Wilson and some at Quay too - and it worked.

Hurry back Cooper, Packers need ya

From Zach Kruse:

"Since the Packers traded Preston Smith, Lukas Van Ness has an 18% pass-rush win rate overall, 28.6% pass-rush win rate in "true pass sets"
and a 89.1 PFF pass-rush grade. Across 52 pass-rush snaps and 4 games. He might be ready for a bigger role ? "

Van Ness just passed Preston for snap counts too, as of now he's had 3rd most DE snaps in 2024
And he's doing much better using his hands to fight off the OL...

https://www.footballguys.com/stats/snap ... &year=2024

LVN has just 3 sacks on the season. https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/stats/pla ... descending

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... nNLu00.htm

The 3 sacks ties LVN with Blake Cashman and Eric Kendricks (the Vikings and Cowboys middle linebackers, respectively) and numerous others for 105th place in the NFL.

PFF seems to have mistakenly credited him with 4 sacks.

https://www.pff.com/nfl/players/lukas-v ... adesWidget

In any event, PFF also gives LVN a 45.1 run grade, which puts him at 182nd out of 201 graded players.

The team has a dire need at edge and I certainly hope LVN gets every opportunity the rest of this season to demonstrate why Green Bay believed him worthy of the 13th overall pick in the 2023 draft.

However, the best I can say about LVN's play to date is that it has been underwhelming.

LombardiTime wrote: ↑

10 Dec 2024 17:48

LVN has just 3 sacks on the season. https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/stats/pla ... descending

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... nNLu00.htm

The 3 sacks ties LVN with Blake Cashman and Eric Kendricks (the Vikings and Cowboys middle linebackers, respectively) and numerous others for 105th place in the NFL.

PFF seems to have mistakenly credited him with 4 sacks.

https://www.pff.com/nfl/players/lukas-v ... adesWidget

In any event, PFF also gives LVN a 45.1 run grade, which puts him at 182nd out of 201 graded players.

The team has a dire need at edge and I certainly hope LVN gets every opportunity the rest of this season to demonstrate why Green Bay believed him worthy of the 13th overall pick in the 2023 draft.

However, the best I can say about LVN's play to date is that it has been underwhelming.

I think his increase is a reflection of draft status as much as production because Enagbare has done just as well, but hope LVN can continue to improve, ya need at least 3 good edge rushers anyway.

Yeah, it’s a problem…

But then there’s this….

thanks for sharing

I think that's what we've seen, an emphasis on containment and gap control, some improved tackling ability from safety/lber, now if we could just improve interior pass coverage

I was watching this video highlight of mic’d up Matthew Stafford against the Bills from last week and couldn’t help but notice how many times I saw flashes of Rasul Douglas beaten in coverage.



Out of curiosity, I went to PFF to see what kind of season he’s having.




Zero INTs. Below average coverage grade. Very few spark plays.

There’s been a bunch of talk this year bemoaning the trade of Rasul Douglas last year. Hell, I’ve been among those missing him. But I think maybe we’re missing the Ghost of (Rasul Douglas) Christmas Past. Sul isn’t the player he once was as a Packer.

Maybe Gute and Co saw something the rest of us didn’t. Maybe we just caught lightening in a bottle with him and he’s now reverted back to being just a guy we plucked off a practice squad who balled out when given an opportunity.

Whatever the case, it doesn’t appear Douglas would’ve been the missing piece for this defense this year.

Just a thought as I watched the video…

APB wrote: ↑

11 Dec 2024 20:34

I was watching this video highlight of mic’d up Matthew Stafford against the Bills from last week and couldn’t help but notice how many times I saw flashes of Rasul Douglas beaten in coverage.



Out of curiosity, I went to PFF to see what kind of season he’s having.



IMG_0256.jpeg

IMG_0257.jpeg



Zero INTs. Below average coverage grade. Very few spark plays.

