Panthers @ Packers GDT - Saturday 12/19 7:25 PM CST

[Pckfn23]

Hes just looking to argue

No, I am looking to put down idiotic statements.

Packers have scored 24 or less only 2 other times this entire season. 16 is the least the Packers defense has given up this season. SO PLEASE, tell us all how this game is an example of how &%$@ this team is...

you want to put down idiotic statements, you should record yourself, you could have a ongoing dialogue with yourself, seriously

obvious that J was refering to how this defense has often let teams back in the game, the offense shouldn't have to score on every drive, instead the pass rush dials it back and we play with to much cushion in coverage, why you feel the need to be condecending to others who point out obvious issues is your problem, so impressed with your cussing with every breath.

The defense let up 16 points. The least on the season. The offense let the Panthers back in, not the defense. Do you know what indicative means?

I agree, we play with too much cushion. Said it many times tonight. Have said that many times over the season. HOWEVER, we still only gave up 16 points with an offense that looks worse than the Panthers. THAT is not indicative of how our season has gone thus far.

There was no pointing out of obvious problems. There was simply a doom and gloom statement about how this is yet another example of why this team will fail.

[German_Panzer]

I saw Dillon in one snap and he looked pretty good. I still can see him as some Starks 2021!

Did Rush play? Austin played..any observations about him?

[Pugger]

Looks to me like a rough night for Patrick.

Indeed. Bak had a few whiffs too.

[BF004]

I’ll take a win by 8 ten times out of ten!

Kind of nice to see the D be the dominant force.

[Pugger]

Holy hell with the $&&@&$@‘b Pettine comments.

How about someone say Kevin King make a tackle?

I have no use for Kevin King. I hope he is replaced in 2021.

[Yoop]

No, I am looking to put down idiotic statements.

Packers have scored 24 or less only 2 other times this entire season. 16 is the least the Packers defense has given up this season. SO PLEASE, tell us all how this game is an example of how &%$@ this team is...

you want to put down idiotic statements, you should record yourself, you could have a ongoing dialogue with yourself, seriously

obvious that J was refering to how this defense has often let teams back in the game, the offense shouldn't have to score on every drive, instead the pass rush dials it back and we play with to much cushion in coverage, why you feel the need to be condecending to others who point out obvious issues is your problem, so impressed with your cussing with every breath.

The defense let up 16 points. The least on the season. The offense let the Panthers back in, not the defense. Do you know what indicative means?

I agree, we play with too much cushion. Said it many times tonight. Have said that many times over the season. HOWEVER, we still only gave up 16 points with an offense that looks worse than the Panthers. THAT is not indicative of how our season has gone thus far.

There was no pointing out of obvious problems. There was simply a doom and gloom statement about how this is yet another example of why this team will fail.

obvious problems, the defense let them march down the field and score.

the ol was a sieve, receivers weren't getting open, and when they did they dropped the ball, the run blocking could not consistently open run lanes, and the run didn't move the chains, we had a few great run sets, but the Panthers shut it down, it's easy to just sit here and blame Rodgers, but he held the ball BECAUSE no one was getting separation.

[YoHoChecko]

Yup. I have it documented I wanted to hold em to 20 points and 300 yards.

We held em to 16 points and 365 yards. So again, just a play or two we need to make when the opportunity is there.

I guess this is part of what frustrated me. Like you put out specific hopes/expectations. And the team came very close to them, and you're still disappointed as it happens.

That's where it comes back to the folly of comparing a team to perfection rather than to its peers or to realistic expectations. That's what so many of the arguments on the board over the years have come down to--like with TT specifically (not to bring that up) where he clearly had among the best track records in the league, but he was being compared to optimal outcomes, not to realistic outcomes among his peers.

And so, it seems we are here.

Realistically, we know we're a good team. We compare very favorably to the Chiefs. We defeated the Saints.

Realistically, we have the defense that we're going to have. The run D is not going to show up and surprise us, the pass rush is more inconsistent than we want, and the tackling is suspect. But we have talented DBs and when the pass rush is clicking, production there, also.

And we have a good offense that leads the league in average time per drive, and is top 2/3 in yards and points per drive. We have the likely MVP leading the offense, a great OL (usually), and top players at RB and WR1.

