Packers Offseason Philosophy: Least Important Positions

[go pak go]

We have all seen it the last few years.

This board is full of couch GMs proudly stating how the Packers have "neglected a spot" for far too long and is the reason why we haven't seen success.

We have talked about neglecting the TE spot, ILB position, WR 2 - WR 4, STs, 3rd Safety, Dline.....you get the point. We b*tch a lot and have "seen the weakness for years"

In season it's easy to talk about needing to place a priority on a position but offseason resource constraints acts as a quick reminder that not every position can be a level 10 priority.

So you are GM. You have to put together a Packers roster. What position groups are investing the least amount in?

[go pak go]

It's actually a really hard question because the Packers have to be the most creative team in losing the last 10 years.

We have found the importance of punters, long snappers, returners just being able to catch a ball, ILBs, the highest paid Tackle missing 2 years because of a non-contact injury during a walkthrough.

[Yoop]

this should probably be a sticky post, I'am sure our feelings concerning positional priority's will change as the off season progresses and we lose players in UFA.

I think we've been seeing some offensive evolution, less spread verticals and deep passing to a more ball control and uptempo approach and more reliance on running the ball.

with that in mind defenses have to be better up front and at the second level to keep the run in check, and also able to get consistent pressure faster then ever before to combat up tempo passing schemes

so as to our position needs.

Clark needs a friend, DT has to be high on our list, Lowery has shown to be a pretty good pass rusher, and Lancaster pretty good against the run, both are good options as relief players, what we need is another guy in the mold of Clark, good at both stopping the run and rushing the QB, I'am starting to think this is a must have player in the first couple rounds.

It's time to fix the WR position ( been saying this for years now ) no matter who our QB is, or if Adams stays or goes, we still need improvements here.

more to come.....

[go pak go]

this should probably be a sticky post, I'am sure our feelings concerning positional priority's will change as the off season progresses and we lose players in UFA.

I think we've been seeing some offensive evolution, less spread verticals and deep passing to a more ball control and uptempo approach and more reliance on running the ball.

with that in mind defenses have to be better up front and at the second level to keep the run in check, and also able to get consistent pressure faster then ever before to combat up tempo passing schemes

so as to our position needs.

Clark needs a friend, DT has to be high on our list, Lowery has shown to be a pretty good pass rusher, and Lancaster pretty good against the run, both are good options as relief players, what we need is another guy in the mold of Clark, good at both stopping the run and rushing the QB, I'am starting to think this is a must have player in the first couple rounds.

It's time to fix the WR position ( been saying this for years now ) no matter who our QB is, or if Adams stays or goes, we still need improvements here.

more to come.....

I think you and I actually want to mold a team very similarly.

I would mark my priorities as the following:

1. Defense. I agree with yoop that defense is the one side that a weakness gets more exposed than on the offense. We have a great defense. Do whatever it takes to keep it. Resign Campbell and Douglas. Invest heavy in a DLineman (I would prefer too a smaller all around Dlinemen 310 pounds or less that can play multiple positions on the Dline).

2. I would like to draft another ILB. This draft has a few of them and I want to reload it more.

3. I would like a ball hawking and playmaking safety. The Jeremy Chinn mold. There is a kid from Penn State I love.

4. A great dual threat Tight End.

5. Guard or Right Tackle if one is there.

Where this puts my lower priority is WR and QB. We are a team shifting away from being QB dependent. I would only grab a WR if the value is really there. The kid from Alabama is really, really good. He excites me. I would take him. But my continued conclusion is I am prioritizing every position outside of the QB position. Which means right now I honestly value the QB spot quite a bit.

I don't think our team is molded or set up to have allocate so much resources to a QB based on us being a Run after the catch, scheme WRs open and running team who has a really good defense.

[BF004]

I don't think there is a direct correlation between money/draft picks spend on a position, and its importance.

I think of the of the resources you spend on a position is more relative to the impact of an elite player vs. an average player vs. a liability. And the abundance of players in each category.


I think there are just a ton of LB's, TE's and RB's that are average players and having liabilities at those positions aren't as damning, as say something like LT, DT, CB and obviously, QB.

e.g., you are likely a better team spending $15 million on a good to great CB and finding a plug and play ILB who is maybe average to below average, than you are if you just have an average level CB and ILB with that same $15. Or to the contrary, and elite ILB and a garbage CB.

[Yoop]

I don't think there is a direct correlation between money/draft picks spend on a position, and its importance.

I think of the of the resources you spend on a position is more relative to the impact of an elite player vs. an average player vs. a liability. And the abundance of players in each category.


