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Hahaha, Martinez is complaining that he was told to read the play and rely on instincts instead of being told exactly what to do each down. Ok, buddy; we agree, that didn't work out... but it's a knock on him, not on the defense asking him to do so.
Isn't it something when a guy complains about playing to his instincts? Maybe he realizes that they aren't really very good.
haha that is a good point. When i first read blakes comments i was like...geez Pettine must just hate positionally true ILBs, but then i realized Pettine was giving Blake the best gift of all to a good ILB. "Hey man, we dont need you to go attack anyone spot, just be a ILB and go whereever the play goes and make the tackle". Kenny Clark probably helped him be able to do that clogging up so many interior holes. But thats exactly what a good ILB with instincts would want, not be tied down with an anchor watching one gap, but be free to attack any to go make a play. Blakes comments actually make him look like he needs to be overcoached and he lacks instints to play free and make plays. (which i guess we all knew anyways, so maybe pettine should have adjusted, and should have overcoached him?)
The perception and the reality of Aaron Rodgers' contract...
Hermy and others Russ Ball love is goofy. Russ has a job, and he is good at it. Most teams have a Russ Ball and they are decent at it. Its not like we ask Russ to do insane amounts of magic like the Eagles cap boy does every year, by bringing in FAs that it makes no sense they should be able to afford, yet they do.
For years Ball just had to keep the players that we drafted and not even factor in many FAs, and he still lost some over the years. I like Ball, and i think he is good at his job, but "russ ball magic" talk is overblown to me. Lets see how much abra ca da bra he has in stock over the next couple years when we actually have FAs getting paid, plus guys we drafted that need taken care of.
I agree there, the love for Ball seems crazy sometimes.
I mean he drafts contracts, at the instruction of Gute, and working with the players agents, to find the common ground that works best for both parties.
I'm sure he does very good consultation with Gute, LaFleur and Murphy about what we can do, what we should do, and what our multi-year outlook is, and hopefully some positional forecasting for future years.
Not saying he isn't good, he's been in his role for a very long time and I"m sure he's great at what he does. But I agree, he isn't doing anything magical. Was probably incredible easy (relative to other teams) to work under Ted Thompson for so long where it was the team's MO to basically never kick the can down the road and rely on accounting gimmicks.
This is not Russ Ball slander, I think he is very very good at what he does, but he doesn't deserve the cult following he has.
I mean how awesome and easy was that?!!! I snipped the spotrac table, uploaded it with the imgur button and posted! Took 45 seconds!
I think this shows how bad our cap situation really is. Rodgers is CHEAP this year, and we still have no money to really upgrade the team this offseason. We still need to resign K Clark, and have a ton of in house guys who need deals..all while Rodgers cap number is set to really explode. Im wondering out loud if Preston is going to be moved after this season for cap purposes, if he is...one would think the number 12 pick in the draft should be ready to replace him
The problem with giving a 2nd level LB free reign and limited gap responsibility upfront is that the LB is almost never going to get TFLs and most tackles are going to be 2+ yards downfield. If they responsibility is mop up duty, they can't commit too soon or it is a huge gain. This is regardless of who the LB is, especially in a system where there is only 1 2nd level LB.
Palmy - "Very few have the ability to truly excel regardless of system. For many the system is the difference between being just a guy or an NFL starter. Fact is, everyone is talented at this level."
I don't know, I just don't think its that dire. Extensions for Bak and Clark could, and will probably need to, reduce their cap numbers next year. We can also kick the proverbial can with Rodgers as many times as we need to. Every year for seemingly the past decade its been, "Look at New Orleans, they have no cap space because of Brees, LOLZ!!" and then they adjust his contract to kick the cap hit down the road and make the moves they need to remain competitive.
I also do wonder about Preston Smith. If Gary really comes on strong, it might force their hand, but it would be an unpopular move in the locker room, so I would tend to bet against it. Eventually life is going to go back to normal, new TV deals will cause a cap spike, and we will be just fine.
The problem with giving a 2nd level LB free reign and limited gap responsibility upfront is that the LB is almost never going to get TFLs and most tackles are going to be 2+ yards downfield. If they responsibility is mop up duty, they can't commit too soon or it is a huge gain. This is regardless of who the LB is, especially in a system where there is only 1 2nd level LB.
Yeah i like your last point about in a system with only one ILB. I guess that is why almost every other team for the history of football has had 2 lol. Ideally you would send one through gaps and to blow stuff up, while the other is almost a safety up close to the LOS, roaming and causing havoc.