So we should expect our offense to score ~30 points and we should expect our defense to help make that enough. We can hope for specific adjustments like less Kirksey or more turnovers to come our way. But once you get comfortable with the fact that, at this point, we are who we are. We have a formula that wins far more games than it loses, and we stack up pretty well with the best teams in the league... well, once you accept that, you trust it and watch. Your expectations are realistic. A few rough plays in a game don't make you doubt the entire team because you should be expecting a few rough plays here and there.

We have patterns. Some are negative patterns. Odds are, one of those negative patterns will keep us from winning a Super Bowl. But as an individual team, we have better odds than almost every other individual team to win with our formula. Not because our team suddenly changes who it is and how it plays. But because our team, as is, can play with the top teams in the league, and we just need the breaks, bounces, and best performances to make that happen. Stop hoping for a different team to come out of the tunnel because it won't. This is our team and we might as well be optimistic about our chances, because if you can't be optimistic about a 1-seed with a 20% chance to win the Super Bowl, analytically, you're probably not going to have many opportunities to be optimistic and excited.

[Pugger]

Maybe it's a good thing to get humbled on a National game.

Rodgers was a little too cocky this week.

Nice to get your a$$ handed to you but still escape with a win.

I think this might be a blessing in disguise. Perhaps they should stop reading their press clippings. The offense looked terrible in the second half. I suppose the best way to look at this is the better teams win even when they play like crap.

[Pckfn23]

you want to put down idiotic statements, you should record yourself, you could have a ongoing dialogue with yourself, seriously

obvious that J was refering to how this defense has often let teams back in the game, the offense shouldn't have to score on every drive, instead the pass rush dials it back and we play with to much cushion in coverage, why you feel the need to be condecending to others who point out obvious issues is your problem, so impressed with your cussing with every breath.

The defense let up 16 points. The least on the season. The offense let the Panthers back in, not the defense. Do you know what indicative means?

I agree, we play with too much cushion. Said it many times tonight. Have said that many times over the season. HOWEVER, we still only gave up 16 points with an offense that looks worse than the Panthers. THAT is not indicative of how our season has gone thus far.

There was no pointing out of obvious problems. There was simply a doom and gloom statement about how this is yet another example of why this team will fail.

obvious problems, the defense let them march down the field and score.

On 1 drive... FYI, they scored 1 touchdown...

the ol was a sieve,

We have given up 14 sacks ALL SEASON until tonight. At least the first 2 sacks were on Rodgers.

receivers weren't getting open, and when they did they dropped the ball,

Oh no, receivers were open. We were looking to get it to Adams, who, BTW, dropped at least 2. There was too much emphasis on records tonight and not enough on winning by any means.

the run blocking could not consistently open run lanes, and the run didn't move the chains,

100% not reality. The run blocking was superb tonight. We were dominating the Panthers. We went away from the run too often in the 2nd half.

it's easy to just sit here and blame Rodgers, but he held the ball BECAUSE no one was getting separation.

This is not reality. He had eyes only for Adams tonight and it cost the offense. There were numerous times that others like Tonyan and Jones were open earlier in a down and would have gotten more yards, but Rodgers kept locked on Adams.

[Yoop]

bull, he looked in both directions when he had time to extend the play, most of the time the Panthers where all over him.

I didn't see players open, and he was not tunneling Adams any more then normal, I'll see what they say at JS online.

[paco]

Run game showed that they can dominate, which will be huge for the playoffs. D did some good stuff. But overall an awful play calling day on both ends.

Not worried about the offense, Lafleur will fix this crapfest of a 2nd half.. D starting to do just enough. ST is still a yikes.

I still think we are the team to beat in the NFC.

[Pckfn23]

7 Rushing Attempts in the 2nd half...

Let me revise, 8 rushing attempts after our 3rd TD...

[williewasgreat]

Maybe it's a good thing to get humbled on a National game.

Rodgers was a little too cocky this week.

Nice to get your a$$ handed to you but still escape with a win.

I think this might be a blessing in disguise. Perhaps they should stop reading their press clippings. The offense looked terrible in the second half. I suppose the best way to look at this is the better teams win even when they play like crap.

I think you hit on a valid point. I was concerned listening to Rodgers toot his own horn this week. Too much concern about MVP, records etc. The team needs to spend less time patting themselves on the back.

