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Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 01:43
by TheSkeptic
It was a very enjoyable game to watch. Both teams played with a "refuse to lose" attitude.
It was also a little sad to watch as a Packer fan. Because from a talent standpoint, the Packers are not that far away.
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 04:14
by williewasgreat
The DB even admitted he grabbed the jersey. He hoped it was just not get called. Also, maybe it was his injury but Hurts couldn't throw very far on the hail mary attempt. Why try that if the QB doesn't have to arm to throw that far?
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 07:41
by RingoCStarrQB
Sitting here now wondering when the Chiefs are bringing it to Lambeau. Can imagine a Monday or Thursday nighter.
GO PACK GO!
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 07:46
by Yoop
williewasgreat wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 04:14
The DB even admitted he grabbed the jersey. He hoped it was just not get called. Also, maybe it was his injury but Hurts couldn't throw very far on the hail mary attempt. Why try that if the QB doesn't have to arm to throw that far?
up to that call I thought Philly got away with another non call by a official, Shuster was interfered with on a earlier play, plus the 2 play reviews that went the Eagles way, I thought the fumble that was ruled incomplete was actually a fumble.
other then those 4 or 5 plays I though the refs did a fair job, just a really hard fought game.
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 07:51
by Drj820
TheSkeptic wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 01:43
It was a very enjoyable game to watch. Both teams played with a "refuse to lose" attitude.
It was also a little sad to watch as a Packer fan. Because from a talent standpoint, the Packers are not that far away.
I think it’s about how the pieces are used and roster building. The chiefs don’t have an epic stand up edge rusher, but Chris Jones and Frank Clark at “hand in the dirt” DE will get to the QB. We pay Kenny Clark like he’s a league best, and we get a couple games a year where he is absolutely dominant.
Then the offensive pieces. Like wow. Is Sky Moore, Juju, Toney, and MVS (who was a ghost in the game) better than our guys?
Yes…they are better than our guys.
But also..wow..Andy was dialing up some schemes and plays to make them look good. The Toney and Moore tds were just incredible play designs. I never see us fire anything like that up in big spots. Plus those players are like exactly what they need to do what they wanna do.
Not even sure what we wanna do, or how our personnel shapes what we wanna do.
Idk, I certainly see talent differences in how they knew they needed to work hard to replace Tyreke, and they did that by drafting Moore and letting him take the year to develop (he wasn’t WR1 week 1), they go get Juju who played a huge role in the game, and they trade for Toney who was exactly what they needed for one game…
But really I agree it was also more about how the teams used their talent..and how well coached they were. Great schemes, very little mistakes, very little penalties until the very end. Two great teams!
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 07:58
by go pak go
williewasgreat wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 04:14
The DB even admitted he grabbed the jersey. He hoped it was just not get called. Also, maybe it was his injury but Hurts couldn't throw very far on the hail mary attempt. Why try that if the QB doesn't have to arm to throw that far?
It's the inconsistency I cannot stand. The Bucs did waaaaaay worse to us in the NFC Title Game than that play.
I just hate it for the teams where SB Rings mean everything on legacies, jobs, etc. of how much control the team doesn't have in the outcome.
By the rule it was a flag. But we see that not called 80% of the time in the playoffs.
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 08:08
by Yoop
Drj820 wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 07:51
TheSkeptic wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 01:43
It was a very enjoyable game to watch. Both teams played with a "refuse to lose" attitude.
It was also a little sad to watch as a Packer fan. Because from a talent standpoint, the Packers are not that far away.
I think it’s about how the pieces are used and roster building. The chiefs don’t have an epic stand up edge rusher, but Chris Jones and Frank Clark at “hand in the dirt” DE will get to the QB. We pay Kenny Clark like he’s a league best, and we get a couple games a year where he is absolutely dominant.
Then the offensive pieces. Like wow. Is Sky Moore, Juju, Toney, and MVS (who was a ghost in the game) better than our guys?
Yes…they are better than our guys.
But also..wow..Andy was dialing up some schemes and plays to make them look good. The Toney and Moore tds were just incredible play designs. I never see us fire anything like that up in big spots. Plus those players are like exactly what they need to do what they wanna do.
