General Packer News 2021

[YoHoChecko]

wild.

[paco]

wild.

Yep. Also saw a tweet that we passed the Saints for the worst cap situation for 2022. Going to be an interesting couple of years after this one.

[Half Empty]

I fully understand it can't happen, but this is another of those situations, much like some draft choices and other personnel moves, where I look at something the team does and really, really want someone there to explain it. Mostly from the standpoint of "hey, even the guys on this forum know this is untenable, what's up?". They may have something in mind, and even if it doesn't make sense to me/us, it'd be nice to know they are thinking about it.

[Drj820]

I fully understand it can't happen, but this is another of those situations, much like some draft choices and other personnel moves, where I look at something the team does and really, really want someone there to explain it. Mostly from the standpoint of "hey, even the guys on this forum know this is untenable, what's up?". They may have something in mind, and even if it doesn't make sense to me/us, it'd be nice to know they are thinking about it.

i think what they have in mind is to trade Rodgers, and Rodgers knows it..and thats why we went through the summer that we did.

[lupedafiasco]

Poor. Resource. Management.

[go pak go]

I fully understand it can't happen, but this is another of those situations, much like some draft choices and other personnel moves, where I look at something the team does and really, really want someone there to explain it. Mostly from the standpoint of "hey, even the guys on this forum know this is untenable, what's up?". They may have something in mind, and even if it doesn't make sense to me/us, it'd be nice to know they are thinking about it.

Because this is the end of this window/era.

Rodgers and Adams will be gone and we will start from scratch. It's also why Z. Smith is apparently restless because he sees too that he is an EASY cut in 2022 to save cap if the Packers want to.

The Packers will not be good in 2022. But also like...whatever. If all of these moves results in a SB, I'm happy. It's our last chance. I'm glad they are going for it.

[Drj820]

Poor. Resource. Management.

We are just paying the price now for this:

2015 draft: 0 players left on the roster
2016 draft: Kenny Clark and Dean Lowry only players left
2017 draft: Aaron Jones is only player left we enjoy having on the team, the other two players are Kevin King and Josh Jones
2018 draft: The only players we enjoy having on the team are Jaire and MVS. The other unusable players from that class that we still employ are Josh Jackson, EQ, and Oren Burks.

When you have 4 players from a 4 year draft period that you enjoy relying on and 6 total that see the field (including king and Lowry in this group), you become forced to spend of FAs and think about paying top dollar to your quality vets you cannot afford to lose.

[Yoop]

I fully understand it can't happen, but this is another of those situations, much like some draft choices and other personnel moves, where I look at something the team does and really, really want someone there to explain it. Mostly from the standpoint of "hey, even the guys on this forum know this is untenable, what's up?". They may have something in mind, and even if it doesn't make sense to me/us, it'd be nice to know they are thinking about it.

Because this is the end of this window/era.

Rodgers and Adams will be gone and we will start from scratch. It's also why Z. Smith is apparently restless because he sees too that he is an EASY cut in 2022 to save cap if the Packers want to.

The Packers will not be good in 2022. But also like...whatever. If all of these moves results in a SB, I'm happy. It's our last chance. I'm glad they are going for it.

spot on, kicking the finances can down the road to retain this roster is smart, most likely next year will see a bunch of these players being let go and the ability to even make the playoffs is up in the air, and we'll be rebuilding several positions, it would be crazy not to go for it all this season.

[go pak go]

I think the cap is much more about the Packers being a consistent top 4 roster 3 years in a row and trying to maintain it.

The Chiefs are the only other team in this category but they have a cheap QB.

That's why we are the worst positioned team on the cap. Even stuff like the 2015 poor draft class is starting to lose its significance because that draft is well into its 2nd contracts now.

We are poor in cap position moving forward because we have been good and are trying to stay good with a QB who is the highest or close to in the league.

If you want to go "all in" then understand the price of going "all in"

Honestly you want to look at a team with poor resource management? Look at Chicago. They are in cap hell this year. (look decent in 2022 but it's because they have no players under contract) and worst of all....nothing to show for it.