I think there are just a ton of LB's, TE's and RB's that are average players and having liabilities at those positions aren't as damning, as say something like LT, DT, CB and obviously, QB.

e.g., you are likely a better team spending $15 million on a good to great CB and finding a plug and play ILB who is maybe average to below average, than you are if you just have an average level CB and ILB with that same $15. Or to the contrary, and elite ILB and a garbage CB.

well just take a look at the best defenses this year, all had superior ILB play, but I get your point, if both ILB and CB where a need we'd grab the corner, but lets go a step further just for &%$@ and giggles, if ya needed better pass rush, but also needed to get better at CB, which position would give you more bang for the buck in todays game, for me it would be the pass rusher, but thats just me.
probably also why I went DT as my first priority.

[BF004]

well just take a look at the best defenses this year, all had superior ILB play

Ok I took a look and nope, you can't just say things because you want them to be true.

PFF Ranks for 2021 - No super bowl teams in the top 16, only one of the 4 conference teams had a top 16 LB, only 6 of the top 16 LB's played in the playoffs.

image.png (82.45 KiB) Viewed 484 times

Also, none of the top 6 highest paid LB's made it to the playoffs.

image.png (92.42 KiB) Viewed 484 times

As much as I love De'Vondre and the impact he had on our D, I would honestly be a little considered about our $$ allocation to RB and LB. History tends to show that isn't money well spent. As great as those guys are and I want them both and there are always exceptions to the numbers. But yeah.

[go pak go]

Good stuff BF!!!

This is the type I like to talk about.

The constant narrative is "we don't do enough" but let's actually make choices then. What positions are important? What resource allocation is important?

Because right now the answer seems to be, "we need everything to be a priority"

The ILB thing is interesting because this was the first year in 10 years where I felt confident in our defense going into every game. And I think our defense was elevated because of our ILB play and CB depth.

[wallyuwl]

Priority 1 is a long snapper that weighs more than 180 lbs

[Realist]

I know this won't go over well but I think we should move Alexander. Not a fan of Gute but the pick of Stokes was awesome. Just cant resign everyone with stupid money given the cap.

[BF004]

I know this won't go over well but I think we should move Alexander. Not a fan of Gute but the pick of Stokes was awesome. Just cant resign everyone with stupid money given the cap.

Yeah, I don't like that.

We've had garbage CB's since 2011, no way I want to go back to those days.

Jaire isn't pricy this year, 5th year option, and we can actually save money this year by extending him.

[Realist]

I know this won't go over well but I think we should move Alexander. Not a fan of Gute but the pick of Stokes was awesome. Just cant resign everyone with stupid money given the cap.

Yeah, I don't like that.

We've had garbage CB's since 2011, no way I want to go back to those days.

Jaire isn't pricy this year, 5th year option, and we can actually save money this year by extending him.

Did you agree with resigning Bak? If Rodgers moves on we can flip him next year and get some assets. Keeping the band together makes zero sense without Aaron. We shall see.

[Pckfn23]

Priority in paying positions:
QB - To an extent, never more than 15% of cap
Edge
CB
LT
iDL
FS
-------------------
WR
RT
G
C
-------------------
TE
ILB
SS
RB
-------------------
K
P
LS

I also tiered it. It king of exemplifies my defensive philosophy.

QB - Love/Drafted QB
Edge - Gary, resign 1 Smith
CB - Extend Alexander, Stokes
LT - Bakhtiari
iDL - Clark, Lowry, Slaton, draft not first round
FS - Savage or draft not first round
------------------------------------------------------------
WR - Draft, Draft, Draft
RT - Turner/Nijman
G - Jenkins, Runyan
C - Myers
------------------------------------------------------------
TE - Deguara, cheap Tonyan, draft mid round
ILB - Draft mid to early
SS - Amos, don't restructure
RB - Jones, Dillon (love Jones, but not widely spent money here)
___________________________________________
K - Find one, don't draft one before round 7
P - Find one, don't draft one
LS - Find one, don't draft one

Draft:
Round 1 - QB/WR/ILB
Round 2 - QB/WR/ILB/iDL/TE/FS
Round 3 to 6 - All positions outside specials
Round 7 - All positions other than LS/P

[go pak go]

I know this won't go over well but I think we should move Alexander. Not a fan of Gute but the pick of Stokes was awesome. Just cant resign everyone with stupid money given the cap.

Yeah, I don't like that.

We've had garbage CB's since 2011, no way I want to go back to those days.

Jaire isn't pricy this year, 5th year option, and we can actually save money this year by extending him.

Did you agree with resigning Bak? If Rodgers moves on we can flip him next year and get some assets. Keeping the band together makes zero sense without Aaron. We shall see.

I like getting assets for older players. I don't like getting assets for players entering their prime at premium positions who has never really seen the game be too big for them.