Not even sure what we wanna do, or how our personnel shapes what we wanna do.
Idk, I certainly see talent differences in how they knew they needed to work hard to replace Tyreke, and they did that by drafting Moore and letting him take the year to develop (he wasn’t WR1 week 1), they go get Juju who played a huge role in the game, and they trade for Toney who was exactly what they needed for one game…
But really I agree it was also more about how the teams used their talent..and how well coached they were. Great schemes, very little mistakes, very little penalties until the very end. Two great teams!
amen, Reid designs mis matches, last night his Motion to 3 on one side drew coverage off Tonny and More for 2 easy TD's, Lafleur has done that to, but usually with less success because we don't sell it as well, and lack the players to pull it off, ya can't use the same players every time, or defenses will see it coming, which has often been why it doesn't work for us.
the Eagles dominated the first half, Hurts and that OL are near unstoppable, KC adjusted at Half time and Reid and Mahomes took the game back, offensive dominance, 2nd highest scoring SB in history, and Raptor is still trying to convince me that defense wins championships
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 08:14
by Yoop
go pak go wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 07:58
williewasgreat wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 04:14
The DB even admitted he grabbed the jersey. He hoped it was just not get called. Also, maybe it was his injury but Hurts couldn't throw very far on the hail mary attempt. Why try that if the QB doesn't have to arm to throw that far?
It's the inconsistency I cannot stand. The Bucs did waaaaaay worse to us in the NFC Title Game than that play.
I just hate it for the teams where SB Rings mean everything on legacies, jobs, etc. of how much control the team doesn't have in the outcome.
By the rule it was a flag. But we see that not called 80% of the time in the playoffs.
GPG that was a good call, he hooked him with a shoulder grab with that right hand and then grabbed the jersey with it when it came off the shoulder, that should get called every time.
prior Shuster was interfered with and no call, it was even more blatent then the one where discussing here.
not to mention that fumble that was called incomplete, or the bobble that was called a catch, so the Eagles got the benefit of a few calls, I thought the officiating was pretty good actually.
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 08:56
by go pak go
Yoop wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 08:14
go pak go wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 07:58
williewasgreat wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 04:14
The DB even admitted he grabbed the jersey. He hoped it was just not get called. Also, maybe it was his injury but Hurts couldn't throw very far on the hail mary attempt. Why try that if the QB doesn't have to arm to throw that far?
It's the inconsistency I cannot stand. The Bucs did waaaaaay worse to us in the NFC Title Game than that play.
I just hate it for the teams where SB Rings mean everything on legacies, jobs, etc. of how much control the team doesn't have in the outcome.
By the rule it was a flag. But we see that not called 80% of the time in the playoffs.
GPG that was a good call, he hooked him with a shoulder grab with that right hand and then grabbed the jersey with it when it came off the shoulder, that should get called every time.
prior Shuster was interfered with and no call, it was even more blatent then the one where discussing here.
not to mention that fumble that was called incomplete, or the bobble that was called a catch, so the Eagles got the benefit of a few calls, I thought the officiating was pretty good actually.
Boy. No wonder you and I disagree on everything.
We watch football and have completely different thoughts.
It was a catch. It was an incomplete and non fumble. And I have zero bias in this game. I could care less. So we just don't agree on squat.
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 09:05
by Yoop
go pak go wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 08:56
Yoop wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 08:14
go pak go wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 07:58
It's the inconsistency I cannot stand. The Bucs did waaaaaay worse to us in the NFC Title Game than that play.
I just hate it for the teams where SB Rings mean everything on legacies, jobs, etc. of how much control the team doesn't have in the outcome.
By the rule it was a flag. But we see that not called 80% of the time in the playoffs.
GPG that was a good call, he hooked him with a shoulder grab with that right hand and then grabbed the jersey with it when it came off the shoulder, that should get called every time.
prior Shuster was interfered with and no call, it was even more blatent then the one where discussing here.
not to mention that fumble that was called incomplete, or the bobble that was called a catch, so the Eagles got the benefit of a few calls, I thought the officiating was pretty good actually.
