General Packers News 2020

[NCF]

I personally think it comes down to whether or not the OL comes to play. If they get punched in the mouth, can get any consistent run with no extras on the box and can’t consistently block a 4 man rush, everything goes to hell no matter who is at WR or RB.

After the dust settled, a lot of metrics showed our line played pretty well in Tampa, so I agree to a degree with what you are saying, but it's not a perfect correlation, either. Tampa really targeted our RB's in pass protection. I think it was a scheme issue more than being out-physicalled, which is good, because I think last year, it was the latter.

[Pckfn23]

Here comes an unpopular take...

The improvement of the offense with Adams out doesn't happen because Adams makes our offense worse, it happens because we look his way too often and don't play within the offense enough. When Adams can feast on poor DBs, it all looks fine, but when we lineup against a good defense, this backfires. Absolutely should one of the best receivers in the game be a focal point of the passing game, but we need to be able to adapt when he becomes the focus of a good defense's coverage. We have other good weapons on the football team: Jones, Williams, Tonyan, Lazard. We need to be OK with not feeding Adams the ball and taking what the defense gives us.

Why this after a good road win? Some things still happened yesterday that were concerning. Looking for the big play too often. Getting happy feet. Slightly off target throws (can be attributed to happy feet). Rodgers had some AWESOME throws yesterday, especially the dime to Adams on 3rd down. It would be interesting to see that throw. Getting Lazard back will help immensely. Getting Ervin back will help too. I think we need to make him our slot.

I don't think that's an unpopular take at all. I mostly agree with it.

Where I think this offense runs into trouble is related to a comment I heard while watching the Chargers-Jaguars game yesterday. They were speaking about Keenan Allen and all the targets he gets from Herbert (who is fantastic, btw). James Lofton, the color commentator, responded with (paraphrasing) "there's really nothing wrong with it when the player is as talented as Allen. When I look at game tape of him, he's open like 80% of the time so why wouldn't Herbert continue to target him?"

I think Rodgers sees the same thing in Adams. He gets open despite the coverage attention he gets. That, and Rodgers clearly has total and full trust in Adams' ability to win a contested ball. I'd even go so far to say he has more faith in Adams to win a contested ball over any of the other WRs on the roster ability to catch a clean ball.

And there is the rub with the whole thing. There are times/games where Adams isn't open because a team takes him out of the game. This is where we run into trouble because we aren't willing to let them and take those 1 on 1s they other guys will win. Instead we tend to force the ball his way. We need to be ok with letting Adams draw double coverage and getting the ball to other players. Rodgers should have full confidence in Adams, but the passing offense shouldn't fall apart if the ball can't get into his hands. I think that has happened, to an extent, in our last 2 losses.

[Pckfn23]

I personally think it comes down to whether or not the OL comes to play. If they get punched in the mouth, can get any consistent run with no extras on the box and can’t consistently block a 4 man rush, everything goes to hell no matter who is at WR or RB.

Definitely part of the equation. I think the QB play, of years past, reared its head again.

So what can we do to combat that? I would say go full Time Brady mode and get that ball out quick.

[BF004]

[Christo]

If we add something, I'm stuck in groundhog day mode wanting one WR...

The WRs we have are fine while a game is close and we can ease their burden by threatening with the run and flexing RBs out. But I have zero faith in anyone but Adams to get open and catch the ball if we happen to fall behind, the D no longer worries about the run, and the WRs have to start making tougher plays.

On DL, Monty and Keke have started to make plays. Even Lowry wasn't bad last night. I mean, if we can get Watt for peanuts, it would be cool. But I'd rather add an ILB or CB rather than another big OLB/DE.

No way the Packers can afford to pay Watts. As for receiver's, Jon Ross is available. He has the speed that this team lacks. He has been a letdown, but the MVS play has been a huge disappointment. A day three pick might get him, and with the Pack getting some compensation picks next year, it might be a good gamble.

[Cdragon]

If we add something, I'm stuck in groundhog day mode wanting one WR...

The WRs we have are fine while a game is close and we can ease their burden by threatening with the run and flexing RBs out. But I have zero faith in anyone but Adams to get open and catch the ball if we happen to fall behind, the D no longer worries about the run, and the WRs have to start making tougher plays.

On DL, Monty and Keke have started to make plays. Even Lowry wasn't bad last night. I mean, if we can get Watt for peanuts, it would be cool. But I'd rather add an ILB or CB rather than another big OLB/DE.

