Packers Huddle

BSA wrote: ↑

16 Feb 2023 22:09

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

16 Feb 2023 22:01

Humphrey was considered the best C in the draft by nearly everyone. But not the Packers

I remember reading about the reason they made that choice - Myers ability to handle an up- tempo AR offense from the mental POV.
I don't know if Myers is fixable, but the dropoff from Corey Linsley was steeper than it should have been. At one point Steno said he thought Zach Toms' best position would be OC, so maybe we see change going into 2023 .

Humphrey handles one of the most complex offensive schemes in the league with a QN that makes it hard on his lineman by moving all around and improvising.
My memory was the size was the thing; they wanted more of a bully in the run game and thought Myers was still athletic at that size. He just hasn't taken virtually any steps forward.

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

16 Feb 2023 22:01

Drj820 wrote: ↑

16 Feb 2023 19:12

But hey, we had to pay 12 the highest amount in the league and all his unproductive buddies like Cobb, Big dog, and short stick Crosby

Also, man Creed Humphrey is one heck of a center. Super Bowl champ too.

It's really weird that you think a trio of $4 million players are a cap issue and really annoying how often the team raves about how much Lewis brings to the table and how fans continue to act as if he and his role are just taking up space. It's literally the biggest "football IQ red flag" I have in a fan; if you think Marcedes Lewis' contract is some sort of misspent favor to him or to Rodgers, you don't understand football. If you listen to literally everyone who is inside the organization and pay attention to the things he opens up for us, then you are capable of baseline understanding.

But anyway, yes. The issue was drafting Myers over Humphrey. It was a mistake then, it is a mistake now. Foresight, hindsight, in-the-moment-sight. Humphrey was considered the best C in the draft by nearly everyone. But not the Packers. When you're out of step with the consensus, it's great when you're right. But feels like an egregious miss when you're wrong.

Huh. You challenge my football iq and then agree with my football comment? Lol

And yes, dummy me believes $12 million dollars in cap space for 3 old guys, prevents us from spending $12 million dollars elsewhere on the roster.

We had three options.. resign Linsley who loved GB and didn’t wanna leave, draft Myers, or draft Creed Humphrey.

The point of my post saying we could have kept linsley if the Qb didn’t command the most money possible as well as insist on retaining several buddies who take up cap space too.

Big dog is a likable guy, sorry if you think it makes me a football idiot to prefer more production from the TE position or someone younger in that roster spot who can develop. I’m surprised my take makes me such as idiot considering we didn’t make the playoffs this year. If the old man made such a glorious impact, it sure didn’t affect the win loss column enough.

Drj820 wrote: ↑

16 Feb 2023 22:26

Big dog is a likable guy, sorry if you think it makes me a football idiot to prefer more production from the TE position or someone younger in that roster spot who can develop. I’m surprised my take makes me such as idiot considering we didn’t make the playoffs this year. If the old man made such a glorious impact, it sure didn’t affect the win loss column enough.

No one said anything about him being "likable." I'm saying that
a) the role of in-line blocking TE is valuable enough in our system that he plays a ton;
b) being the 6th blocker on a team is a valuable role and veteran back-up tackles routinely make as much as Lewis does at TE with the added bonus that Lewis also can run routes;
c) every single member of the organization praises his IMPACT, not likability, for what he brings to the team, the practices, the film room, etc;
d) your point that a player on a team who didn't make the playoffs must not make an impact re-asserts the comments about your comprehension of the game; and
e) yes, I can doubt your overall ability to weigh what is or isn't important in the game of football with Big Dog comments as a useful litmus test while still agreeing with some of the things you say, without that being any sort of contradiction, and I don't know why that would be difficult to grasp.

The problem with Lewis is that he does not play ST as a 2nd or 3rd TE is supposed to. Don't know if you all remember but a season or 2 ago the Packers had a FG blocked because Tyler Lancaster was expected to block a much smaller and quicker man on the outside, in space. Tyler had no chance. On what planet does a ST coach ask a 300 pound DT to block a 230 pound edge rusher in space while the 2nd TE who is paid to block is on the sidelines?

That is also a problem with the other major member of the Rodgers posse, Randall Cobb. The only thing he can do anymore on ST is fair catch punts. Furthermore, as a WR, he is extremely limited. Being smart and experienced only gets you so far when you are also small and slow and injury prone.