[go pak go]

I fully understand it can't happen, but this is another of those situations, much like some draft choices and other personnel moves, where I look at something the team does and really, really want someone there to explain it. Mostly from the standpoint of "hey, even the guys on this forum know this is untenable, what's up?". They may have something in mind, and even if it doesn't make sense to me/us, it'd be nice to know they are thinking about it.

Because this is the end of this window/era.

Rodgers and Adams will be gone and we will start from scratch. It's also why Z. Smith is apparently restless because he sees too that he is an EASY cut in 2022 to save cap if the Packers want to.

The Packers will not be good in 2022. But also like...whatever. If all of these moves results in a SB, I'm happy. It's our last chance. I'm glad they are going for it.

spot on, kicking the finances can down the road to retain this roster is smart, most likely next year will see a bunch of these players being let go and the ability to even make the playoffs is up in the air, and we'll be rebuilding several positions, it would be crazy not to go for it all this season.

Holy crap. We are in agreement.

[Drj820]

I think the cap is much more about the Packers being a consistent top 4 roster 3 years in a row and trying to maintain it.

The Chiefs are the only other team in this category but they have a cheap QB.

That's why we are the worst positioned team on the cap. Even stuff like the 2015 poor draft class is starting to lose its significance because that draft is well into its 2nd contracts now.

We are poor in cap position moving forward because we have been good and are trying to stay good with a QB who is the highest or close to in the league.

If you want to go "all in" then understand the price of going "all in"

Honestly you want to look at a team with poor resource management? Look at Chicago. They are in cap hell this year. (look decent in 2022 but it's because they have no players under contract) and worst of all....nothing to show for it.

I do think 4 players you are happy to have on the field over 4 draft classes is part of the problem, but you make a good point that it is just expensive to field a good team year after year. I also agree that at least we have "something" to show for it. There are plenty of teams in cap hell that cant make the postseason.

[YoHoChecko]

So we're looking at $49 mil over the 2022 cap at the moment. That is jarring.

Let's look at the very basic moves that could change this, without going too deep into the well.

Trade Rodgers: saves $19 million
Convert Bakh's roster bonus to signing bonus as planned: saves $6.1 mil
Convert Clark's roster bonus to a signing bonus: saved $4.1 mil
Cut Preston Smith: saved $12 mil

Those four moves eat up $41 million, and suddenly we're only $8 million over the cap.

Other options: cut Randall Cobb ($8 million), Extend Zadarius (up to $11 million), cut Dean Lowry ($4 million), cut Marcedes Lewis ($2.5 mil), cut Billy Turner ($3.5 mil).

I don't think this offseason will be quite the tumultuous bloodbath many are expecting.

[Drj820]

So we're looking at $49 mil over the 2022 cap at the moment. That is jarring.

Let's look at the very basic moves that could change this, without going too deep into the well.

Trade Rodgers: saves $20 million
Convert Bakh's roster bonus to signing bonus as planned: saves $6.1 mil
Convert Clark's roster bonus to a signing bonus: saved $4.1 mil
Cut Preston Smith: saved $12 mil

Those four moves eat up $42 million, and suddenly we're only $7 million over the cap.

Other options: cut Randall Cobb ($8 million), Extend Zadarius (up to $11 million), cut Dean Lowry ($4 million), cut Marcedes Lewis ($2.5 mil), cut Billy Turner ($3.5 mil).

I don't think this offseason will be quite the tumultuous bloodbath many are expecting.

Great post, totally agree. Unless Cobb has a "turn the clock back" type year, no way I see him sticking around in a post Rodgers world. Amari will just takeover his role full time. Dean should be an easy cut too, and probably even Marcedes.

[go pak go]

So we're looking at $49 mil over the 2022 cap at the moment. That is jarring.

Let's look at the very basic moves that could change this, without going too deep into the well.