No way the Packers can afford to pay Watts. As for receiver's, Jon Ross is available. He has the speed that this team lacks. He has been a letdown, but the MVS play has been a huge disappointment. A day three pick might get him, and with the Pack getting some compensation picks next year, it might be a good gamble.

Does he have hands?

[Christo]

If we add something, I'm stuck in groundhog day mode wanting one WR...

The WRs we have are fine while a game is close and we can ease their burden by threatening with the run and flexing RBs out. But I have zero faith in anyone but Adams to get open and catch the ball if we happen to fall behind, the D no longer worries about the run, and the WRs have to start making tougher plays.

On DL, Monty and Keke have started to make plays. Even Lowry wasn't bad last night. I mean, if we can get Watt for peanuts, it would be cool. But I'd rather add an ILB or CB rather than another big OLB/DE.

No way the Packers can afford to pay Watts. As for receiver's, Jon Ross is available. He has the speed that this team lacks. He has been a letdown, but the MVS play has been a huge disappointment. A day three pick might get him, and with the Pack getting some compensation picks next year, it might be a good gamble.

Does he have hands?

Well, we know MVS doesn't. As for Ross, at least he has the speed this team needs. Nobody is giving away top flight receivers for chump change. A low risk move like Ross may pay off, if not, is he any worse than MVS?

[paco]

Jamaal is great.

[paco]

[Cdragon]

No way the Packers can afford to pay Watts. As for receiver's, Jon Ross is available. He has the speed that this team lacks. He has been a letdown, but the MVS play has been a huge disappointment. A day three pick might get him, and with the Pack getting some compensation picks next year, it might be a good gamble.

Does he have hands?

Well, we know MVS doesn't. As for Ross, at least he has the speed this team needs. Nobody is giving away top flight receivers for chump change. A low risk move like Ross may pay off, if not, is he any worse than MVS?

But if he has worse hands than MVS, almost an impossibilty, we risk slipping back into the bombs away big play MM philosophy. We are now in an O that is diverse and builds into the big play by mixing it up and moving the chains. We control the clock and keep our D off the field. If we slip back into the 3 deep shots and out we are in trouble.

[texas]

Here comes an unpopular take...

The improvement of the offense with Adams out doesn't happen because Adams makes our offense worse, it happens because we look his way too often and don't play within the offense enough. When Adams can feast on poor DBs, it all looks fine, but when we lineup against a good defense, this backfires. Absolutely should one of the best receivers in the game be a focal point of the passing game, but we need to be able to adapt when he becomes the focus of a good defense's coverage. We have other good weapons on the football team: Jones, Williams, Tonyan, Lazard. We need to be OK with not feeding Adams the ball and taking what the defense gives us.

Why this after a good road win? Some things still happened yesterday that were concerning. Looking for the big play too often. Getting happy feet. Slightly off target throws (can be attributed to happy feet). Rodgers had some AWESOME throws yesterday, especially the dime to Adams on 3rd down. It would be interesting to see that throw. Getting Lazard back will help immensely. Getting Ervin back will help too. I think we need to make him our slot.

I agree with everyone. This is not an unpopular take; it's mostly correct imo. Rodgers has done this throughout his career. I want to say the first instance of this was with Jermichael Finley? And then he went out and Rodgers was forced to spread it around more and we magically won more.

[texas]

I personally think it comes down to whether or not the OL comes to play. If they get punched in the mouth, can get any consistent run with no extras on the box and can’t consistently block a 4 man rush, everything goes to hell no matter who is at WR or RB.

After the dust settled, a lot of metrics showed our line played pretty well in Tampa, so I agree to a degree with what you are saying, but it's not a perfect correlation, either. Tampa really targeted our RB's in pass protection. I think it was a scheme issue more than being out-physicalled, which is good, because I think last year, it was the latter.

I mentioned it before but TB does not scare me the way SF did last year. I was on record saying last year after the 1st SF game that we had better hope we don't run into them in the playoffs because we would have no hope. This year's TB team is not that. They are not the type of team that historically wallops us in the playoffs. I think their closest similarity is actually that 2015 AZ Cardinals team which crushed us at the end of the regular season but then we took them to OT in the playoff rematch. They were also a Bruce Arians team with an old veteran QB and plenty of passing game weapons (although nowhere near what TB12 has now). I think that 2015 had more flaws than this team does, and that was the beginning of Rodgers' downslide whereas I really do think this 2020 Rodgers is the good Rodgers again.