The second problem with both Lewis and Cobb is that their presence limits development of young backups. You can't find the next Keisean Nixon when they don't get snaps and you don't know if a KR or WR can break a tackle based upon practice.

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

16 Feb 2023 22:01

Drj820 wrote: ↑

16 Feb 2023 19:12

But hey, we had to pay 12 the highest amount in the league and all his unproductive buddies like Cobb, Big dog, and short stick Crosby

Also, man Creed Humphrey is one heck of a center. Super Bowl champ too.

It's really weird that you think a trio of $4 million players are a cap issue and really annoying how often the team raves about how much Lewis brings to the table and how fans continue to act as if he and his role are just taking up space. It's literally the biggest "football IQ red flag" I have in a fan; if you think Marcedes Lewis' contract is some sort of misspent favor to him or to Rodgers, you don't understand football. If you listen to literally everyone who is inside the organization and pay attention to the things he opens up for us, then you are capable of baseline understanding.

But anyway, yes. The issue was drafting Myers over Humphrey. It was a mistake then, it is a mistake now. Foresight, hindsight, in-the-moment-sight. Humphrey was considered the best C in the draft by nearly everyone. But not the Packers. When you're out of step with the consensus, it's great when you're right. But feels like an egregious miss when you're wrong.

absolutely, people make comments concerning Lewis that are so out in left field it hardly deserves comment, if ya want to run the ball, and we do, then a TE that does it well should get paid, Lewis is also deceptive, he chips then floats into open space very well.

I think most here favored Humphrey, and where disappointed we took Myers, and where right, hopefully he can play better then he did last year.

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

16 Feb 2023 22:16

BSA wrote: ↑

16 Feb 2023 22:09

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

16 Feb 2023 22:01

Humphrey was considered the best C in the draft by nearly everyone. But not the Packers

I remember reading about the reason they made that choice - Myers ability to handle an up- tempo AR offense from the mental POV.
I don't know if Myers is fixable, but the dropoff from Corey Linsley was steeper than it should have been. At one point Steno said he thought Zach Toms' best position would be OC, so maybe we see change going into 2023 .

Humphrey handles one of the most complex offensive schemes in the league with a QN that makes it hard on his lineman by moving all around and improvising.
My memory was the size was the thing; they wanted more of a bully in the run game and thought Myers was still athletic at that size. He just hasn't taken virtually any steps forward.

I think they saw Myers with a higher ceiling, as well. Unfortunately, I think they misjudged Humphrey's ceiling and Myers' floor.

For those who think Myers is a bust, he graded #5 of 32 in pass blocking last year. He only had 2 penalties all year and 1 was a false start. He was responsible for 1 bad snap. This is as mistake free as a Olineman gets over a full season. Run blocking wasn't great but then the rest of the Oline had a not-so-great season run blocking.

You guys think 12 would have been okay moving to a left handed center?

BF004 wrote: ↑

17 Feb 2023 14:40

You guys think 12 would have been okay moving to a left handed center?

Yeah would just need them left handed footballs

cool interview with TJ Lang

lots of interesting tidbits from TJ on his early career, his off field partying and the SB win
but they also spend some time on Packers-Seattle NFCCG so...be prepared

https://www.golongtd.com/p/happy-hour-r ... mail=false

Amos makes up half that amount.

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑

20 Feb 2023 09:39

Amos makes up half that amount.

Might be slight indication on Packers thoughts on Aaron coming back.

Thinking they might do just enough to keep us all guessing.

Pckfn23 wrote: ↑

20 Feb 2023 09:39

Amos makes up half that amount.

I'd love Lewis back, though Matt Schniedman at The Athletic seems to be resolute that Lewis' decision may depend on Rodgers. If he's acting on intel, who am I to argue; if he's just acting on a hunch, I hope he's wrong.

I also really want Reed back. He was good for us, at a thin position heading into this year, and should be affordable.