No matter how you think of Marty (my opinion of him declined through the year), one cant deny he was asked to do ALOT. so much, that even though he didnt do it great, not many could do better. Will be interesting to see how he looks in New York.
Last edited by Drj820 on 31 Mar 2020 08:57, edited 1 time in total.
The problem with giving a 2nd level LB free reign and limited gap responsibility upfront is that the LB is almost never going to get TFLs and most tackles are going to be 2+ yards downfield. If they responsibility is mop up duty, they can't commit too soon or it is a huge gain. This is regardless of who the LB is, especially in a system where there is only 1 2nd level LB.
Its a trade off. Your TFL's will come from your guys up front. The issue is our second level tackles are not often enough coming close to the 2 yards you mentioned... too often is 5, 6, 7 yards down the field.
I mean how awesome and easy was that?!!! I snipped the spotrac table, uploaded it with the imgur button and posted! Took 45 seconds!
I think this shows how bad our cap situation really is. Rodgers is CHEAP this year, and we still have no money to really upgrade the team this offseason. We still need to resign K Clark, and have a ton of in house guys who need deals..all while Rodgers cap number is set to really explode. Im wondering out loud if Preston is going to be moved after this season for cap purposes, if he is...one would think the number 12 pick in the draft should be ready to replace him
First we need to know what our actual cap situation is in 2021. Just knowing Rodgers' cap number relative to the other signed QBs in 2021, doesn't tell us much other than we are paying a large amount to a QB.
This is what we really need to know to determine how good or bad our cap situation is: https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/cap/2021/
We are 25th in cap space and 22nd in players signed. It's not a great situation, but I wouldn't call it bad or dire. Paying a QB that much makes it VERY tough to address much in free agency. Rodgers accounts for 1/5th of our current cap already spent in 2021.
Palmy - "Very few have the ability to truly excel regardless of system. For many the system is the difference between being just a guy or an NFL starter. Fact is, everyone is talented at this level."
The problem with giving a 2nd level LB free reign and limited gap responsibility upfront is that the LB is almost never going to get TFLs and most tackles are going to be 2+ yards downfield. If they responsibility is mop up duty, they can't commit too soon or it is a huge gain. This is regardless of who the LB is, especially in a system where there is only 1 2nd level LB.
Yeah i like your last point about in a system with only one ILB. I guess that is why almost every other team for the history of football has had 2 lol. Ideally you would send one through gaps and to blow stuff up, while the other is almost a safety up close to the LOS, roaming and causing havoc.
No matter how you think of Marty (my opinion of him declined through the year), one cant deny he was asked to do ALOT. so much, that even though he didnt do it great, not many could do better. Will be interesting to see how he looks in New York.
asked to do to much????? to me he was asked to do to little, I could train a german shepard to stand pat in the center of the hashes and attack anyone that went past the los with a ball in there hand well maybe I couldn't train one with my advancing years and declining patience but maybe you could
Haha said it best after he left, which was something to the affect he was asked to play like a robot, I think once you start stripping away at a players instincts thats the result you end up with, it's a form of tentivness that just naturally sets in, imho thats what we seen with a few players, and Martinez was one of em.
lots of teams lack a quality ILB2 and use a hybrid safety instead, it's either that or watch as QB's pick your under belly apart.
With Allison gone, I would be floored if we didn't go WR in the first round.
Funchess basically replaces Geronimo. I don't think either move changes the plan that much. I don't see WR a guarantee in the 1st.
It will depend upon if a WR is the BPA when we pick at #30 (or at least I hope this is Gute's strategy). Fortunately this is a pretty deep WR class so we should be able to find a good one in a later round.
Haha played 1 year under Pettine and played poorly at that. Now he is on to his 3rd team in 3 years. I am not sure taking his word for it means a whole lot.
Which teams lack a quality ILB2 and use a hybrid safety instead?
Palmy - "Very few have the ability to truly excel regardless of system. For many the system is the difference between being just a guy or an NFL starter. Fact is, everyone is talented at this level."
Hahaha, Martinez is complaining that he was told to read the play and rely on instincts instead of being told exactly what to do each down. Ok, buddy; we agree, that didn't work out... but it's a knock on him, not on the defense asking him to do so.
I thought the same thing when I just read his statements. It appears he might not have the natural instincts to play the position that Pettine wants his LBers to do.
The problem with giving a 2nd level LB free reign and limited gap responsibility upfront is that the LB is almost never going to get TFLs and most tackles are going to be 2+ yards downfield. If they responsibility is mop up duty, they can't commit too soon or it is a huge gain. This is regardless of who the LB is, especially in a system where there is only 1 2nd level LB.
