I like Zach Baun. In college he was and OLB but he is too small to play NFL OLB. Which means he will be available to the Packers. Maybe even at the end of the 2nd round. The big plus for him is that he could be an effective blitzer as an ILB.
LOT of draftniks saying he goes in round 1.
Personally I wouldn't take him and I am a huge Badger fan. I don't like the projection of changing his position when there are better options out there that played ILB in college. Now, if he fell to the end of the 2nd round or into the 3rd round, I would be ok with it.
He is going to have to change position regardless. 6'2" 235 pounders would have to be a freak athlete to play 3-4 OLB in the NFL. He is a good athlete but not freak good. Hence he will drop and very well may be there when the Packers pick at the end of the 2nd round. I also would not argue if the Packers moved up 10 spots in the 2nd round for him.
Oh ya, he definitely can't play full time as an EDGE so he is going to have to be an off the ball LB. Even with that, almost all think he is still a first round pick.
Re: 2020 Positional Draft Talk - ILB
Posted: 30 Mar 2020 11:56
by Pckfn23
McShay's Latest Top 99:
6. Isaiah Simmons, OLB, Clemson (94)
20. Patrick Queen, ILB, LSU (90)
27. Kenneth Murray, ILB, Oklahoma (88)
37. Zack Baun, OLB, Wisconsin (86)
82. Akeem Davis-Gaither, OLB, Appalachian State (75)
87. Malik Harrison, OLB, Ohio State (73)
94. Logan Wilson, ILB, Wyoming (70)
Re: 2020 Positional Draft Talk - ILB
Posted: 30 Mar 2020 15:44
by paco
I posted these in the general packers news thread just now. Leads me to believe we need to focus more on the later prospects than guys like Queen, Murray, and Baun. We just don't value that position group.
Re: 2020 Positional Draft Talk - ILB
Posted: 30 Mar 2020 16:25
by bud fox
Yeah after the Kirksey signing I don't see using much draft capital on the position.
A later round pick up from 4 onwards would make sense.
Re: 2020 Positional Draft Talk - ILB
Posted: 30 Mar 2020 16:58
by Yoop
interesting comments, thanks for sharing Paco.
I think several of us commented that some of the decline we've seen with Marty was scheme related, the only stat that seems constant for Marty was tackle totals, other stats have declined each season, he also looked slower this last season, it's possible the staff wanted him to bulk up a bit, I'am guessing, who knows, whatever asking him to cover multi gaps explains why he always looked lost in space.
Re: 2020 Positional Draft Talk - ILB
Posted: 30 Mar 2020 17:21
by TheGreenMan
I really like Dye, very athletic guy. Might be a little too small though for some.
Re: 2020 Positional Draft Talk - ILB
Posted: 02 Apr 2020 15:41
by Pckfn23
Are there examples of college safeties or edge rushers who successfully transitioned to NFL 2nd level linebackers and had good careers?
Are there examples of college safeties or edge rushers who successfully transitioned to NFL 2nd level linebackers and had good careers?
Teddy Bruschi was a college edge rusher who transitioned to a HoF off-the-ball career.
Kyle Van Noy was a college S who was moved to LB and then moved to EDGE in college and then was utilized as a hybrid off-ball edge OLB in the NFL and is now pretty good.
Mark Barron is something, if only briefly.
Re: 2020 Positional Draft Talk - ILB
Posted: 02 Apr 2020 16:23
by Pckfn23
The reason I ask is for the whole Baun situation.
Bruschi and Davis, very good examples. Barron and Van Noy are good, but I think we would be disappointed if we picked a guy at 30 and got them.
From what I just read on Thomas Davis is that he was Swiss Army knife in college playing everything from safety to rush linebacker.
Bruschi was a LB before moving to Edge I believe, same with Van Noy.
Baun did come to Wisconsin as a linebacker before transitioning to Edge...
Are there examples of college safeties or edge rushers who successfully transitioned to NFL 2nd level linebackers and had good careers?
Brian Urlacher was a college safety, right? MLB rather than ILB though.
If Clay M had dropped some weight he might have been better at it but I don't think either he or the coaching fully committed to him permanently moving to ILB. As it was, he wasn't terrible at it. At least not compared to the other ILB's on the team.
Re: 2020 Positional Draft Talk - ILB
Posted: 03 Apr 2020 07:49
by Yoop
you guys have good memories, I'am not good at remembering names, just know that players do change positions, and often for the better of both team and player.
and while Baum is a little light to play the edge, others have done well and not really any bigger then Baum, I think that gets blown a bit out of preportion, however it does limit there ability to withstand a mauling OL against the run, so obviously they shouldn't play paddy cake with those nasty's.
I think he's a bit slow, sure he has range to play the run, but 4.68 isn't coverage speed that I'd be happy with, but some GM wont mind that, Baum seems like a high ceiling player, a guy you can move around, inside outside ability is always in demand, I agree with some others, that he will go late round 1, to much there not to like.
Are there examples of college safeties or edge rushers who successfully transitioned to NFL 2nd level linebackers and had good careers?
Brian Urlacher was a college safety, right? MLB rather than ILB though.
If Clay M had dropped some weight he might have been better at it but I don't think either he or the coaching fully committed to him permanently moving to ILB. As it was, he wasn't terrible at it. At least not compared to the other ILB's on the team.
Urlacher was a linebacker his entire college career.
Looking for concrete examples to make a determination on Zack Baun. Big position changes worry me and I feel they don't work out well. Some pretty good examples of players transitioning and being successful. I might need to reconsider Baun at 30.
Re: 2020 Positional Draft Talk - ILB
Posted: 03 Apr 2020 09:19
by Pckfn23
Baun ran a 4.65 and weighed 238 pounds at the combine. That is not too slow for an ILB. That is definitely too light for a full time Edge. Bruce Irvin was 245 when drafted and never amounted to much more than a situational pass rusher for the Seahawks. While he had some success, he definitely didn't live up to 1st round expectations.
Baun ran a 4.65 and weighed 238 pounds at the combine... Might need to reevaluate if that is too slow for ILB and not too light for OLB.
4.65 is not fast for a 3 dn lber in this era, other wise teams wouldn't take guys like Queen, or Shaziers, or the two top ones last year, so for my preference, yes it's to slow.
and there have been plenty of sub 240 lb edge rushers, who was that guy that did it for us when we won the SB, then went to the Colts an d had 10 sacks the following year? you and others are stereo graphing these players, obviously you wouldn't want Baum as a full time OLB in a 34, but it doesn't mean he can't be productive there rotating from ILB.
and there have been plenty of sub 240 lb edge rushers, who was that guy that did it for us when we won the SB, then went to the Colts an d had 10 sacks the following year?
I think you are thinking of Erik Walden who played at 250 and went to Indy and had 3 sacks the following year.
It's not slow, either. Its in the sweet spot. I'd put a cut-off on 4.75 as slow as I would possibly accept in today's game. As far as "fast". Anything under a 4.6. I think Oren Burks is right at 4.6 and that is plenty fast if it ever clicks for him.
Re: 2020 Positional Draft Talk - ILB
Posted: 03 Apr 2020 09:44
by BF004
I still think 40 time is near worthless for a ILB and not sure why we still use it.
Unless its like 4.9 +, or sub 4.5, it means next to nothing IMO.
At least use 3 cone or SS.
Even broad or vertical would be a better indication of their acceleration and quickness.