The rest can go. I hate dead cap, but it's best to clear the books now with guys who are aging out (I know Lewis is well old but I want him to be in the TE room for the 1-3 rookies we bring in this year)

I know there is an AR thread, but seeing all the old guys who have dead cap and/or are taking up a lot of the cap for their production makes me think we should just blow the whole thing up (including Gute and maybe MLF) and roll with Love. I had been in the camp of bring AR back since he is the team's best chance to get to and make a run in the playoffs. But this team has way too many bad contracts and bad drafts to be a real contender for the NFC for at least 3 years, with AR or without. And AR has underperformed for the most part in the playoffs in recent years. My thoughts before were mostly because I don't think Love is the guy, he reminds me a lot of Tua with a slightly better arm and of course not the concussions.

YoHoChecko wrote: ↑

20 Feb 2023 12:05

If he's acting on intel, who am I to argue; if he's just acting on a hunch, I hope he's wrong.

Schneidman's wrong more often than I'd like for a guy covering the team. I feel like he'd benefit from hanging out with some tuned- in Packer fans because there is so much about this team he just doesn't get, yet. And that's why he's so often " wrong " in his prognostications.

" Green Bay Packers veteran tight end Marcedes Lewis is chasing an NFL record as he enters his 17th season (2022)
Assuming he's on the roster in Week 1, Lewis will tie the record for most seasons played by a tight end, joining Tony Gonzalez and Jason Witten. Lewis would like to continue his career into 2023 to break the record.

"This year, I'll tie the record," Lewis said, via the team's official website. "It would be great to break it and then I would consider, 'OK, I've done that.' Eighteen is kind of bizarre, especially at the tight end position."

I did the introductory offer from the Athletic again, Bruglers draft has us taking that CB sized safety Branch, so imo one of Savage or Amos wont be retained, specially with Ford showing pretty good ability after Savage was moved to the slot, if in fact that is our pick.


he also has 4 QB's going top 10, which will possibly drop one of the top 3 edge rushers to our slot, I hate taking one but our pass rush really struggled last year with out Gary, and it might take him half a season to heal fully, if ya can't pressure the QB these days your toast, doesn't matter how good the secondary is.

I'd like Lewis back to, to bad we got him at the end of his great career, and also want to draft 1, we need what Tonyan provided a couple years ago, Dequara is coming into his own, blocking and receiving, but he's more of a complimentary TE then a guy ya can build the position around

next couple weeks with the combine a week away, Rodgers divulging intentions, should be interesting time frame.

wallyuwl wrote: ↑

20 Feb 2023 12:36

I know there is an AR thread, but seeing all the old guys who have dead cap and/or are taking up a lot of the cap for their production makes me think we should just blow the whole thing up (including Gute and maybe MLF) and roll with Love. I had been in the camp of bring AR back since he is the team's best chance to get to and make a run in the playoffs. But this team has way too many bad contracts and bad drafts to be a real contender for the NFC for at least 3 years, with AR or without. And AR has underperformed for the most part in the playoffs in recent years. My thoughts before were mostly because I don't think Love is the guy, he reminds me a lot of Tua with a slightly better arm and of course not the concussions.

Careful, if you think money for Lewis is better spent elsewhere your football IQ will be questioned.

YohoChecko wrote: I'd love Lewis back…

I hope you get your wish so that, if nothing else, we can all follow along with the ongoing conversations between you, [mention]lupedafiasco[/mention], and [mention]Drj820[/mention] over the wisdom/idiocy of retaining him all off season.

Marcedes Lewis is both cheap AND worth his contract. The HC values him on and off the field and you'd be very hard pressed to find an equivalent blocker in the draft...and you aren't sniffing one in FA for those dollars

Retaining Lewis would is in the wisdom category - especially if you can draft his replacement and give them a season together.

edit

Did a quick look at Big Dogs' recent deal. $$
OTC says his 2022 "value" was $ 3.756M using their formula and that's about what GB paid him. For structure purposes, less in 2021, more in 2022
but it averages out to be in line with what he's being paid. Which is why MLF wants him back- it has nothing to do with who the QB is on Sunday
Lewis is still a good player at a good value for MLF's offense

The Packers are not cheap

https://www.si.com/nfl/packers/news/are ... kers-cheap

The Packers are on course to spend $211.6 million in 2023. That’s the second-most in the league behind the Cleveland Browns, though obviously subject to change based on free agency and the future of Aaron Rodgers.

The Packers have used almost every penny of their past salary caps.
In 2022, they spent all but $1.6 million. That’s about in line with 2021 ($2.9 million) and 2020 ($3.7 million).