Arians seems to know how to beat Rodgers, but he doesn't totally shut us down like other teams have. Rodgers has trouble when teams get pressure with their front 4 and drop all DBs into coverage. TB has dominant ILBs. Also Rodgers has never played well in Tampa. And I think the 2 consecutive picks basically shellshocked him but I don't think that will happen again. We were kicking their ass for 1 quarter. This team still has the DNA of someone who can quickly become rattled, which is bad, but it's not entirely evident to me that we will ever reach that point like it was evident with a SF rematch last season.

[Christo]

Does he have hands?

Well, we know MVS doesn't. As for Ross, at least he has the speed this team needs. Nobody is giving away top flight receivers for chump change. A low risk move like Ross may pay off, if not, is he any worse than MVS?

But if he has worse hands than MVS, almost an impossibilty, we risk slipping back into the bombs away big play MM philosophy. We are now in an O that is diverse and builds into the big play by mixing it up and moving the chains. We control the clock and keep our D off the field. If we slip back into the 3 deep shots and out we are in trouble.

I really doubt this team is going to start to bomb it all day long just because they have a fast receiver. It's going to take a few weeks just to get someone like Ross on the same page as Rodgers. Which means lots of simple routes/crossing patterns. Maybe a few end arounds.
They don't go deep with MVS all that much. But it would be a nice change of pace to have somebody who can smoke past a defender.
As for his hands, I'm sure the Pack would do they're homework and make sure he can do the job.

Not saying Ross is the only one who can help [ if he can ] but pretty sure some good players are available and can be had at a bargain price. Everyone talks about the smaller cap next year, well that applies to just about every team next year. Might have lots of cost cutting in the next few days.

[go pak go]

Here comes an unpopular take...

The improvement of the offense with Adams out doesn't happen because Adams makes our offense worse, it happens because we look his way too often and don't play within the offense enough. When Adams can feast on poor DBs, it all looks fine, but when we lineup against a good defense, this backfires. Absolutely should one of the best receivers in the game be a focal point of the passing game, but we need to be able to adapt when he becomes the focus of a good defense's coverage. We have other good weapons on the football team: Jones, Williams, Tonyan, Lazard. We need to be OK with not feeding Adams the ball and taking what the defense gives us.

Why this after a good road win? Some things still happened yesterday that were concerning. Looking for the big play too often. Getting happy feet. Slightly off target throws (can be attributed to happy feet). Rodgers had some AWESOME throws yesterday, especially the dime to Adams on 3rd down. It would be interesting to see that throw. Getting Lazard back will help immensely. Getting Ervin back will help too. I think we need to make him our slot.

This should not be an unpopular take because it is true. We have been bringing this up for the last 3 years and we currently have a space where we can discuss this without significant angry tangent posts about lack of WRs talent that then turns into it was always poor scheme etc.

There was some telling things yesterday from the game that are concerning.

1. You could tell to start the game that Rodgers had zero faith in his line. I mean if it was 3 and 7+, that ball was being thrown out of bounce after a 4 step drop. We just weren't going to attempt anything even though the line held well. I think we noticed improvement from Rodgers once he realized his tackles were doing a good job. So it started off concerning but then turned not concerning.

2. Man he is having some accuracy issues again. He's turning in some old habits of not getting those feet set. The worst two by far was the play to Tunyan and Adams. He was able to redeem himself with Adams on the following play but that Tonyan miss throw left points off the board. If that ball was on the money, I'm pretty sure Big Bob takes it to the house.

3. MVS. Yeah the ball was maybe outside of your catch radius but dude. You got to make those plays. If you want to stick around as a Packer, you need to take advantage of these opportunities and he as done nothing but show he is even more ineffective when we need him most. That drop on that 3rd and 10 curl route was a back killer for him. He has been doing this the last 3 to 4 weeks of just doing nothing and it's going to put him in irrelevancy land soon.

[BSA]

3. MVS. Yeah the ball was maybe outside of your catch radius but dude. You got to make those plays. If you want to stick around as a Packer, you need to take advantage of these opportunities and he as done nothing but show he is even more ineffective when we need him most. That drop on that 3rd and 10 curl route was a back killer for him.

On the one pass, when he fired his hands out to catch it, his hands missed the ball. It was weird to see that
Similar thing happened when he dropped that bomb on the 1st play of the game vs Chicago last year- his hands missed. So either its a concentration issue or an eyesight issue - but somebody has to look into it a bit deeper. It kinda reminded me of some of the James Jones drops years ago.