Boy. No wonder you and I disagree on everything.
We watch football and have completely different thoughts.
It was a catch. It was an incomplete and non fumble. And I have zero bias in this game. I could care less. So we just don't agree on squat.
you defended the penalty, and thought the ref shouldn't have made the call, thats what I disagreed with, the reason we dont agree is I wont give in to your opinion, talk about a thin skin, you simply don't like being told your WRONG.
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 09:31
by go pak go
Yoop wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 09:05
go pak go wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 08:56
Yoop wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 08:14
GPG that was a good call, he hooked him with a shoulder grab with that right hand and then grabbed the jersey with it when it came off the shoulder, that should get called every time.
prior Shuster was interfered with and no call, it was even more blatent then the one where discussing here.
not to mention that fumble that was called incomplete, or the bobble that was called a catch, so the Eagles got the benefit of a few calls, I thought the officiating was pretty good actually.
Boy. No wonder you and I disagree on everything.
We watch football and have completely different thoughts.
It was a catch. It was an incomplete and non fumble. And I have zero bias in this game. I could care less. So we just don't agree on squat.
you defended the penalty, and thought the ref shouldn't have made the call, thats what I disagreed with, the reason we dont agree is I wont give in to your opinion, talk about a thin skin, you simply don't like being told your WRONG.
Wtf?
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 09:36
by Drj820
lol
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 09:47
by Yoop
go pak go wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 09:31
Yoop wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 09:05
go pak go wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 08:56
Boy. No wonder you and I disagree on everything.
We watch football and have completely different thoughts.
It was a catch. It was an incomplete and non fumble. And I have zero bias in this game. I could care less. So we just don't agree on squat.
you defended the penalty, and thought the ref shouldn't have made the call, thats what I disagreed with, the reason we dont agree is I wont give in to your opinion, talk about a thin skin, you simply don't like being told your WRONG.
Wtf?
you take the cake, I simply pointed out it was a proper call, and your opinion was LET THEM PLAY, you want to allow interference?
you said you don't have a horse in the game, yet support the grab,
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 09:49
by Pckfn23
go pak go wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 07:58
It's the inconsistency I cannot stand.
By the rule it was a flag. But we see that not called 80% of the time in the playoffs.
By the above I would say he did not "support the grab," nor does he "want to allow interference."
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 09:52
by Labrev
The DB did by-rule hold (grabbed/tugged a little jersey) on the play, so yes it was technically callable.
But, I do not believe it materially impacted the play. Smith still beat his man and was open, and it did not look like a catchable ball to me even if Smith had not been slowed at all.
In a case like that, it shouldn't be called, IMO.
If they tried to call all instances of that sort of holding/PI, then we would be inundated with flags every game and the sport would be unwatchable. I have seen a few of our games where the ref crew for the game calls everything, and refball is not much fun to watch.
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 09:56
by Yoop
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 09:49
go pak go wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 07:58
It's the inconsistency I cannot stand.
By the rule it was a flag. But we see that not called 80% of the time in the playoffs.
By the above I would say he did not "support the grab," nor does he "want to allow interference."
maybe so, point is it was a penalty and should be called, just as the one earlier that wasn't called, and there was enough doubt on the non fumble and side line bubble to take 5 minutes each to get to a conclusion, first he made the catch, had control and turned to run, then dropped the ball, the sideline bobble was also close, I didn't have a issue with either, but I do with PI.
I think there was also a no call on a Eagles defender jumping the neutral zone, so if anything a few close calls went the Eagles way.
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 10:01
by Yoop
Labrev wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 09:52
The DB did by-rule hold (grabbed/tugged a little jersey) on the play, so yes it was technically callable.
But, I do not believe it materially impacted the play. Smith still beat his man and was open, and it did not look like a catchable ball to me even if Smith had not been slowed at all.
In a case like that, it shouldn't be called, IMO.
