Packers Huddle

LombardiTime wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2023 09:46

APB wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2023 06:24

lupedafiasco wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2023 01:30

The only connection that matters is to LaFleur.

You may be right but I suspect organizational leadership senior to MLF has noticed his track record in hiring staff members, coordinators in particular, and will have some say in who takes over on defense, assuming Barry's contract is not renewed.

First, I hope you are correct and that someone/anyone is involved with the new DC decision-making process besides MLF because he sure F'd up the last DC decision.

Second, who do you think this "organziational leadership senior to MLF" includes, because my understanding is that only the collective Board of Directors and Team President Mark Murphy are "senior' to MLF, but I could be wrong.

Personally, i'd rather have Gute involved in the process than Murphy, but I certainly want someone questioning MLF's approach because I fear he is going to go the "safe" route with a Staley or another re-tread who motivates no one on the D.

That's exactly why I left the reference so vague. The leadership structure has become so convoluted to those outside the organization that there's no telling who is overseeing who doing what. For all we know, Russ Ball is the final stop in determining who comes and who goes.

It’s in LaFleurs contract that he has full control over his staff. I’m sure there may be some nudging but as long as the team is willing to pay a coach his salary LaFleur can hire and Fire whoever and whenever.

BF004 wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2023 11:11

wallyuwl wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2023 10:45

lupedafiasco wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2023 01:30

The only connection that matters is to LaFleur.

Yup. He has proven his #1 pre-requisite is hiring his buddies.

He’s made 6 coordinator hires.

National Hackett, never coached with LaFleur before

Shawn Mennenga, zero past coaching interactions with LaFleur

Maurice Drayton, never coached with LaFleur before 2019, internal promotion.

Joe Barry, former colleague

Adam Stenavich, never coached with LaFleur before 2019, internal promotion.

Rich Bisiaccia, no former coaching interactions.



So that’s only 1 of 6 so far that would be deemed ‘his buddy’. So not sure about what he’s proven.

Yeah, at this point I'd say the former-organizational-ties prerequisite has a much stronger influence than any MLF "buddy" hire argument.

Lafleur is really getting the heat now, not so much for hiring Barry, more so for retaining him for season 3 and not just replacing him midway of this season, nothing Matt does short of canning Barry will be met with approval, sad really after what I think has been a great job with the offense and all these rookies.

Be crazy if we win again, but the D plays like trash again.

Looking likely like we’re headed to the playoffs and give up 30+ and 400 yards again. Against a 4th string rookie QB.

Like you can’t go into the playoffs doing what we are doing, can you?

lupedafiasco wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2023 11:22

It’s in LaFleurs contract that he has full control over his staff. I’m sure there may be some nudging but as long as the team is willing to pay a coach his salary LaFleur can hire and Fire whoever and whenever.

Agreed. That said, higher leadership always keeps the right to pull MLF aside and tell him, "I know you'd like to retain Joe. But I need to let you know that if you do, then you'll be let go as well." I think that plays to realville. But I don't know if Packer leadership is strong-willed enough to do that.

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2023 15:22

lupedafiasco wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2023 11:22

It’s in LaFleurs contract that he has full control over his staff. I’m sure there may be some nudging but as long as the team is willing to pay a coach his salary LaFleur can hire and Fire whoever and whenever.

Agreed. That said, higher leadership always keeps the right to pull MLF aside and tell him, "I know you'd like to retain Joe. But I need to let you know that if you do, then you'll be let go as well." I think that plays to realville. But I don't know if Packer leadership is strong-willed enough to do that.

They aren't

Id have to think it's obvious to MLF that if he makes the call to retain Barry, he is staking his own job to to Barry. I have to think he's not dumb enough to do that.

BF004 wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2023 14:18

Be crazy if we win again, but the D plays like trash again.

Looking likely like we’re headed to the playoffs and give up 30+ and 400 yards again. Against a 4th string rookie QB.

Like you can’t go into the playoffs doing what we are doing, can you?

You can when they let half the league in.

APB wrote: ↑

27 Dec 2023 09:43

For the purpose of this discussion, let's assume Joe Barry is gone after this season.

We've been hitting on potential replacement candidates in several threads but it requires some searching. I'd like to consolidate those conversations and candidate mentions in one convenient thread. Let's hear some names and insights.