[Drj820]

I saw somebody tweeted that there was a reason MVS was only a 5th rounder after checking every box with ease In the areas of size, speed, and other measurables. He just isn’t a natural receiver. Doesn’t control his body well, doesn’t track a ball well, straight line speed, but doesn’t appear “quick”.

[Drj820]

Here comes an unpopular take...

The improvement of the offense with Adams out doesn't happen because Adams makes our offense worse, it happens because we look his way too often and don't play within the offense enough. When Adams can feast on poor DBs, it all looks fine, but when we lineup against a good defense, this backfires. Absolutely should one of the best receivers in the game be a focal point of the passing game, but we need to be able to adapt when he becomes the focus of a good defense's coverage. We have other good weapons on the football team: Jones, Williams, Tonyan, Lazard. We need to be OK with not feeding Adams the ball and taking what the defense gives us.

Why this after a good road win? Some things still happened yesterday that were concerning. Looking for the big play too often. Getting happy feet. Slightly off target throws (can be attributed to happy feet). Rodgers had some AWESOME throws yesterday, especially the dime to Adams on 3rd down. It would be interesting to see that throw. Getting Lazard back will help immensely. Getting Ervin back will help too. I think we need to make him our slot.

This should not be an unpopular take because it is true. We have been bringing this up for the last 3 years and we currently have a space where we can discuss this without significant angry tangent posts about lack of WRs talent that then turns into it was always poor scheme etc.

There was some telling things yesterday from the game that are concerning.

1. You could tell to start the game that Rodgers had zero faith in his line. I mean if it was 3 and 7+, that ball was being thrown out of bounce after a 4 step drop. We just weren't going to attempt anything even though the line held well. I think we noticed improvement from Rodgers once he realized his tackles were doing a good job. So it started off concerning but then turned not concerning.

2. Man he is having some accuracy issues again. He's turning in some old habits of not getting those feet set. The worst two by far was the play to Tunyan and Adams. He was able to redeem himself with Adams on the following play but that Tonyan miss throw left points off the board. If that ball was on the money, I'm pretty sure Big Bob takes it to the house.

3. MVS. Yeah the ball was maybe outside of your catch radius but dude. You got to make those plays. If you want to stick around as a Packer, you need to take advantage of these opportunities and he as done nothing but show he is even more ineffective when we need him most. That drop on that 3rd and 10 curl route was a back killer for him. He has been doing this the last 3 to 4 weeks of just doing nothing and it's going to put him in irrelevancy land soon.

As for Rodgers accuracy, I think Rodgers is at that age where he hates getting hit. To the point where it is in his head. No one likes getting hit, but the young QBs know it’s just part of the game. QBs hit a certain age and it sticks in their mind and they do whatever they Can to avoid it...for Rodgers I think this plays out as throwing the ball away quickly, and getting gun shy in the pocket and being inaccurate bc his mind is thinking about the hit he about to take and not the throw.

This is detrimental to a degree, but on the other hand I am glad Rodgers has matured to the point where he isn’t just taking unnecessary shots trying to he Houdini and then getting himself hurt. For a couple seasons he would try to outrun linebackers like he was 24, get pelted, and end up with an injury.

[YoHoChecko]

The Packers are bringing in veteran WR Seth Roberts, who was released by the Panthers earlier today. A source said the plan is to sign him to the practice squad initially. Roberts has 183 career receptions (15 TDs) for the Raiders, Ravens and Panthers. He played in all seven of Carolina's games this year with just four catches for 31 yards.

[Christo]

3. MVS. Yeah the ball was maybe outside of your catch radius but dude. You got to make those plays. If you want to stick around as a Packer, you need to take advantage of these opportunities and he as done nothing but show he is even more ineffective when we need him most. That drop on that 3rd and 10 curl route was a back killer for him.

On the one pass, when he fired his hands out to catch it, his hands missed the ball. It was weird to see that
Similar thing happened when he dropped that bomb on the 1st play of the game vs Chicago last year- his hands missed. So either its a concentration issue or an eyesight issue - but somebody has to look into it a bit deeper. It kinda reminded me of some of the James Jones drops years ago.

This is about the same time last year when MVS began to disappear. Not sure why he's dropping balls that are in both of his hands. Beginning to think he's a very low confidence guy who can't shake off a drop.
As for the Jones comparison, by year 3, Jones a solid receiver.
A healthy EQ would be nice. If anything, just to find out what he can do.

[Labrev]

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