Yeah i like your last point about in a system with only one ILB. I guess that is why almost every other team for the history of football has had 2 lol. Ideally you would send one through gaps and to blow stuff up, while the other is almost a safety up close to the LOS, roaming and causing havoc.
No matter how you think of Marty (my opinion of him declined through the year), one cant deny he was asked to do ALOT. so much, that even though he didnt do it great, not many could do better. Will be interesting to see how he looks in New York.
asked to do to much????? to me he was asked to do to little, I could train a german shepard to stand pat in the center of the hashes and attack anyone that went past the los with a ball in there hand well maybe I couldn't train one with my advancing years and declining patience but maybe you could
Haha said it best after he left, which was something to the affect he was asked to play like a robot, I think once you start stripping away at a players instincts thats the result you end up with, it's a form of tentivness that just naturally sets in, imho thats what we seen with a few players, and Martinez was one of em.
lots of teams lack a quality ILB2 and use a hybrid safety instead, it's either that or watch as QB's pick your under belly apart.
Ugh yeah, when you are one ILB and have no helper beside you...you are being asked to do alot. Irregardless of how well you do what you are asked. One man, filling two spots is asking alot.
Yeah i like your last point about in a system with only one ILB. I guess that is why almost every other team for the history of football has had 2 lol. Ideally you would send one through gaps and to blow stuff up, while the other is almost a safety up close to the LOS, roaming and causing havoc.
No matter how you think of Marty (my opinion of him declined through the year), one cant deny he was asked to do ALOT. so much, that even though he didnt do it great, not many could do better. Will be interesting to see how he looks in New York.
asked to do to much????? to me he was asked to do to little, I could train a german shepard to stand pat in the center of the hashes and attack anyone that went past the los with a ball in there hand well maybe I couldn't train one with my advancing years and declining patience but maybe you could
Haha said it best after he left, which was something to the affect he was asked to play like a robot, I think once you start stripping away at a players instincts thats the result you end up with, it's a form of tentivness that just naturally sets in, imho thats what we seen with a few players, and Martinez was one of em.
lots of teams lack a quality ILB2 and use a hybrid safety instead, it's either that or watch as QB's pick your under belly apart.
Ugh yeah, when you are one ILB and have no helper beside you...you are being asked to do alot. Irregardless of how well you do what you are asked. One man, filling two spots is asking alot.
he wasn't alone, he had either another ILB, with Goodson, Burks, or he had a safety playing the ILB 2 roll next to him.
as to the comments about Dix, Chicago let him go because of cap issues, Dix played just about as well as Amos did for us, and his reference may not of been as much about Pettine as it was about the prior guy everyone here likes to hate on to.
asked to do to much????? to me he was asked to do to little, I could train a german shepard to stand pat in the center of the hashes and attack anyone that went past the los with a ball in there hand well maybe I couldn't train one with my advancing years and declining patience but maybe you could
Haha said it best after he left, which was something to the affect he was asked to play like a robot, I think once you start stripping away at a players instincts thats the result you end up with, it's a form of tentivness that just naturally sets in, imho thats what we seen with a few players, and Martinez was one of em.
lots of teams lack a quality ILB2 and use a hybrid safety instead, it's either that or watch as QB's pick your under belly apart.
Ugh yeah, when you are one ILB and have no helper beside you...you are being asked to do alot. Irregardless of how well you do what you are asked. One man, filling two spots is asking alot.
he wasn't alone, he had either another ILB, with Goodson, Burks, or he had a safety playing the ILB 2 roll next to him.
as to the comments about Dix, Chicago let him go because of cap issues, Dix played just about as well as Amos did for us, and his reference may not of been as much about Pettine as it was about the prior guy everyone here likes to hate on to.
Haha actually loved Dom and spoke out against his firing.
Im sure the bears cap situation made resigning Haha difficult, but if you cant make room for a guy for a one year 4m dollar deal...no matter your cap situation, you just dont think very highly of him.
Blake did have Goodson next to him SOME, not much, but some...Oren helped him out to the tune of 7 solo tackles in 2019. Big help.
I’m actually a pretty big fan of haha the person. Seems like a cool guy with his head on straight. Won’t hear me bad mouth him on that front.
However, his play is mediocre at best and his effort level at times was an embarrassment. He made the business decision not to try to make tackles in meaningless games, I feel like that killed his confidence.
well maybe I couldn't train one with my advancing years and declining patience but maybe you could 