I'll offer this to begin:

https://atozsports.com/green-bay/packer ... rdinators/

The link above contains a brief description of each candidate listed below. For convenience and brevity, here are the candidates by name only:

Head coaches who were/could get fired
Dennis Allen, New Orleans Saints head coach
Matt Eberflus, Chicago Bears head coach
Brandon Staley, former Los Angeles Chargers head coach
Leslie Frazier, former Minnesota Vikings head coach
Mike Zimmer, former Minnesota Vikings head coach

Current DCs who could get fired
Ejiro Evero, Carolina Panthers defensive coordinator
Ryan Nielsen, Atlanta Falcons defensive coordinator
Patrick Graham, Las Vegas Raiders defensive coordinator
Gus Bradley, Indianapolis Colts defensive coordinator

Ascending position coaches
Jerod Mayo, New England Patriots linebackers coach
Marquand Manuel, New York Jets defensive backs/safeties coach
Chris Hewitt, Baltimore Ravens pass game coordinator/secondary coach
Ben Bloom, Cleveland Browns defensive line coach
Al Harris, Dallas Cowboys defensive backs coach
Mike Smith, Minnesota Vikings outside linebackers coach/pass rush specialist
Eric Henderson, Los Angeles Rams defensive line coach/run game coordinator
Aubrey Pleasant, Los Angeles Rams defensive backs coach/passing game coordinator
Johnny Holland, San Francisco 49ers linebackers coach

College coaches
Jim Leonhard, Illinois senior football analyst
Jesse Minter, Michigan defensive coordinator

A couple names I'd add to the list:

• Phil Snow, curent senior defensive analyst for the Bears and former DC for Carolina during the brief Matt Rhule era (2020-2022).

• Dave Aranda, current HC at Baylor University, former Badgers DC

Anybody else worth mentioning?

A lot of names to consider. Potential availability and "fit" with the Packer organization and/or players and desired scheme?

Who is your guy? Conversely, who would be a poor fit/choice?

Yes, please take Aranda off our hands. I actually have been arguing for him to get another shot at BU but I would be very surprised if he somehow turned it around. He is a great coordinator but terrible recruiter. Has not done a very good job running things as a HC. However, his Big 12 Championship in 2021 (when he had Rhule's recruits) means that he deserves at least 1 more year. But would much prefer him as Packers DC than Baylor HC.

From what I remember about Phil Snow, he was pretty good too, although if we are trying to poach Baylor coaches, the one to grab would be Art Briles even though we presumably do not need help on offense. Briles is a generational visionary on offense though. We had 1 year where we set the record for most passing yards in a bowl game... and then the next season set the record for most rushing yards in a bowl game. And then almost beat Texas while playing a WR at QB because our top 3 QBs were all out. Briles should be in the NFL imo.

Drj820 wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2023 09:52

If we hire Brandon Staley to be our DC I will have no control over how I react. I will not be responsible for the things I might do.

Why? HC != DC

I was going to say that what I don't want is one of those former player rah-rah type of coaches like Demeco Ryans or really any of the usual DCs who become a HC and then get fired after a year. I want an Xs and Os guy. Defensive coaches never work out as HC (except Belichick) because defense doesn't require the same level of mental preparation and knowledge of the game as offense. I want a guy who will innovate and understand how the game works rather than just copying what every other DC in the league does.

I was going to say all that, but then I realized that this is the type of DC that we have been hiring, going back idk as long as I can remember. And it has never worked. So $%@# it, let's go the opposite direction and hire Ray Lewis. Don't need Xs and O's, just give us a former player with a tough mentality and a basic scheme that the new DC asked ChatGPT to construct for him.

texas wrote: ↑

30 Dec 2023 16:10

Drj820 wrote: ↑

29 Dec 2023 09:52

If we hire Brandon Staley to be our DC I will have no control over how I react. I will not be responsible for the things I might do.

Why? HC != DC

Because the chargers defense has decent players and has been awful last couple of years

Oy

[mention]texas[/mention] Aranda has been my most intruiging prospect.

What defense does he run and why does Baylor not want him? Is an aggressive Mfer? Do his players like him?

go pak go wrote: ↑

01 Jan 2024 09:35

@texas Aranda has been my most intruiging prospect.