Trade Rodgers: saves $19 million
Convert Bakh's roster bonus to signing bonus as planned: saves $6.1 mil
Convert Clark's roster bonus to a signing bonus: saved $4.1 mil
Cut Preston Smith: saved $12 mil

Those four moves eat up $41 million, and suddenly we're only $8 million over the cap.

Other options: cut Randall Cobb ($8 million), Extend Zadarius (up to $11 million), cut Dean Lowry ($4 million), cut Marcedes Lewis ($2.5 mil), cut Billy Turner ($3.5 mil).

I don't think this offseason will be quite the tumultuous bloodbath many are expecting.

No it will be.

I think it depends on expectations.

Like I expect Rodgers and Adams to not be a Packer. I don't think others have that same expectation. The easy "fat" is Rodgers, Preston, Lowry, Cobb. If you move on from those, that is as you stated, $43 million in savings. So you only have $5 million to go. The easy thing then is extend Z. and we are under the cap.

For the exception that we also need to fill like 4 roster spots just to get to the "top 51".

So really what I expect our 2022 roster to look like is an 12less, 17less, 91less, 94less roster. We also decide what to do with Z Smith to probably make the rest of the room (whether extend or cut).

We then decide between MVS/Cobb or FA and then basically buy garbage people/draft everyone else to replace them.

[YoHoChecko]

Also as to the reasons for the cost and the cost of having a great roster.

In 2018 we gave Aaron Rodgers a contract that made him the highest paid QB in the game at the time of signing.
In 2019 we gave Kenny Clark a contract that made him the highest paid NT in the game at the time of signing.
In 2020 we gave David Bakhtiari a contract that made him the highest paid LT in the game at the time of signing.

This takes it's toll. That doesn't even mention the Smiths. Maybe signing both of them instead of one of them was superfluous. But danged they sure looked worth it in 2019.

Then there's the future.

In 2021, we're negotiating with Davante Adams about becoming the highest paid WR in the game at the time of signing.
In 2022, we'll negotiate with Jaire Alexander about becoming the highest paid CB in the game at the time of signing.

Our cap situation isn't shaky because of Dean Lowry and Preston Smith. It's shaky because of our greats--Rodgers, Clark, Bakh, and Z. It's not in bad shape because we re-signed Aaron Jones while stocking the rest of the RB room with rookie contracts. These are moves around the margins, and moves we can easily alter, change, take back--marginal spending also has marginal costs to ending those contracts early.

But we gave out three "highest paid in the league" contracts and then hit a negative cap growth year. It was bad timing. Yeah, every team had to deal with the falling cap; but not every team had to do it at the moment that they had built a top 5 roster and were spending on it accordingly.

[YoHoChecko]

No it will be.

I think it depends on expectations.

Like I expect Rodgers and Adams to not be a Packer. I don't think others have that same expectation. The easy "fat" is Rodgers, Preston, Lowry, Cobb. If you move on from those, that is as you stated, $43 million in savings. So you only have $5 million to go. The easy thing then is extend Z. and we are under the cap.

For the exception that we also need to fill like 4 roster spots just to get to the "top 51".

So really what I expect our 2022 roster to look like is an 12less, 17less, 91less, 94less roster. We also decide what to do with Z Smith to probably make the rest of the room (whether extend or cut).

We then decide between MVS/Cobb or FA and then basically buy garbage people/draft everyone else to replace them.

We literally just recommended the same moves and I called it "not a bloodbath" and you re-asserted that yes, it will be one.

Losing Rodgers and Adams is obviously HUGE. But that's the transition we're making. Losing Preston and Lowry don't move the needle a ton in terms of the talent level of our team. If we extend Z and make those moves, I like where we are. Yeah, fill out that roster with draft picks and minimum contracts. That's how it works.

And yeah, I'd like to extend MVS as a deep threat role player. It's tight, but it's not, like, an apocalypse. It's a fairly routine transition year in my eyes.

[YoHoChecko]

Oh I didn't even include a Jaire extension. He's at $13.9 million on the 5th-year option. An extension would probably initially lower that number a bit.

[go pak go]

No it will be.