[Yoop]

As fun as the first couple quarters were,” Rodgers said, “It's not gonna be the easiest night of sleep thinking about the second half.”

The milestone may have tasted sweeter had the Packers' offense sprinkled in some consistency heading into the second half. After scoring three straight touchdowns and going up 21-3 in the second quarter, the offense fizzled and failed to produce for the remainder of the night. The once high-powered scoring offense averaging 31.5 points per game lost its charge.


“I'm not a big believer in teams lightening up or losing focus,” Rodgers said. “It just comes down to execution and we didn't execute starting the second half. That's why they got back in the game.”

Execution becomes impossible when the quarterback gets clobbered behind the line of scrimmage. The Panthers sacked Rodgers five times, a season-high and the most since the Packers’ Week 6 loss to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers when he took four. Three of the Panthers’ five sacks came in the second half.

Carolina Panthers defensive tackle Derrick Brown (95) sacks Green Bay Packers quarterback Aaron Rodgers (12) on Saturday, December 19, 2020, at Lambeau Field in Green Bay, Wis.
Because the Packers found themselves in long yardage situations so often, they struggled to convert on third down. After going 4-of-6 on third down in the first half, the Packers offense only converted a single third down on six more attempts in the second half, bringing their final conversion rate to 42 percent.

“There was more pressure on our quarterback tonight than we've seen probably since the Tampa Bay game,” head coach Matt LaFleur said. “It seemed like once it started to snowball, we could just never get out of the rut.”


The Panthers defense allowed just 49 yards in the second half. Running back Aaron Jones took the brunt of the Panthers’ adjustments coming out of halftime. In the first half, Jones collected 114 rushing yards, including a 46-yard gain that set the Packers up for their first touchdown.

In the second half, he only accrued 31 rushing yards.

“They just had pretty much everybody in the box,” Jones said. “They made a change at corner, I believe. Rasul Douglas, he came in and he was filling the hole pretty hard when he got in there. So it gave it a little different look as well. You could tell they were playing with a little bit more effort in the second half.”

LaFleur concluded that the Panthers picked up on what the Packers were trying to accomplish in the run game. The Packers found success early on running into the boundary to the tight end’s side, but the Panthers eventually found a way to limit Jones.

https://www.jsonline.com/story/sports/n ... 965536001/

the Panthers took away the short stuff, agreed though, we should have tried to run more

[packman114]

The Rodgers MVP comments are way off base. He's not the one bringing it up. The media are the ones asking him about it. Not like he just started conversations with "I deserve the MVP".

They played like crap and still won. What still amazed me is how MVS can just disappear in these games. Too much lateral passing and not enough in the middle of the field.

[lupedafiasco]

Missed another game. Had a flight scheduled and ended up breaking. It’s been a really rough day.

Great to see the Pack win. I don’t care how they’re doing it. It would be great if they were dominant and peaking but I’ll take the win and staying in 1st place.

Next week will be the real test. We will play a legitimate offense and the defense will need to step up. Especially if the Saints pull out an upset over the Chiefs.

[go pak go]

Yup. I have it documented I wanted to hold em to 20 points and 300 yards.

We held em to 16 points and 365 yards. So again, just a play or two we need to make when the opportunity is there.

I guess this is part of what frustrated me. Like you put out specific hopes/expectations. And the team came very close to them, and you're still disappointed as it happens.

YoHo I appreciate what you are saying. I appreciate the effort of bringing optimism to this board and bringing a sense of realistic expectations to this board. In fact, I wouldn't call it optism but rather realism as you stated....we know who we are.

I don't know why I am the target here. I purposefully put thoughtful goals on the first page of this thread for a reason as I too don't like the constant arm twisting (even from myself). So I documented goals I wanted for our defense.

They made the points goal and they didn't meet the yards goal. 65 yards is a possession. It's a major play and it's what made this game go to an onside kick and make it a one possession score.

The points also got helped because Bridgewater put the ball in the air for all the world to see and Barnes made a play. Barnes made a great play of taking advantage but the Packers were literally a foot away from allowing the 22 to 24 points. Honestly it would have probably been more because the Panthers don't prematurely end their drive to take a figgy at the end.

