Packers Huddle

go pak go wrote: ↑

16 Oct 2023 09:57

Papa John wrote: ↑

16 Oct 2023 09:53

go pak go wrote: ↑

16 Oct 2023 09:37

Meaning their defense had to be so freaking good that it literally didn't matter who was at QB. As long as they can take the snap.

This is where you lose me. I don't disagree with most of the names you included in your average QB list. Without having time right now to look up the playoff numbers of those QB's, I would bet that even those guys put up good numbers, were accurate with the football, and did not commit turnovers when it mattered most. In other words, they may have had average careers, but they stepped up and were good during crunch time. Eli Manning is probably the poster child for what I am describing.

You frame it as though any QB with a pulse could have made those machines go and it isn't true. Those QB's deserve more credit than you're giving them.

No. Any QB could have made the 2002 Bucs, 2000 Ravens and 2015 Broncos go. The defenses were that good. Take the snap. Hand it off to Alstott or watch your CB take a pick 6 to the house.

But the others do require competent QB play. Meaning they can move the chains at points during the game. Can be counted on to put up 24 points. Not "bad" or a guy with a pulse but certainly are not in your perinneal MVP top tier QB lineup either.

If only there was a word for someone who is not exceeding the bar, not elevating those around him, but also not a liability...oh wait. There is! It's called Average

Notice that you added the caveat "and not screw things up terribly" to your statement after the fact. I will take that as an admission that I was right, your condescending commentary notwithstanding.

Brad Johnson was 2x Pro Bowl. I even included him on a self-created list called Papa's Unsung Heroes that I made in a post a few years back. And it was for good reason. So you'd better check yourself before talking &%$@.
Trent Dilfer was 1x Pro Bowl and a Sammy Baugh award winner in college. He could throw with accuracy.

I admit that even if you put a &%$@ show of a QB like Johnny Manziel on those Bucs and Ravens teams, they would have been competitive. I don't know that they would have won a Super Bowl.

Labrev wrote: ↑

16 Oct 2023 08:14

He was statistically good those seasons courtesy an exceptional head coach and supporting-cast on offense. A lot of folks back then who are knowledgeable on this stuff said that McVay was holding his hand a lot in how he called the offense.

They traded him away to get Stafford for a reason; you don't ship a good young passer out of town for an aging vet QB with an injury history.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting Goff was an elite quarterback early in his career. But, the Rams received better than average quarterback play from him in 2017 and '18. Actually he ranked sixth in passer rating in those two seasons.

go pak go wrote: ↑

16 Oct 2023 09:37

Jimmy G, Kerry Collins, Jake Delhomme are the epitome of average.

Guys like Brad Jonhson, Trent Dilfer, Osweiler/Manning are below average but still likely in the serviceable category. Meaning their defense had to be so freaking good that it almost didn't matter who was at QB. As long as they can take the snap and not screw things up terribly.

Brad Johnson actually played pretty well in the 2002 season. He actually ranked third in passer rating that season. So, while Johnson was an average quarterback for most of his career the Bucs received really good QB play that season. There's where you make a mistake in evaluating him because of his career numbers.

go pak go wrote: ↑

16 Oct 2023 09:57

No. Any QB could have made the 2002 Bucs, 2000 Ravens and 2015 Broncos go. The defenses were that good. Take the snap. Hand it off to Alstott or watch your CB take a pick 6 to the house.

But the others do require competent QB play. Meaning they can move the chains at points during the game. Can be counted on to put up 24 points. Not "bad" or a guy with a pulse but certainly are not in your perinneal MVP top tier QB lineup either.

The 2015 Broncos defense wasn't actually a historically great defense. A lot of fans believe that to be true because they dominated Newton and the Panthers in the Super Bowl though. As mentioned above the 2002 Bucs received very good quarterback play from an average career QB that season which helped them win the Super Bowl.

Therefore only the 2000 Ravens qualify for a team that would have won with any QB. One out of 44 teams support the notion that that's a rare exception.

