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Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 09:41
by RingoCStarrQB
Yup. Block for the kid and he'll make All-Pro.
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 09:44
by Labrev
Because, Dusty, it forces the defense to honor the run rather than just tee off on the QB and drop guys back. And it helps shorten the field to make converting on downs more manageable, rather than 3rd-and-21 and other such nonsense that resulted from MLF's Madden gameplan.
For all those complaining about a lack of toughness/intensity, running the ball also allows you to set the tone, your big uglies go on the offensive rather than stand back and protect. It is said that our D players internalize the passive gameplan that Barry calls. Well, it's the same on O.
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 09:45
by Labrev
Their RB, Montgomery, was not running the ball that well (3.8 ypc). Yet as fans, it felt like they were running even better than that, because some of the 3.8 are very small gains, but others are 7 or 8 yard runs, and that helps them set up the pass.
In Dan Campbell's place, MLF would not have run half as much. He'd have thought, "meh, only 3.8 ypc, our run is bad, but we have Goff and St. Brown and other guys who catch, obviously we need to pass."
DET has done some fine team-building but GB is still a way more talented team. Switch the coaches around and GB wins bigger than DET did.
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 09:46
by lulu
RingoCStarrQB wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 09:15
Yoop wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 08:09
APB wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 07:22
Regarding the criticism of Nixon and the kickoff return team in general.
Packers starting position following Detroit kickoffs:
On the opening kickoff after halftime, Nixon broke a 41 yd return but it was called back for holding and the drive started at the 14.
Overall, I'm seeing a mix of touchbacks and returns that, unless there's a penalty, net near the same as a touchback. Yeah, there's certainly room for overall improvement, especially with the penalties, but I'd just as soon see Nixon continue to be aggressive with bringing them out with the hopes he breaks one...and it not be called back.
another way to look at it is we gave up 43 yrds of field position by Nixon running them out, if our blocking isn't opening up run lanes, which it isn't doing well, and players are causing penalties, then maybe the smart move is to just take the touch backs till we can get that right.
Nope. 43 yards is insignificant in the grand scheme of a 60 minute game. And the sizzle/spark factor that happens when Nixon breaks one supersedes any and all 25 yard line or less starting position statistics. We'll take any and all sparks that we can muster up
Putting your offense in a hole by starting behind the 20 is a recipe for disaster. Until you have things sorted out, take the knee and start from the 25.
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 09:49
by Pckfn23
Labrev wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 09:44
Because, Dusty, it forces the defense to honor the run rather than just tee off on the QB and drop guys back. And it helps shorten the field to make converting on downs more manageable, rather than 3rd-and-21 and other such nonsense that resulted from MLF's Madden gameplan.
For all those complaining about a lack of toughness/intensity, running the ball also allows you to set the tone, your big uglies go on the offensive rather than stand back and protect. It is said that our D players internalize the passive gameplan that Barry calls. Well, it's the same on O.
To a point yes, but at the same time a team that has sucked at running the ball, but been good at pass blocking probably does want to err on the side of passing the ball. Yes, we probably needed to run at least once on that 2nd set of downs. At the same time when we went to run our 11th offensive play we were down 24-3. It got bad IN A HURRY.
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 09:54
by Pckfn23
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 10:00
by Labrev
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 09:49
To a point yes, but at the same time a team that has sucked at running the ball, but been good at pass blocking probably does want to err on the side of passing the ball.
We have been good in pass-pro, but did he seriously believe we would pass block just as well against Hutchinson as the previous opponents (who had no one of his caliber) with an OL now starting Royce Newman, Tom possibly banged up?
MLF severely underestimated the opponent. Inexcusable.
Also, you're not gonna get better at running the ball by doing less of it, you are going to just get even worse.
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 10:04
by Pckfn23
Labrev wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 10:00
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 09:49
To a point yes, but at the same time a team that has sucked at running the ball, but been good at pass blocking probably does want to err on the side of passing the ball.
We have been good in pass-pro, but did he seriously believe we would pass block just as well against Hutchinson as the previous opponents (who had no one of his caliber) with an OL now starting Royce Newman, Tom possibly banged up?
MLF severely underestimated the opponent. Inexcusable.
I don't disagree, but I also don't think running the ball more in the first 11 balls was going to our panacea. We were not prepared for what they brought, not by a long shot.
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 10:09
by Pugger
texas wrote: ↑28 Sep 2023 23:41
Hard to get any running game going when you go 3 and out repeatedly. Hard to get anything going really.