This one is tough to evaluate. We held em to 3 at half and our offense gave no favors in the 2nd half to our defense. Our offense did not make things easy on our defense. At the same point, you have to admit you would like to see our defense flip the script and give our offense another possession too. Like they can do that. They can't simply make a stop when we need em to make a stop.

I was bummed on their last real drive. They start on their own 24. Z gets a sack to make it 2nd and 15 and Jaw allows a 14 yard reception. Then the following play Kirksey, Savage, and King all miss on a wrap up to allow DJ Moore to roll 40 yards down the field to give the Panthers a chance. That's your extra yards I was hoping they wouldn't allow.

I was hoping to see our defense not give the Panthers a shot whether it was in the 4th quarter or 3rd quarter and I don't see anything wrong with that.

Like I said. The defense was close to their goals, but realistically a possession off. A play or two and this defense is there. Otherwise as you stated, this offense needs to put up 30+ every game in January.

The one thing I did like is we won when we only put up 24. That's really the first time this year, other than the Jags, where I would say we won despite our offense. And particularly, despite our MVP quarterback and passing offense.

[go pak go]

Missed another game. Had a flight scheduled and ended up breaking. It’s been a really rough day.

Great to see the Pack win. I don’t care how they’re doing it. It would be great if they were dominant and peaking but I’ll take the win and staying in 1st place.

Next week will be the real test. We will play a legitimate offense and the defense will need to step up. Especially if the Saints pull out an upset over the Chiefs.

Yeah. We have two Saints games to play before knowing if the Titans is a must win.

Certainly a Saints loss to either KC or MN doesn't make the Titans game meaningless because we could still get the top seed over a loss with CHI....but a loss wouldn't end our chances.

[salmar80]

Ended up watching this at night on the phone

I think the O was most marred by a series of simple individual mistakes in 2nd half. A couple of key drops and a couple of bad blocks at the right time (3rd down), and those ended drives.

The D forced a couple of more fumbles, which is a very good thing, but they didn't bounce. Yes we allowed too many yards. King had a weirdly bad game.

Crosby's perfection helps STs be tolerable.

There's was no statement to be made vs a 4-9 team. Even crushing them would not make anyone fear us. Winning suffices for me.

[go pak go]

Re-watched the first half and here are my thoughts:

Player of the game is Aaron Jones. We lose this game if not for Jones. A lot of our runs that went for good yardage was because of his great cutback or because he did a great job bouncing to the outside.

Defense:

Really good things:

Don't look now but our safeties are playing really, really well. I mean they are the best position group on our defense. Darnell Savage and Adrian Amos were EVERYWHERE. Savage is excelling in his box safety role. He is so fast and so explosive. He gets to the QB. He knocks down passes. He is a willing tackler and he is sniffing stuff out. Adrian Amos on the other hand was fantastic in pass coverage and completely took away the middle of the field. I counted 3 passes defensed from Amos.

Jaire Alexander had a great half too. He is simply a lockdown corner. Chandon Sullivan also had a decent half. Probably the best half he played in the last month.

Pretty good things:

Krys Barnes and Kamal Martin looked really solid in their LB roles. Kamal Martin is a playmaker in the making. He just NEEDS to make his tackles but he shoots the gap without hesitation. Love his killer instinct. Just needs to finish. Krys Barnes is far better than Kirksey at the MIKE and Kamal Martin is better than Kirksey in the WILL. Honestly I don't get why they play Kirksey because he still makes mental mistakes and simply doesn't have the athleticism to overcome them.

Kenny Clark is also active. He plays considerably less snaps than prior years but he is fresh and is moving faster again. Preston Smith also had a really good first half and I think the reduced snap count is good for him.

Players who struggled:

Kevin King. I always say that our defense can be elite when King is having a game and struggles when he isn't. It's plays like outside sweeps where when King makes the tackle, this defense is on a whole new level and when he doesn't....our defense isn't. King had to two really rough plays in a row that he was in position for but didn't finish. The one was an end around sweep and King was in position...misses the tackle and makes a 6 yard loss into a 1 yard loss. The following play, King is in position on Moore and plays the ball weaker than he should and Moore hauls in a beauty of a catch.

Christian Kirksey. I wouldn't say he was bad. He also hardly played. But he also just isn't good. There is noticeable difference when he is playing and it is the bad difference.