Not really news but some interesting comments from Steno on the progress of Musgrave and the young TEs

https://packerswire.usatoday.com/2023/1 ... can-offer/

Coming out of the bye week, Musgrave is third on the team in targets and third on the team in receiving yards. Overall, he has been efficient, catching 18 of the 23 passes thrown his way for 159 yards. But his 8.8 yards per catch ranks 27th out of 45 eligible tight ends.

“It’s just reps,” said offensive coordinator Adam Stenavich. “And the good thing watching, if you go back and watch all five games over the break here, you watch how they’ve (the rookie tight ends) improved and it’s been pretty good. You can see them taking steps forward, especially in the run game. So I’m excited about those guys and how they’ve progressed so far. Obviously is they just keep going we’ll have a pretty good unit eventually.”

I find it hard to believe because this is an NFL head coach but Jason Wilde reported LaFleur doesn’t script his offensive plays.

If true it would make sense why the team does so poorly in the first half this season.

Packers signed James Robinson to the PS.

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑

17 Oct 2023 18:30

Packers signed James Robinson to the PS.

I think that is a sign that Patrick Taylor is done in Green Bay.

Safety Anthony Johnson signed to the PS as well.

BSA wrote: ↑

17 Oct 2023 13:09

Coming out of the bye week, Musgrave is third on the team in targets and third on the team in receiving yards. Overall, he has been efficient, catching 18 of the 23 passes thrown his way for 159 yards. But his 8.8 yards per catch ranks 27th out of 45 eligible tight ends.

“It’s just reps,” said offensive coordinator Adam Stenavich. “And the good thing watching, if you go back and watch all five games over the break here, you watch how they’ve (the rookie tight ends) improved and it’s been pretty good. You can see them taking steps forward, especially in the run game. So I’m excited about those guys and how they’ve progressed so far. Obviously is they just keep going we’ll have a pretty good unit eventually.”

I’d have never guessed James Robinson is only 25 years old. I’d have put him around 28-30, easy.

APB wrote: ↑

17 Oct 2023 19:31

I’d have never guessed James Robinson is only 25 years old. I’d have put him around 28-30, easy.

Is this the James Robinson who played well in like 2020? The guy who slashed our defense on that cold November day?

go pak go wrote: ↑

17 Oct 2023 20:10

APB wrote: ↑

17 Oct 2023 19:31

I’d have never guessed James Robinson is only 25 years old. I’d have put him around 28-30, easy.

Is this the James Robinson who played well in like 2020? The guy who slashed our defense on that cold November day?

The very same.

go pak go wrote: ↑

17 Oct 2023 18:54

I think that is a sign that Patrick Taylor is done in Green Bay.

Possibly.

I think if he is off the team for like 3-5 weeks or something in that area, his PS call ups will reset.

Definitely taking a bit of a gamble if we do want him long term. But just noting that is a possibility.

BF004 wrote: ↑

17 Oct 2023 20:34

go pak go wrote: ↑

17 Oct 2023 18:54

I think that is a sign that Patrick Taylor is done in Green Bay.

Possibly.

I think if he is off the team for like 3-5 weeks or something in that area, his PS call ups will reset.

Definitely taking a bit of a gamble if we do want him long term. But just noting that is a possibility.

I don't see Taylor as a big loss except on ST. And he will be gone after this season no matter what. Packers need to draft a RB and they will.

TheSkeptic wrote: ↑

18 Oct 2023 04:20

I don't see Taylor as a big loss except on ST. And he will be gone after this season no matter what. Packers need to draft a RB and they will.

Taylor only played 30% of the snaps on special teams this season. I don't think he will be greatly missed on those units either.

Robinson had a ruptured Achilles heel a couple years ago. He’s toast. But at least Gutey gives the appearance of trying to support Love and the team. Instead he’s really eyeing those top 5 picks in the 2024 draft.