After that early INT we didn't even attempt to run the ball so it hard to get a running game going when you don't try.
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 10:11
by Yoop
Lafleur you suck, Barry u suck too, Gutekunst sucks for not drafting some Guards, Rich for god sakes tell Nixon to take a knee,
plenty of blame to share by all
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 10:11
by lulu
Labrev wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 09:45
Their RB, Montgomery, was not running the ball that well (3.8 ypc). Yet as fans, it felt like they were running even better than that, because some of the 3.8 are very small gains, but others are 7 or 8 yard runs, and that helps them set up the pass.
In Dan Campbell's place, MLF would not have run half as much. He'd have thought, "meh, only 3.8 ypc, our run is bad, but we have Goff and St. Brown and other guys who catch, obviously we need to pass."
DET has done some fine team-building but GB is still a way more talented team. Switch the coaches around and GB wins bigger than DET did.
I'll take the Lions roster over the Packers every day of the week. The downside of this is my team would have to suck ass for a long time to amass the draft capital to construct said roster.
And if you disagree then you're not allowed to bitch about Gutey and how he constructs our roster.
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 10:12
by RingoCStarrQB
lulu wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 09:46
RingoCStarrQB wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 09:15
Yoop wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 08:09
another way to look at it is we gave up 43 yrds of field position by Nixon running them out, if our blocking isn't opening up run lanes, which it isn't doing well, and players are causing penalties, then maybe the smart move is to just take the touch backs till we can get that right.
Nope. 43 yards is insignificant in the grand scheme of a 60 minute game. And the sizzle/spark factor that happens when Nixon breaks one supersedes any and all 25 yard line or less starting position statistics. We'll take any and all sparks that we can muster up
Putting your offense in a hole by starting behind the 20 is a recipe for disaster. Until you have things sorted out, take the knee and start from the 25.
Nope! Our offense isn't working regardless of field position and therefore there is no hope of sorting anything out anyway with LaFleur and Barry running the show. I'll take the spark and sizzle and momentum changing possibilities from a Nixon runback over some measly inconsequential field position argument all day and night long.
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 10:15
by Pugger
APB wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 07:01
From
Bill Huber's post-game write-up addressing Aaron Jones' use in the offense:
After Rudy Ford opened the game with an interception, the Packers started at Detroit’s 16. Jordan Love, with nobody open and under duress, threw a ball toward Jones on first down. On second down, Love was sacked. On third-and-19, Love completed a short pass to Romeo Doubs to set up a field goal.
After Detroit answered with a touchdown, Love was sacked on first down and threw incomplete on second- and third-and-16.
After Detroit scored another touchdown, LaFleur did run the ball. Though not with Jones. AJ Dillon gained 7 yards on two carries and Love threw incomplete with pressure in his face on third-and-3.
After Detroit tacked on a field goal to lead 17-3, Love’s first pass of the ensuing possession was tipped and intercepted. Two plays later, Detroit was in the end zone and celebrating a 24-3 lead.
Not even 17 minutes into the game, the NFC North showdown essentially was over by technical knockout without Jones getting the ball a single time.
Finally, on the first play of Green Bay’s fifth possession, Jones took the handoff and fought for 5 yards. The crowd cheered sarcastically. On second down, LaFleur for the second time this season rolled out an old-school quarterback option. For the second time this season, the play was blown up. Love flipped the ball to Jones, who was blasted by cornerback Cam Sutton for a loss of 2. Love threw incomplete on third down.
I mean, post-injury or not, that's just not winning football. MLF relents not being able to run the ball yet he didn't even try, and when he did, he trotted out his plodder back Dillon. The game was well out of hand by the time MLF got Jones his first touch. That's insane.
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 10:16
by Pckfn23
Drive 1: Pass, Pass, Pass, FG
Drive 2: Pass, Pass, Pass, Punt
Drive 3: Run, Run, Pass, Punt
Drive 4: Pass(INT)
Drive 5: Run, Run, Pass, Punt
I can't honestly say the biggest reason we lost last night is because we didn't run the football more. Should we have? Maybe, but it wasn't going to help with the team and mentality we brought last night.
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 10:18
by Labrev
lulu wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 10:11
Labrev wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 09:45
Their RB, Montgomery, was not running the ball that well (3.8 ypc). Yet as fans, it felt like they were running even better than that, because some of the 3.8 are very small gains, but others are 7 or 8 yard runs, and that helps them set up the pass.