There’s been a bunch of talk this year bemoaning the trade of Rasul Douglas last year. Hell, I’ve been among those missing him. But I think maybe we’re missing the Ghost of (Rasul Douglas) Christmas Past. Sul isn’t the player he once was as a Packer.

Maybe Gute and Co saw something the rest of us didn’t. Maybe we just caught lightening in a bottle with him and he’s now reverted back to being just a guy we plucked off a practice squad who balled out when given an opportunity.

Whatever the case, it doesn’t appear Douglas would’ve been the missing piece for this defense this year.

Just a thought as I watched the video…

yep looks like getting beat on every pass, less support from safeties, not as productive as last season, but still listed as the bills #1 CB, I don't have a pff subscription, so I have to rely on fantasy football and other free places, so here ya go, you'll like reading about how good we are at #8 , so take this info with a bit of skeptism, my point is that Douglas may be more exposed if doesn't have over the top support, it states these are mid season grades, so I expect around game 9 or so.

12. Buffalo Bills
CB1: Rasul Douglas, CB2: Christian Benford, CB3: Taron Johnson*, FS: Taylor Rapp, SS: Damar Hamlin
Preseason Rank: 12

Buffalo has gotten strong play from their cornerback group to start the year. Christian Benford (75.8 PFF grade) is allowing just 51.9% of the passes against him to be completed to start the season. Rasul Douglas is struggling to regain his lockdown form from 2023 but still has a respectable 63.2 coverage grade in 2024.

Buffalo let both their starting safeties walk in free agency. Their replacements have not been as dependable, but they’re playing fine. Taylor Rapp (60.4 PFF grade) and Damar Hamlin (60.5 PFF grade) have combined for 71 tackles, nine pass breakups and two interceptions to start the year.

FTN Stat to Know: Buffalo has the lowest contested target rate this season (5.6%).

https://ftnfantasy.com/nfl/2024-seconda ... -midseason

APB wrote: ↑

11 Dec 2024 20:34

Zero INTs. Below average coverage grade. Very few spark plays.

There’s been a bunch of talk this year bemoaning the trade of Rasul Douglas last year. Hell, I’ve been among those missing him. But I think maybe we’re missing the Ghost of (Rasul Douglas) Christmas Past. Sul isn’t the player he once was as a Packer.

Maybe Gute and Co saw something the rest of us didn’t. Maybe we just caught lightening in a bottle with him and he’s now reverted back to being just a guy we plucked off a practice squad who balled out when given an opportunity.

Whatever the case, it doesn’t appear Douglas would’ve been the missing piece for this defense this year.

Ive been saying that was a great trade. Of all the things people avoid bashing Gutenbumst about they choose to get mad over getting a 3rd round pick for a subpar CB when we were in cap trouble... For the life of me Ill never understand.

Carrington Valentine has quietly been putting together a decent year. You don't hear his name much which is frankly a good thing for a corner.

lupedafiasco wrote: ↑

12 Dec 2024 08:30

APB wrote: ↑

11 Dec 2024 20:34

Zero INTs. Below average coverage grade. Very few spark plays.

There’s been a bunch of talk this year bemoaning the trade of Rasul Douglas last year. Hell, I’ve been among those missing him. But I think maybe we’re missing the Ghost of (Rasul Douglas) Christmas Past. Sul isn’t the player he once was as a Packer.

Maybe Gute and Co saw something the rest of us didn’t. Maybe we just caught lightening in a bottle with him and he’s now reverted back to being just a guy we plucked off a practice squad who balled out when given an opportunity.

Whatever the case, it doesn’t appear Douglas would’ve been the missing piece for this defense this year.

Ive been saying that was a great trade. Of all the things people avoid bashing Gutenbumst about they choose to get mad over getting a 3rd round pick for a subpar CB when we were in cap trouble... For the life of me Ill never understand.

we never even came close to replacing his production, and Douglas was lock down good last year, and even now as good as anyone we have besides glass when and if he's healthy, which he rarely is, that was a terrible trade by Gumbust.

The Bills let there starting safeties go to UFA, I think that plays into the decline this season for Douglas.