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑

17 Oct 2023 20:15

go pak go wrote: ↑

17 Oct 2023 20:10

APB wrote: ↑

17 Oct 2023 19:31

I’d have never guessed James Robinson is only 25 years old. I’d have put him around 28-30, easy.

Is this the James Robinson who played well in like 2020? The guy who slashed our defense on that cold November day?

The very same.

I hope he has something left in the tank. Was he a FA?

Drj820 wrote: ↑

15 Oct 2023 12:02

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

15 Oct 2023 11:13

Pugger wrote: ↑

13 Oct 2023 07:27

I was expecting Love to be very up and down this year like most first year starters. I'm not concerned about him yet. Yes, if he is not playing any better in December then we may need to start scouting QBs in the next draft. But 6 total starts for a QB is not enough evidence to determine what we have here.

Sure thing. I remember that Love has as much working against him (stuff that is beyond his own control) as he has going for him. With the turnover on this team, he is fighting an uphill battle to begin. But he's been game so far. I'm actually excited about him. I think we will have him for a while.

And just look at Jared Goff. He had moments earlier in his career. But he's really only blossomed since going to Detroit under Campbell. Now, he's literally a very solid QB. Not really spectacular. Just consistent at doing well enough. And that really works for them. If that's what Love turns out to be, we'll be just fine.

Jared Goff went to the Super Bowl with the Rams

Correct. But he's actually playing better ball (if even only because of consistency) with the Lions.

wallyuwl wrote: ↑

17 Oct 2023 19:12

BSA wrote: ↑

17 Oct 2023 13:09

Coming out of the bye week, Musgrave is third on the team in targets and third on the team in receiving yards. Overall, he has been efficient, catching 18 of the 23 passes thrown his way for 159 yards. But his 8.8 yards per catch ranks 27th out of 45 eligible tight ends.

“It’s just reps,” said offensive coordinator Adam Stenavich. “And the good thing watching, if you go back and watch all five games over the break here, you watch how they’ve (the rookie tight ends) improved and it’s been pretty good. You can see them taking steps forward, especially in the run game. So I’m excited about those guys and how they’ve progressed so far. Obviously is they just keep going we’ll have a pretty good unit eventually.”

There was a long pass that he dropped a couple of weeks ago that would've lengthened his stats a bit too. He's a rookie and baby steps are to be expected, especially since they likely haven't opened the whole playbook to him yet. Plus, has anybody talked about how he's doing at squatting between the soft spots of the zones? That's gonna become a big part of his pass catching.

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

18 Oct 2023 14:57

Drj820 wrote: ↑

15 Oct 2023 12:02

Scott4Pack wrote: ↑

15 Oct 2023 11:13

Sure thing. I remember that Love has as much working against him (stuff that is beyond his own control) as he has going for him. With the turnover on this team, he is fighting an uphill battle to begin. But he's been game so far. I'm actually excited about him. I think we will have him for a while.

And just look at Jared Goff. He had moments earlier in his career. But he's really only blossomed since going to Detroit under Campbell. Now, he's literally a very solid QB. Not really spectacular. Just consistent at doing well enough. And that really works for them. If that's what Love turns out to be, we'll be just fine.

Jared Goff went to the Super Bowl with the Rams

Correct. But he's actually playing better ball (if even only because of consistency) with the Lions.

When the Rams traded him, they made it seem like he was trash. They treated him like trash. But the truth is that they just really wanted Stafford, or thought Stafford could get them over the hump that Goff could not. And thanks to a miracle down in Tampa, they were actually right.

But Goffs actual play was just fine in LA. He was having an above average---but not elite, career.

Just look at the stats. He has always been better than his reputation. And he has won tons of games, in both places.

2017-Yards: 3804, TDs: 28, INTs: 5
2018-Yards: 4688, TDs: 32, INTs: 12
2019: Yards: 4638, TDs: 22, INTs: 16 (i admit, thats way too many INTs)
2020: Yards: 3952, TDs: 20, INTs: 13

Goff threw too many picks sure, but he has always been able to sling it. Goff has always been better than advertised.