Alexander is exactly the type of player, leader and "mojo" you want on a football team. He is a cornerstone. I can't let players like that go because then we would just be trying to draft his replacement.

[BF004]

I know this won't go over well but I think we should move Alexander. Not a fan of Gute but the pick of Stokes was awesome. Just cant resign everyone with stupid money given the cap.

Yeah, I don't like that.

We've had garbage CB's since 2011, no way I want to go back to those days.

Jaire isn't pricy this year, 5th year option, and we can actually save money this year by extending him.

Did you agree with resigning Bak? If Rodgers moves on we can flip him next year and get some assets. Keeping the band together makes zero sense without Aaron. We shall see.

Definitely. As long as he had Aaron, can't skimp on LT and that is a position that ages well. Absolute shame he's missed the last two playoffs. He would have made a bigger impact than a different WR2.

Bak I could see flipping, I think contractually we are locked in for a bit. Also sounds like it will be highly likely we're gunna kick more of his contract down the road tying us to him for longer. Jaire can still be an all-pro in 5 years. Jaire isn't just keeping the band together, He'll be part of the new band. Bak can be crucial for Love too, like Clifton and Tauscher and Driver were for Rodgers.

[BF004]

Yeah, I don't like that.

We've had garbage CB's since 2011, no way I want to go back to those days.

Jaire isn't pricy this year, 5th year option, and we can actually save money this year by extending him.

Did you agree with resigning Bak? If Rodgers moves on we can flip him next year and get some assets. Keeping the band together makes zero sense without Aaron. We shall see.

I like getting assets for older players. I don't like getting assets for players entering their prime at premium positions who has never really seen the game be too big for them.

Alexander is exactly the type of player, leader and "mojo" you want on a football team. He is a cornerstone. I can't let players like that go because then we would just be trying to draft his replacement.

And I am not exactly ready to bank on Rasul Douglas being a cornerstone of the defense after like a 10 game stretch. We would have nothing behind either of them, one injury, a little regression in either, and it looks like a garbage unit.

[Realist]

Yeah, I don't like that.

We've had garbage CB's since 2011, no way I want to go back to those days.

Jaire isn't pricy this year, 5th year option, and we can actually save money this year by extending him.

Did you agree with resigning Bak? If Rodgers moves on we can flip him next year and get some assets. Keeping the band together makes zero sense without Aaron. We shall see.

I like getting assets for older players. I don't like getting assets for players entering their prime at premium positions who has never really seen the game be too big for them.

Alexander is exactly the type of player, leader and "mojo" you want on a football team. He is a cornerstone. I can't let players like that go because then we would just be trying to draft his replacement.

Ok. Let's pay the man. Not a good idea IMO. Check back with me in a few years. 13-4 wo him this year. Same goes for Bak.

[go pak go]

See I think Bak's injury is a significant reason why we don't have 2 SB rings from the last two years.

I think we very well win both SBs if he was protecting the LT spot and Turner was at RT.

You sign big time players for big time games. I know it obviously comes to a point. And I think we are at the point for Adams and Rodgers because their cap will simply be too large. But from a cap standpoint, signing even Bak for this run was good. He had a low cap hit this year for the intended purpose of putting together a run. It just didn't work out.

But Alexander is a guy you sign with the intention of keeping a Packer for another 5 years at least. And I can't let those guys go. 23, 97, and 52 are the pillars of the new defense.

[wallyuwl]

See I think Bak's injury is a significant reason why we don't have 2 SB rings from the last two years.

I think we very well win both SBs if he was protecting the LT spot and Turner was at RT.

But Alexander is a guy you sign with the intention of keeping a Packer for another 5 years at least. And I can't let those guys go. 23, 97, and 52 are the pillars of the new defense.

Bak's absence for sure cost a SB appearance in 2020 season, with him against Tampa the Packers win that game. This year I don't think his absence cost much, though putting Turner at LT for the playoffs was a bad decision.

Gotta keep Alexander.

[Realist]

See I think Bak's injury is a significant reason why we don't have 2 SB rings from the last two years.

I think we very well win both SBs if he was protecting the LT spot and Turner was at RT.

You sign big time players for big time games. I know it obviously comes to a point. And I think we are at the point for Adams and Rodgers because their cap will simply be too large. But from a cap standpoint, signing even Bak for this run was good. He had a low cap hit this year for the intended purpose of putting together a run. It just didn't work out.

But Alexander is a guy you sign with the intention of keeping a Packer for another 5 years at least. And I can't let those guys go. 23, 97, and 52 are the pillars of the new defense.

I thought the consensus here was special teams cost us this year? Keep chugging beers at Bucks games during ur rehab Bak!. We cant win it without you.