What defense does he run and why does Baylor not want him? Is an aggressive Mfer? Do his players like him?

When Gary Andersen was hired as the new Wisconsin Badgers head coach, following the 2012 football season, Aranda followed him to Wisconsin. Aranda turned down offers from Texas Tech and California.[19] Aranda changed the Badgers' base defense from a 4–3 to a 3–4 and developed a more aggressive defense, putting pressure on the quarterback.[18] His first year as defensive coordinator the Badgers defense ranked in the top 20 in all four major defensive categories; scoring defense (6th), total defense (7th), rushing defense (5th) and passing defense (17th).[20]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dave_Aranda

I have no doubt that our D will also play well next week against da Bears. If we learned anything from Joe Barry, it's that his units stink the first half of the season (or more) and then lite things up more toward the end of the season. Last night was that flicker of hope. In the past, it was enough to hope that Joe would get things running sooner the next season. But now we know better.

Time for a DC who gets the unit jacked for much more like 100% of the season.

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

01 Jan 2024 11:24

I have no doubt that our D will also play well next week against da Bears. If we learned anything from Joe Barry, it's that his units stink the first half of the season (or more) and then lite things up more toward the end of the season. Last night was that flicker of hope. In the past, it was enough to hope that Joe would get things running sooner the next season. But now we know better.

Time for a DC who gets the unit jacked for much more like 100% of the season.

Do we count December 17th and 24th as the first half of the season?

go pak go wrote: ↑

01 Jan 2024 09:35

@texas Aranda has been my most intruiging prospect.

What defense does he run and why does Baylor not want him? Is an aggressive Mfer? Do his players like him?

Under Aranda, the defense has been bad and the offense has been bad. He's really done a terrible job building a program, but he is a first time HC in an era of complete overhaul due to NIL, so it doesn't necessarily reflect on his coaching abilities. He has undoubtedly done well as a DC everywhere he has been and he is highly respected.

There is one buzzword that everyone in the media repeats about him, every game: "cerebral". All the talking heads always repeat that word for some reason and it is annoying, but what they basically mean is that he is a quiet and soft-spoken guy who knows the Xs and Os very well. He is the opposite of his predecessor, Matt Rhule, who might have been the best motivational rah-rah guy in the NFL in a while during his brief stint there. This is ostensibly the opposite of what we think we want for the Packers, because we have a problem with toughness, but his defenses haven't really been soft at all, if anything our problem is that our DBs can't cover anything.

It definitely seems like the players like him well enough. His problem seems to be on the recruitment front, which isn't an issue in the NFL so I suspect that he could do well in the NFL. He actually led us to our best season ever, in 2021, with Matt Rhule's recruits, before leading us into a very steep decline the past 2 years as his own guys came through and NIL and the transfer portal changed college athletics a lot.

My opinion this season was that he earned another year despite a terrible 2023 for the program, because it's a new era and he's still learning how to be a HC. He does seem smarter than most as well. I understand the circumstances weren't ideal and his 2021 has to count for something, and also he is the exact type of person who can learn from mistakes and adjust. But my guess is that he does not right the ship in 2024 and we part ways after a modest improvement but still disappointing season.

I think an NFL or college DC job at a big brand name school is an entirely different challenge than a HC at a smaller-money school that does not have a historic reputation or big time state funding behind it. That's why I think Matt Rhule or Art Briles were better fits for Baylor because they were all about the hype and flash and they made a huge point to network with Texas HS coaches. Aranda is none of that, he's quiet and virtuous and smart and shuns the spotlight and having to be a people person. But his results in the DC role speak for themselves, so it could be a win-win for my teams if he leaves BU to go to GB as a coordinator.

I mentioned this blurb in another thread but these are probably some names to keep an eye on should another search for a new DC take place. MLF was intrigued enough to interview them before, I’d guess there’s still some interest.

LaFleur interviewed at least nine candidates to replace Pettine. According to sources, he interviewed Barry, Leonhard, Jerry Gray (Packers defensive backs coach), Chris Kiffin (Browns defensive line coach), Ryan Nielson (Saints defensive line coach/assistant head coach), Matt Burke (Eagles defensive line/run game coordinator), Chris Harris (Washington defensive backs coach), Ejiro Evero (Rams safeties coach) and Bob Sutton (Falcons senior assistant).