In Dan Campbell's place, MLF would not have run half as much. He'd have thought, "meh, only 3.8 ypc, our run is bad, but we have Goff and St. Brown and other guys who catch, obviously we need to pass."
DET has done some fine team-building but GB is still a way more talented team. Switch the coaches around and GB wins bigger than DET did.
I'll take the Lions roster over the Packers every day of the week. The downside of this is my team would have to suck ass for a long time to amass the draft capital to construct said roster.
And if you disagree then you're not allowed to bitch about Gutey and how he constructs our roster.
I disagree.
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 10:21
by Yoop
Pugger wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 10:09
texas wrote: ↑28 Sep 2023 23:41
Hard to get any running game going when you go 3 and out repeatedly. Hard to get anything going really.
After that early INT we didn't even attempt to run the ball so it hard to get a running game going when you don't try.
I guess the only people that didn't know it would be a track meet was us, right from Detroits first drive we should have known we'd be playing catch up.
as was reported Jones was having his legs wrapped right from the beginning, and probably why Dillon got the first handoff.
Lafleur new we couldn't run our way back into this game, he had to abandon the run to win the game last week, why would he have faith that Dillon or the banged up Jones could this week
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 10:24
by Pckfn23
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 10:28
by Pugger
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 09:49
Labrev wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 09:44
Because, Dusty, it forces the defense to honor the run rather than just tee off on the QB and drop guys back. And it helps shorten the field to make converting on downs more manageable, rather than 3rd-and-21 and other such nonsense that resulted from MLF's Madden gameplan.
For all those complaining about a lack of toughness/intensity, running the ball also allows you to set the tone, your big uglies go on the offensive rather than stand back and protect. It is said that our D players internalize the passive gameplan that Barry calls. Well, it's the same on O.
To a point yes, but at the same time a team that has sucked at running the ball, but been good at pass blocking probably does want to err on the side of passing the ball. Yes, we probably needed to run at least once on that 2nd set of downs. At the same time when we went to run our 11th offensive play we were down 24-3. It got bad IN A HURRY.
Yes, in the past we were good at pass blocking. But with the guys we used last night? Yikes.
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 10:33
by Yoop
Labrev wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 09:45
Their RB, Montgomery, was not running the ball that well (3.8 ypc). Yet as fans, it felt like they were running even better than that, because some of the 3.8 are very small gains, but others are 7 or 8 yard runs, and that helps them set up the pass.
In Dan Campbell's place, MLF would not have run half as much. He'd have thought, "meh, only 3.8 ypc, our run is bad, but we have Goff and St. Brown and other guys who catch, obviously we need to pass."
DET has done some fine team-building but GB is still a way more talented team. Switch the coaches around and GB wins bigger than DET did.
your just complaining to complain, you have NO IDEA what Lafleur would do, he has run and continued to run the ball when we only where getting 3.? ypc, your problem is it's happened so seldom you just can't remember, me either actually but it has happened, Lafleur is a run first coach, and you know it, so quit spouting these non sensical complaints.
we couldn't block the flight of a feather last night, in pass pro or the run, at least not consistently enough to depend on either, people are sitting here looking for someone to blame, while Guty does this
ahhhhhh, blue light K-mart special, roster caliber crap guards discounted today, price at check out
Re: Week 4 Post-Game: Lions 34 Packers 20
Posted: 29 Sep 2023 10:33
by Pckfn23
Pugger wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 10:28
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 09:49
Labrev wrote: ↑29 Sep 2023 09:44
Because, Dusty, it forces the defense to honor the run rather than just tee off on the QB and drop guys back. And it helps shorten the field to make converting on downs more manageable, rather than 3rd-and-21 and other such nonsense that resulted from MLF's Madden gameplan.
For all those complaining about a lack of toughness/intensity, running the ball also allows you to set the tone, your big uglies go on the offensive rather than stand back and protect. It is said that our D players internalize the passive gameplan that Barry calls. Well, it's the same on O.
To a point yes, but at the same time a team that has sucked at running the ball, but been good at pass blocking probably does want to err on the side of passing the ball. Yes, we probably needed to run at least once on that 2nd set of downs. At the same time when we went to run our 11th offensive play we were down 24-3. It got bad IN A HURRY.
Yes, in the past we were good at pass blocking. But with the guys we used last night? Yikes.
Same guys we used against the Saints...