I think it depends on expectations.

Like I expect Rodgers and Adams to not be a Packer. I don't think others have that same expectation. The easy "fat" is Rodgers, Preston, Lowry, Cobb. If you move on from those, that is as you stated, $43 million in savings. So you only have $5 million to go. The easy thing then is extend Z. and we are under the cap.

For the exception that we also need to fill like 4 roster spots just to get to the "top 51".

So really what I expect our 2022 roster to look like is an 12less, 17less, 91less, 94less roster. We also decide what to do with Z Smith to probably make the rest of the room (whether extend or cut).

We then decide between MVS/Cobb or FA and then basically buy garbage people/draft everyone else to replace them.

We literally just recommended the same moves and I called it "not a bloodbath" and you re-asserted that yes, it will be one.

Losing Rodgers and Adams is obviously HUGE. But that's the transition we're making. Losing Preston and Lowry don't move the needle a ton in terms of the talent level of our team. If we extend Z and make those moves, I like where we are. Yeah, fill out that roster with draft picks and minimum contracts. That's how it works.

And yeah, I'd like to extend MVS as a deep threat role player. It's tight, but it's not, like, an apocalypse. It's a fairly routine transition year in my eyes.

Yup. I agree. But it's because you and I already have the expectation of these guys not being Packers.

You put Yoop though in February 2022 and tell him what's gonna happen and he is gonna freak out (he has already lamented about it in Adams Contract Talk threads). The nostalgic fans are not gonna like our 2022 roster.

DrJ already talked about how "junk" our WR corps is going to be next year.

It depends on how you define bloodbath. We are going to lose players that have been absolute key linch pins the last three years. But I also believe we will have enough of a foundation to set up our next window quite quickly (like I think this team could be raring to go by 2023 if Love is up to it).

For me, the 2022 roster is all about keeping guys you believe will be contributors for that 2023 - 2025 run and make sense financially.

I expect our 2022 roster to be a .500 to 11 win roster (depending on Jordan Love). Whereas this year, even with Love, I look at this roster as a 11+ win roster.

We are also not mentioning guys we may not afford to bring back like Robert Tonyan and (Allen Lazard?). I believe they finally are UFA's after this season?

[go pak go]

Oh I didn't even include a Jaire extension. He's at $13.9 million on the 5th-year option. An extension would probably initially lower that number a bit.

Yeah. I'd rather see us try and build up some savings and stop deferring 22 cap into future years. It's why I am more inclined to "take our medicine in 22 and save up for beyond. Because we have some potentially really, really expensive players coming up. (Alexander, Savage, Jenkins and Gary are going to be spendy boys)

[Pckfn23]

Also as to the reasons for the cost and the cost of having a great roster.

In 2018 we gave Aaron Rodgers a contract that made him the highest paid QB in the game at the time of signing.
In 2019 we gave Kenny Clark a contract that made him the highest paid NT in the game at the time of signing.
In 2020 we gave David Bakhtiari a contract that made him the highest paid LT in the game at the time of signing.

This takes it's toll. That doesn't even mention the Smiths. Maybe signing both of them instead of one of them was superfluous. But danged they sure looked worth it in 2019.

Then there's the future.

In 2021, we're negotiating with Davante Adams about becoming the highest paid WR in the game at the time of signing.
In 2022, we'll negotiate with Jaire Alexander about becoming the highest paid CB in the game at the time of signing.

Our cap situation isn't shaky because of Dean Lowry and Preston Smith. It's shaky because of our greats--Rodgers, Clark, Bakh, and Z. It's not in bad shape because we re-signed Aaron Jones while stocking the rest of the RB room with rookie contracts. These are moves around the margins, and moves we can easily alter, change, take back--marginal spending also has marginal costs to ending those contracts early.

But we gave out three "highest paid in the league" contracts and then hit a negative cap growth year. It was bad timing. Yeah, every team had to deal with the falling cap; but not every team had to do it at the moment that they had built a top 5 roster and were spending on it accordingly.

bravo!