If they tried to call all instances of that sort of holding/PI, then we would be inundated with flags every game and the sport would be unwatchable. I have seen a few of our games where the ref crew for the game calls everything, and refball is not much fun to watch.
how could you know that, a grab in that situation slowed Shuster a lot, that play is practiced a lot, Mahomes and Shuster have that timing down pat.
maybe it wouldn't have mattered, but it allowed KC to run down the clock and kick the game winning FG, and only give the Eagles mere seconds to run a play, no one would be arguing this if it wasn't a game deciding penalty.
go rewatch the right hand grab the shoulder first, that stopped Shuster cold, then the hand grabbed the jersey, it's DB football 101, if ya can get away with it, it's a call that should happen every time a ref see's it.
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 10:15
by Pckfn23
Yoop wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 09:56
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 09:49
go pak go wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 07:58
It's the inconsistency I cannot stand.
By the rule it was a flag. But we see that not called 80% of the time in the playoffs.
By the above I would say he did not "support the grab," nor does he "want to allow interference."
maybe so, point is it was a penalty and should be called, just as the one earlier that wasn't called, and there was enough doubt on the non fumble and side line bubble to take 5 minutes each to get to a conclusion, first he made the catch, had control and turned to run, then dropped the ball, the sideline bobble was also close, I didn't have a issue with either, but I do with PI.
I think there was also a no call on a Eagles defender jumping the neutral zone, so if anything a few close calls went the Eagles way.
Those other things are not being disputed. That they are brought up does not really change the one play. No one is saying the Eagles or Chiefs got the benefit of the refs, simply that it was a &%$@ way to end what was a pretty good game, and one that maybe didn't need to happen.
go rewatch the right hand grab the shoulder first, that stopped Shuster cold,
I think you might want to do as you suggest as this description is not accurate. There was a pull on the jersey, but not grab on the shoulder that "stopped Schuster cold."
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 10:17
by Labrev
Yoop wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 10:01
Labrev wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 09:52
The DB did by-rule hold (grabbed/tugged a little jersey) on the play, so yes it was technically callable.
But, I do not believe it materially impacted the play. Smith still beat his man and was open, and it did not look like a catchable ball to me even if Smith had not been slowed at all.
In a case like that, it shouldn't be called, IMO.
If they tried to call all instances of that sort of holding/PI, then we would be inundated with flags every game and the sport would be unwatchable. I have seen a few of our games where the ref crew for the game calls everything, and refball is not much fun to watch.
how could you know that, a grab in that situation slowed Shuster a lot, that play is practiced a lot, Mahomes and Shuster have that timing down pat.
I did not claim to know. I said I "believe" it was impactful and that it did not "look" (to me) impactful. It's an opinion.
maybe it wouldn't have mattered, but it allowed KC to run down the clock and kick the game winning FG, and only give the Eagles mere seconds to run a play, no one would be arguing this if it wasn't a game deciding penalty.
Yeah, that's the whole problem.
Re: Super Bowl LVII
Posted: 13 Feb 2023 10:24
by Yoop
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 10:15
Yoop wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 09:56
Pckfn23 wrote: ↑13 Feb 2023 09:49
By the above I would say he did not "support the grab," nor does he "want to allow interference."
maybe so, point is it was a penalty and should be called, just as the one earlier that wasn't called, and there was enough doubt on the non fumble and side line bubble to take 5 minutes each to get to a conclusion, first he made the catch, had control and turned to run, then dropped the ball, the sideline bobble was also close, I didn't have a issue with either, but I do with PI.
I think there was also a no call on a Eagles defender jumping the neutral zone, so if anything a few close calls went the Eagles way.
Those other things are not being disputed. That they are brought up does not really change the one play. No one is saying the Eagles or Chiefs got the benefit of the refs, simply that it was a &%$@ way to end what was a pretty good game, and one that maybe didn't need to happen.
go rewatch the right hand grab the shoulder first, that stopped Shuster cold,
I think you might want to do as you suggest as this description is not accurate. There was a pull on the jersey, but not grab on the shoulder that "stopped Schuster cold."
ya it is, here you are again telling me your version which is wrong, the right hand hooked the shoulder of Shuster, then slid down and grabbed the jersey, thats classic PI, I did it often when I played, it's a tech every DB learns, as the DB said, I did it and hoped I wouldn't get caught.